A few questions about VY Canis Majoris.

VY Canis Majoris is the biggest known star at this point in our knowledge of the cosmos.
I will post this video for those of you who don't yet understand just how big VY Canis Majoris really is. When compared to our star the sun.


Okay so now that we have covered that. And we can understand just how huge VY Canis Majoris is..
This is my question.

Would a star this size naturally have extreamly large planets?

And would these planets hold life relative to the size of this nature?

Such as, would Canis Majoris have planets going around its orbit that would be X100 times larger than our star the sun?

And if this was true.. Then just think.. If there where humanoid type beings on these planets we would consider them to be Titans..

These beings would be so big to us. We would be smaller than insects to them. And if they had insects on those planets.. They would be the size of our moon! And we would be like the size of germs to them.
Just one of these beings could be the size of our Earth..
And they go about their days looking into the cosmos as we do. Yet they look at it from a different point of veiw. From their size.
How different the universe might seem to beings from such large stars?

And just how small might they be compared to other stars we have not even found yet.
Or stars that are soooo Huge, that we can not even detect them because of their massive size.

You can not see the forest from the trees.
Yet we humans have come a long ways.. Only to find out.. We have so much further to go.. So much further to the point.. We might as well admit that we will never know all there is to know about our universe..

But its always fun to keep thinking like this.. And asking BIG questions..

What are your feelings and thoughts..

My very first thought on this is "sheesh, could you imagine how long a year would last around that star?"

As to your query, I would not think that the size of the star would necessarily relate to the size of the planets or beings. I tend to think it would have the greatest impact on orbit, gravity, seasons, atmosphere, radiation and such. As well, any life orbiting it would be vastly different because of these issues. Its solar system would likely be vastly larger, probably with a lot more planetary bodies and the ability for space travel would probably be diminished due to solar activity and gravity.

Then again, perhaps this is where the aliens that inspired the Greek Gods and Titans came from and I am completely of the mark.

It is an impressive sized star. Our sun is just a germ sized blip next to it.

The distance of the planet from the star is about 300 million kilometers (or twice the distance of the Earth from the Sun). The planet's orbital period is 712 days - somewhat less than two Earth years - and the planet's mass is 5 to 10 times that of Jupiter.

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Now thats a BIG planet!!!

I was thinking about this while I was having my morning tea and going over some threads..

The size of these planets that orbit these HUGE stars is something that truely makes me sit back in awe!

And just to think of the beings that might live on these planets is even more worthy of my awe!

These beings could never come to Earth. Thus our thoughts of aliens comming to our Earth might change.
Sure there are some beings out there that are our size..
But when you think about this kind of stuff.. It will make you re think what we might know about other beings.

As beings this large, even if they had ships and travled to other places..
There ships would be the size of our star alone. And they would need a mirco scope to even veiw us.. And they would see us as we look at germs.
Or other tiny tiny objects..

Its truely amazing to me.. And I hope I can get some ATS members thoughts about this..
It really could change our little perspective of life in general..
And change our perspective on alien beings from other places..

reply to post by wheresthetruth


Thanks for adding your thoughts here.. The best I could come up with a little research about orbits around Canis.. (The big dog!)

The upper circle shows the location of the class G7 dwarf star HD 47186 in the constellation Canis Major, which has two planets, one quite small. The planets orbit their star with periods of 4.08 days and 3.7 years with (assuming the star to have a mass of 0.9 times that of the Sun) orbital sizes of 0.05 and 2.3 Astronomical Units. Lower limits to the masses are estimated at 0.0717 and 0.35 times that of Jupiter (23 and 111 times that of Earth. The system thus appears vaguely like our own Solar System, with an inner smaller planet 12 percent Mercury's distance from the Sun and a more Jovian one about where our asteroid belt would be.

HD 47186 Canis Majoris

A large planet recently found orbiting a distant star serves as a preview for the likely frying fate that awaits our own planet.

The star, called HD 47536, is more than 23 times the diameter of our Sun. It is the largest star ever found to harbor a planet. The discovery was announced Wednesday.

The planet is five to 10 times heavier than Jupiter and orbits the star more than twice as far as Earth is from the Sun, or at a distance of roughly 186 million miles (300 million kilometers). It goes around the star every 712 days.

So thats 712 Earth days to Orbit. But thats just what we know.. There so much out here that is all pretty much guess work.
But its great fun to me to think about this kind of stuff..
Im always changing my views on how I see the universe.. And how I see our tiny little blue dot..

And to think.. We are the only ones here in this great universe is to closed minded for my tastes..
I honestly belive we such just go ahead and admit.. We are not alone.
And not only are we not alone.. But life comes in all shapes, and sizes.

We humans are so small.. Yet contained in each one of us is another universe in itself..
We are so small.. Yet so large compared to the beings that live within us.
Its mind bending!!!


[edit on 21-1-2009 by zysin5]

When thinking about the size of inhabitants you need to consider gravity. Typically, on the surface of a very large planet, gravity would be very strong. This is not conducive to gigantism, on the contrary it would tend to favor very small organisms.

Of course, the really huge planets we know about are gas giants and life on the "surface" is very problematic. There is the chance though of life existing in the atmosphere of such a world. Depending on the level at which it thrives, these airborne creatures could indeed be huge but they could never touch down.

So many possibilities.

I can't find any source for that right now, but I think gravity limits the size of the organisms living on the planet.

The bigger the planet, the bigger the mass, the bigger the gravity, the smaller the beings that hypothetically can live there.

I'm waiting for an answer from someone who knows better than me






[edit on 21-1-2009 by Wallachian]

Originally posted by Phage

So many possibilities.

Thanks Phage! I was hoping you would stop by this thread.. Your right about the idea that the possibilities are outstanding!

And its all really still guess work on all our parts. Im no expert when it comes to this.. But I am truely passionate about such things.

I think back to Sagan and the floaters, and sinker creatures they had for gas gaints. Life as we know it wouldnt live in these kinds of places..

But even on Earth.. There are creatures who live in places we would never think to see life..
Hence its why it makes me think that life as we don't know it.. Is all around the universe..
Such as beings that live within Stars.. Beings that live in places we would never consider.. Becasue its life as we do not understand it..

But again I thank you for your time guys in my thread here and offering up some ideas!! Thanks!

[edit on 21-1-2009 by zysin5]

There is one thing I think back to when I think of larger sized races. The idea has been around for some time. I was a big fan of Robotech..
So The Zentraedi come to mind when I think of what kind of beings might live else where in the cosmos.

The Zentraedi are one of those great villains of all time, the ultimate antagonist. They are a race of 40 foot giants, consumed with conquest and violence. Merciless warriors, they are relentless in combat and would rather die than acknowledge defeat. We can hate them because they are cold, cruel, and ruthless instruments of destruction. We can fear them because they are an enigma from another world possessing superior strength and numbers. We can loathe them for their cruelty, brutality and maniacal fervour to conquer...to destroy. We can sympathize for them because they are mere puppets, twisted and made ugly by an insane puppeteer. For they are victims of yet another race's mad design; artificially created, cloned, grown and indoctrinated into a short, bleak life of constant war and death. Toss in the mystery of the SDF-1 space fortress, protoculture, and the insane Robotech Masters, and there you have it. A truly compelling antagonist.

The Zentraedi are like the new age version of what Titans where but put in a sci-fi kinda way vs fantasy setting Gods, and titans.

However I think this is only one step to understanding the big nature of the universe.
If we where ever to come into contact with such beings on such a large scale we would have to build huge ships, or suits that would be able to equal us out. But thats all science fiction at this point.

But its one of the few things I could find that would point in the direction of what Im getting at with this thread.

But over all I have learned gravity would have alot to do with this.. And life as we know it favors smaller lifeforms like us.
But in some places in the universe, there could be places where all size masses are just simply different.
Such as the shift between our world, and the world that lives within us all.
It seems like such a far jump, and so far away.. yet they live upon our bodies right here on earth!
Yet they live in another world from us.
Even insects live in a different world than we humans do right here on Earth.
So with all the big and little life forms we have just on Earth makes me think to places that have such large Suns, and such massive mass to them in the known universe. There is also the unkown universe to consider.
What is outside the human 5 sense realm.
This will take us to higher planes, and places thought before to be unable to access by human mental parameters.

There are limits on planets sizes. A gas giant that would be too big would actually be a small star, not a planet anymore.

Actually, I'm not too sure about telluric planets, but to my understanding, there are limits too, and I don't think that a telluric planet could be any much larger than a few times the size of Jupiter. That however doesn't influence as such the size of its potential inhabitants.

I'll try to get more info on telluric planets sizes.

There was a really amazing segment during Carl Sagan's Cosmos, which I recommend EVERYBODY watch, or read the book, or do both. Anyhow, he said that if our solar system were scaled down to the size of, say, a large living room. The Earth would represent something the size of a spec of dust, just barely visible.

And we're only talking just our solar system here, a relatively unremarkable set of planets revolving an unremarkable star.

It just boggles the mind, the whole thought of it.

Yep, the universe is just big beyond comprehension...

As a matter of fact, putting all things to scale, if the sun is a 1m diameter ball:
- a human measures roughly 1.3nm, that's a millionth of a millimeter.
- Earth is a 0.9cm ball, at 107.4m from the sun.
- Jupiter is roughly a 10cm ball at 560 meters from the sun.
- Saturn, 8.5cm, is already at 1km from the sun!
- Pluto, 1.7mm, is at 4.25Km!
- α Centauri A, which is similar to the sun, is a 1.23 meter ball, at ... 29,630Km!! It is (besides Proxima Centauri) our closest neighbour.
- Arcturus, a 24.5 meters ball, would be at 250,000 kilometers...
- Rigel would measure 80 meters in diameter, and be at over 5 millions of kilometers from us...
- VV Cephei, another supergiant star, would measure close to 2 kilometers in diameter , this englobes the orbits of Earth and Mars, Jupiter, and even Saturn! This monstrous gigantic star, which is in real scale at a mere 3000 light years away, would then be at an amazing 20 millions of kilometers!!!

This is all, again, if we are a ridiculous tiny microbe on a marble sized planet around a 1 meter big star... Just how tiny we are, we cannot even represent it in our minds, it is totally beyond comprehension!

[edit on 22-1-2009 by SpookyVince]

It would take over 7,000,000,000,000,000 (7 Quadrillion) earths to fill Canis Majoris.

Wiki-Canis Majoris


We are literally less than space dust to this thing. WOW. Amazing. I'm fairly certain there are bacterium larger than that to us.

I'm coming back on the subject of telluric planets, or more specifically, "super earths". It seems so far that no planet of a rocky nature (i.e. telluric, as opposed to a gas giant) has been found to be more than a few terran masses (7, 8 times the mass of earth), which is still significantly lower than Jupiter.

Originally posted by SpookyVince
Yep, the universe is just big beyond comprehension...

This is all, again, if we are a ridiculous tiny microbe on a marble sized planet around a 1 meter big star... Just how tiny we are, we cannot even represent it in our minds, it is totally beyond comprehension!

[edit on 22-1-2009 by SpookyVince]

Thanks for the insight Spookyvince! I have a huge place in my heart for Carl Sagan and his show the cosmos! There are so many times when I rack my mind like this to try to further our own understanding of ourselfs.

For me its not so much trying to understand the whole universe, as it is to understanding who we are as beings.

This is truely what seperates us from other beings here on Earth. The ability to think so big and so small at the same time. While we share many traits with other beasts and creatures here on Earth.. While I can not say 100% we are the only beings on Earth who understand the cosmos. We are sertinly the only ones who put this stuff down in writting, and talk in great depth about this stuff.
This is one of the things that makes humans such curious creatures. And to any other beings out there.. We are one small bit to the entire whole.
We have come a long ways, but with so much further to go. Yet understanding BIG ideas will help us expand our knowledge. And it will help others to use their minds. As any time I hit a point in my mind where I can not fathom or understand something, it then helps me to understand something even greater! The greater understanding of the human parameters. And are they limited by our size?
So far I think we have done a great job for being such small beings.
For the size we are when compared to other objects.. Id say we are very lucky to be here. We live in a time, where its our job to expand human thoughts all over this tiny little globe of blue that floats through this little solar system.
Being part of something so grand is an honor indeed. And its humbling to know we will always be a part of this. What ever this may be, its part of us. And while it might not lead us to all the answers to the cosmos.. I am steadfast in my feelings it will sertinly help us understand more about ourselfs in the long run.
Once we understand how small we are.. Prehaps we will get to a point where science and religion can come together and teach us more about ourselfs and our place in the universe.

When I think of gas gaint planets.. I get this hunch that these planets have life as we know them far inside of them.. Protected and powered by the forces that protect these great planets.
Just think of the power and force going on in gas gaints, and how a race of beings could use this energy to power everything in their lives.. Without the need for sunlight and other things we expect to understand on Earth.
But not only power their lives, but protect them from beings like us.
We would never consider an inner city within a Gas gaint planet becasue we just don't consider these things in mainstream science.
I tend to consider many things, and many of them are far fetched and off the way.. But all artists lead others to create the very thing they had thought of in a sci-fi realm and bring it into a real working fashion.
So I belive there is much more we can learn and know about Gas Gaints too. We simply say life can not live there, because of what we see on the surface. But from our own lives we know that under the surface of any subject lies a hidden and deeper meaning.
We can learn alot about the cosmos from our own being. We are in my mind a reflection of what is.. Earth is a tiny model of the wonders this universe holds. So many different types of life just here on Earth.. So many different ways of looking at things.. And all these things will help us understand the greater part of all this.. Even if we can not fathom them. We can still dream, and we get further each time we expand upon this.

We have such a limited viewpoint because we rely on our five sense reality. Life is in the eye of the beholder.

Is the earth itself nothing but a lifeform made up of billions of other lifeforms?
So how do you determine the size of a living thing? Zy5 I dont think you are off base in this line of thinking. The earth has its own form of blood flowing, the rivers, the petro-chemicals and minerals. The rain forests that breathe The people that think. Is this not all one life?

So there you have a life form as big as this planet. How do we know this beautiful planet does not have a soul? Many earth based belief like the native Americans believe everything has a soul.

So how big? Earth size? Solar system size? Galaxy, the universe. How do we know it is not all one life?