John Titor said "The Next President tries to be the next Lincoln" Is there any doubt Civil War is

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posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 07:34 PM
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A word on false prophets:

From the beginning of civilization, people with priviliged knowledge have tried to leverage it by claiming it is devine knowledge or fate. Usually the mechanism is that they are part of some sort of elitist power structure, infleunce peddling ring or other shady secret societies or religion, and have insider information of long term plans.

Some elitist plans are set up decades in advance, without a firm execution date, being thrown upon the populations when all the requisite preconditions are met. Then the prophet of choice is named and hyped, hoping to herd people into the low levels of religious hierarchy and/or a specific, and usually self denigrating, mindset.

It's probably a con, imo.




posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 07:42 PM
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john titor was from another timeline and there can understandably be distortions in the dates he gives. i dont know what the percentage of error would be but polls always give plus or minus 3 to 5%, i make allowances for dates and minor distortions and go by the trends he speaks about.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 07:43 PM
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Wasn't John Titor (pseudonym) the co-creator of the tv serious Jericho?

He was just trying to get feed back on the "story" to see if it would work for tv and it got out of hand.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 07:44 PM
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I come into this debate skeptical but come into this debate to bring some logic.

There are members on this board that come on here believing certain aspects of Physics.

When it comes to John Titor I came to this conclusion:

People that truly believe in John also believe in the many-worlds interpretation. Being that John delayed/distorted our worldline by predicting these events. But believing they are inevitable.

The skeptics on the other hand believe in the single world line. That events are planned out according to that single world line and if predictions are not spot on...well you know how that goes the [HOAX] goes up.

My two cents

-Kdial1


[edit on 20-1-2009 by kdial1]



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 07:48 PM
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Originally posted by nahsik
This is what John Titor said about the Olympics:
"Sports are still enjoyed just as they are today. The Olympics are no longer played though due to various conflicts. The last Olympic Games took place in 2004 and may resume in 2040."

Remember this? I can't believe a word he says after this comment.


If you believe that Titor was really 4 years, as the OP is suggesting, he would be referring to the 2008 Beijing Olympics.

[edit on 20-1-2009 by ThinkingNotLiving]



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:00 PM
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reply to post by titorite
 


Amazes me people still believe this BS.

A Waco event every month?

Can you name just one other?

The fact Titor is still believed leads me to say what I've always believe to be true, people believe what they want to believe. Don't bother them with the facts.

Nothing you can do. Don't waste your time arguing with them.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:09 PM
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Originally posted by craig732

Can you please make a list of these "hits", or direct me to a list of them?

Thanks!



Hey craig732, I am by no means a skeptic or a believer but here are some of the hits I found.

1: In 2001 Titor forecast that China was "pretty close to putting a man in orbit; it shouldn't surprise you if they do that soon." In October 2003 China became the third nation to put an astronaut into Earth orbit.

2: Titor implied that weapons of mass destruction would not be found in Iraq. "Are you really surprised that Iraq has nukes now, or is that just BS to whip everyone up into accepting the next war?" he wrote in early 2001.

3: In 2000 Titor declared, "The basics for time travel start at CERN in about a year." Six months later, news stories emerged announcing that scientists at CERN (European Center for Nuclear Research) in Switzerland were confident that its new atom-smasher would create mini-black holes, the same kinds of singularities John Titor claimed to use.

Anyone else know of more?

Please note too that John noted if his predictions don't come true, it just means that our worldline is slightly different from his and that ours can change at any time. (see my previous post)


-Kdial1



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:14 PM
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Can someone explain to me what some of the stuff on there is?

What is date of Conseption? Mine was 9 November 1990 on a Friday..



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:17 PM
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Originally posted by OnlyTruth
Can someone explain to me what some of the stuff on there is?

What is date of Conseption? Mine was 9 November 1990 on a Friday..


I think you are on the wrong thread, you are looking to post on the Very cool birth calculator thread.

-Kdial1



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:18 PM
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reply to post by kdial1
 


Interesting information you have really it is


Though I have one question and it pertains to black holes, being that we have not as of yet seen anything return from them and only have seen light bend when it got close to the sphere; how do you know it can be used as such a means of time travel? Granted time does/is supposed to slow down as one gets sucked into the hole, but if not even light can escape how would Titor? How would he use it? Seems to me that Titor may have been using something different - perhaps a "offshoot" of a black hole if you will.

Currently I am at a loss of words and tired beyond belief, but I figured asking those questions may help try and shed some light (for me) on the mini-black hole notion.




posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:25 PM
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Originally posted by stikkinikki
Now I don't buy into the Titor story, but for the sake of discussion didn't he state that his timeline and ours are not expected to be the same. Therefore, althought timelines could be similar in themes but different outcomes?


Well Thats true. Its not like time travel you see on Star Trek where you can influence your own time line. No what John Titor spoke of was really more like Sliders than Star Trek. You can go back in time, but you will end up in a different time line, (a parallel universe) and where you came from, well you couldn't affect your time line, the one you came from.

I don't recall John ever saying about a president trying to be lincoln, I do however remember reading on johntitor.com (I believe thats the site) that the president, she ruled with an Iron fist. I think he was refering to Hillary or maybe Pelosis.
I'm not going to claim I'm a psycic., but I just don't see a civil war happening. I don't see a war with Russia, I see it with China.
I also see two attempts on Obama life happening, the good news, well they don't happen. I believe I read that the first attempt was stop in Mississippi or something. If any body has access to the story, well please send me a link.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:42 PM
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Originally posted by PoisonousPoison
reply to post by kdial1
 


Interesting information you have really it is


Though I have one question and it pertains to black holes, being that we have not as of yet seen anything return from them and only have seen light bend when it got close to the sphere; how do you know it can be used as such a means of time travel? Granted time does/is supposed to slow down as one gets sucked into the hole, but if not even light can escape how would Titor? How would he use it? Seems to me that Titor may have been using something different - perhaps a "offshoot" of a black hole if you will.

Currently I am at a loss of words and tired beyond belief, but I figured asking those questions may help try and shed some light (for me) on the mini-black hole notion.




That question in itself is still one that has to be proven, right now we are not there technologically. Perhaps CERN will answer this question in the near future, if infact they do create a mini black-hole.

In the meantime for all of you not familiar with John please read the following archive:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

-Kdial1



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:46 PM
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Originally posted by sirbikesalot06
I don't recall John ever saying about a president trying to be lincoln, I do however remember reading on johntitor.com (I believe thats the site) that the president, she ruled with an Iron fist. I think he was refering to Hillary or maybe Pelosis.


I remember the John Titor hype very well because I laughed at most of it. The Lincoln claim I actually remember that is why I freak a little, because of the claims and more synchronicity about the Lincoln footsteps. This is really creeping me out.

I am telling you I thought this guy was full of it until this claim came true, exactly like he said.

news.aol.com...

From Obama in 2005- What I see in Lincoln's Eyes

www.johntitor.com...



Your enemy was in the cities. Was the President in 2005 also on the enemy side? How did you feel personally about the President then?
The President or "leader" in 2005 I believe tried desperately to be the next Lincoln and hold the country together but many of their policies drove a larger wedge into the Bill of Rights. The President in 2009 was interested only in keeping his/her power base.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:48 PM
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I get the impression from reading this thread that many of the people who are commenting have not read the original conversations from the forum which Titor took part in.

I have.

Not only that, I also read months of posts after that. This was before I came to ATS, before I found it. The only reason I did find ATS is because of John Titor's story and a google search.

The Multi-World Theorem (Which is a very likely model as it stands because the more we learn about Quantum Mechanics, the more likely it seems) states the following about time travel;

-There is no such thing as direct timeline travel. Any timeline you travel back to will be a split from your originating timeline.

-Preservation of Causality means you can never return to your original world if you do travel back in time. You can only return to a world infinitesimally different from your own.

-World-lines have divergences from the original world. Some can be so massive as to be deadly upon arrival (Earth formed too close to the sun and has a toxic atmosphere, etc.), or recognizably different but with very similar histories.


That being noted, stated, and CLARIFIED for those who are not familiar with Titor, he stated that this model is correct.

I cannot go into the physics concerning his time travel machine, but there are places you can go to read the discussions about the device and most of what is proposed seems to be fairly good guess work, if it isn't accurate. Suffice it to say, if Titor made up his story concerning the time machine, his rudimentary descriptions of the Physics seems to jive with our current understanding of things and does not outright conflict.

Many people who claim to have debunked Titor refer to a picture taken, supposedly, of his Mentor in the truck with the Time Travel Device... and a Laser pointer whose light bends as it leaves the cab. I would argue that people who think this is proof DO NOT understand particle physics or how light might be affected by an intense gravitational distortion in a local environment.

If someone were to argue that, "if that's the case, how come the people sitting NEXT to the device aren't meat paste?" I'd be obliged to point out that the purpose of the device was to transport the vehicle and its contents through time that the distortion would likely work exactly as driving a car. You don't feel your mass or weight while you are maintaining a steady motion, you feel as if you are stationary because you and the objects around you are moving at the same velocity.

Thusly, if a person, car, and time travel device are moving at the same velocity... I'd imagine the light would bend around them much like the wind flows across your windshield, but they would not feel any adverse effects of their motion unless they hit some sort of time-wall.

For those of you who haven't researched Titor, or who think that by refuting a few key points in the story that the whole of it falls apart... you all need to read more on the topic.

And keep something in mind;



Allowing for the belief in something does not necessitate believing it. Keeping the possibility open does not necessarily quantify endorsement. Skepticism is keeping an open mind to all possibilities, but confessing only to the ones likeliest to your understanding.



That being said...

The first thing I thought of when I was paying attention to Obama in the past week and the Lincoln thing was brought up repeatedly... was John Titor's statement about the next President trying to be like Lincoln.

For those who don't remember... Titor stated he was surprised that Y2K hadn't happened, because in his reality it had.

Why don't you mull over if that could've possibly delayed the inevitable by contributing to the complacency of the populace as a whole.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 08:51 PM
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reply to post by kdial1
 


Thanks for the link.
Quite a bit I'll have to read through most if not all of it tomorrow after my early morning class.

Though in general (Not pertaining to just you kdial1) I noticed something here that made me scratch my head and re-think this whole titor guy.



06 November 2000 22:13 (about time travel) 24
Pamela: 2. can you travel to the future as well as the past? my understanding of the machine is the trip is recorded so you can get back to your original time line but what about a future beyond your time line are you able to access it as well? or does it have to be open by a future chrononaunt?
Timetravel_0: Yes, you can travel into the future and it takes less energy than going into the past.


Would this apply that free will is thrown out? Perhaps just fate? Or maybe it is a combination of the two? In which you have a choice to make (Free-Will), but making a choice will lead you down a path for say two steps and then you must choose another path? Also being that Titor came back and explained the way in which he achieved Time travel, could that in a way alter the way in which we (Present time) currently perceive time and how to travel back and forth through it? To me it seems like it since Titor did say that things have changed since his coming back; which could in fact lead to one thing such as the way in which we may travel will be altered.

Interesting read through I'll give it that much, but so much of it seems heavily open-ended because of that phrase "Me(Titor) being here will change a few things.."



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:02 PM
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Would this apply that free will is thrown out? Perhaps just fate? Or maybe it is a combination of the two? In which you have a choice to make (Free-Will), but making a choice will lead you down a path for say two steps and then you must choose another path? Also being that Titor came back and explained the way in which he achieved Time travel, could that in a way alter the way in which we (Present time) currently perceive time and how to travel back and forth through it? To me it seems like it since Titor did say that things have changed since his coming back; which could in fact lead to one thing such as the way in which we may travel will be altered.

Interesting read through I'll give it that much, but so much of it seems heavily open-ended because of that phrase "Me(Titor) being here will change a few things.."


This is where you start getting into the quantum world and it all goes back to the Many-worlds interpretation. I personally would take an educated guess and say it is a combination of both free will and fate. Being that it can take the current world line you are on and analyze the free will choices you made throughout life, plot a graph according to your world line then take the same world line according to the graph to plot your travel for the future.

And being heavily open ended is the conundrum with the skeptics and the believers. It all comes back to physics and what you believe. Do you believe in the many-worlds interpretation or the single world line theory.

-KDial1

[edit on 20-1-2009 by kdial1]



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:08 PM
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Originally posted by PoisonousPoison
reply to post by kdial1
 


Interesting information you have really it is


Though I have one question and it pertains to black holes, being that we have not as of yet seen anything return from them and only have seen light bend when it got close to the sphere; how do you know it can be used as such a means of time travel? Granted time does/is supposed to slow down as one gets sucked into the hole, but if not even light can escape how would Titor? How would he use it? Seems to me that Titor may have been using something different - perhaps a "offshoot" of a black hole if you will.

Currently I am at a loss of words and tired beyond belief, but I figured asking those questions may help try and shed some light (for me) on the mini-black hole notion.




With black holes nothing is yet tested and therefor its be guess. We know the black hole crushes everything into a singularity, what we dont know is that if a universe can exist within it and even then if someone could survive the venture with a highly advanced space craft to get through it. Its extremely possible but if someone was to accomplish this we would of heard of it. More than likely its said thats its just a gateway to another place in this universe. Now say if you were to travel to the nearest star it would take 40 years at the speed of light, but when your gone time would of passed many hundreds of years on earth. Whether this is time travel or not is questionable.

All these hollow profits can stop. There predictions are very vague if not at all yet at some point they will match a situation thats happening, worst of all the people that spend there life decoding these books cant decide what tragedy goes with what prediction because they are so vague. The world will not end, something bad may happen but thats no different than any other day.

There will be a civil war though. You dont see it? in the news, people asking for neutrality in politics, gods name to be take off everything. People are getting tired of being controlled its only a matter of time until we break and take our rights back.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:11 PM
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If this time travel and divergence is true then there is the possibility that none of his dire predictions will come true. We could be on a line where any disasters, natural or man made, will be different than his predictions.

I choose to plan, if possible, by watching what mankind is doing and thinking instead of preparing for some man's predictions.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:16 PM
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reply to post by kdial1
 


I have always come to the conclusion of a free will and a fate based type of system, as it seems to be the best well "Guess" to take about life itself, it seems like it may have the best merit (at least pertaining to my life in general).

As for the many-worlds, that...I would say really still could not be 100% explained even with physics, at least in my opinion. Human history has shown it to be wrong in a few things; which leads me to think that maybe physics could be wrong somewhere in it's field (a 1 needed over here or a t needed over there) Overall I would say multiple worlds would be my guess, but as it pertains to time I honestly would not know. As it seems for each choice it would more than likely create a new time line itself.

Child is born
Male ---- Female
left -- right --------- left -- right (handed)

So on and so forth, the choices are astronomical so really I'm not to sure on this one.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:22 PM
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reply to post by XXXTheClown
 


Yes, even in class (Astronomy) I have taken notice that the majority of our class time will be on the matter of black holes. Nothing yet proven, but quite a few ground work things and theories the teacher would like to go over (I'm assuming some dealing with equations and the like as well.) As for the gateway part, didn't someone formulate the theory of white holes that basically made the mouth from the black hole (which would have produced a worm hole?) Well if it dealt the same way with the worm hole theory that was produced it seems like it would be more than likely normal travel, but a bit slowed down (basically everything else speeding up - so perhaps time travel in itself?)

*In general - pertaining to all*
One thing I've come to notice is that if big brother existed as a lot have stated and John Titor talks of all of this and his inventions, would the government have tracked down his IP and ransacked his things; to which they would then drag him off to a facility? Seems like it would be something similar to Roswell. Something happens that seems significant, Government rushes out there, picks up everything, hauls it away.





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