Has Mankind been Duped into Rejecting The only Redeemer?

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posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 01:27 AM
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Originally posted by cancerian42
Actually not all of mankind is striving to achieve a higher state. Some people feel that they are missing something, so they look outward for some solution to their "problems". Other people are just living in the moment, happy to be alive.


And some of us might be trying to kill-off all the others that are holding us back. And some of us might be just trying to exploit the rest so that they don't have to do anything themselves.

Perhaps redemption is over-rated?




posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 02:11 AM
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Originally posted by John Matrix
Are we in a fallen state as the Bible says? If not, then why do we seek a higher state of consciousness, awakening, enlightenment, oneness with God, etc.?

The animals do what they have always done and nothing more.

Mankind is different, always striving to attain some higher state than His present one.

Has mankind been duped into believing He can attain a higher state of being without Christ as His redeemer?

Why? Why? Why?


Jesus of Nazerath's reason for incarnating on this planet was fabricated.

You don't need a 'reedemer' to connect with the Infinite One.

Connecting with divinity is on a personal level. You only need yourself, you hold all answers to all questions.

To believe that the Infinite One is a seperate entity is to be falsely mislead.

Listen to Jesus' words, and do so carefully. The bible is not to be taken literally, it is more of a fairy tale created to divide and control the masses just as many other religions do as well with their literatures.

"Knock, and the door shall be opened"
"Ask, and you shall receive"
"Seek, and you shall find"

Non of these statements have anything to do with taking Jesus as your lord. That is man made. Misinterpretation of words, phrases, etc...

It is only you that you need. Ask, seek, within yourself.

We are all brothers and sisters, sons and daughters, whatever you like of the One Creator. We are all the Infinite Creator, all one, you are, we are.


[edit on 13-11-2009 by Psychonaughty]



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 02:26 AM
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I starred your post, Psychonaughty.


I agree with everything you said.



Originally posted by Psychonaughty
"Knock, and the door shall be opened"



Jesus knew this well.




Sorry, couldn't resist.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 02:27 AM
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The esoteric tradition upon which Christianity was originally founded was torn to shred over the centuries by various "founding fathers" so if people are rejecting Christ it is the fault of the Church itself, not the esoteric tradition.

Those who wish to find, will seek, and if seeking with a pure heart, will find. The Initiates of all ages know the absurdity of characterizing the idea of the redeemer, for whom there are many names. The redeemer however is ultimately found within, YOU are the redeemer, and its up to you to save your soul.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by Seventhdoor
 


I do not understand your interpretation of 'save your soul'.

What is it that you are saving yourself from?



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 01:22 PM
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And further to that, I would like to know the definition of "Soul".

Is it different from mind/consciousness?

Humans are sure mentally messed up creatures, but then haven't they always been that way?
Are we inherently evil?
Or, have we simply put our survival instincts on OverKill?



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 06:11 PM
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Originally posted by Psychonaughty

I do not understand your interpretation of 'save your soul'.

What is it that you are saving yourself from?



The darkness of ignorance. What I mean by this is not knowledge in general, but specifically Self Knowledge and Divine Knowledge, as in "Man, Know Thyself".



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 06:22 PM
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Originally posted by OhZone
And further to that, I would like to know the definition of "Soul".

Is it different from mind/consciousness?

Humans are sure mentally messed up creatures, but then haven't they always been that way?
Are we inherently evil?
Or, have we simply put our survival instincts on OverKill?


Soul is essentially what you are at the deepest level, it is your Inner Light/Inner Divinity, the potential from which all you are manifests. It is covered up during the course of your life time, and the process of redemption slowly uncovers it so that you can exist in the full knowledge and light of it.

We have not always been this way, we have always been capable of being this way and there have been times when the best and worst of humanity comes out, even as it is today. However we have far to go before our society is set up in such a way where the majority of people are happy and healthy.

I don't believe we are inherently evil.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 07:12 PM
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reply to post by Seventhdoor
 


There is no such thing as good or evil in the big picture.

All may do as they wish, and all paths are equally unconditionally loved.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 07:25 PM
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Originally posted by Psychonaughty

There is no such thing as good or evil in the big picture.

All may do as they wish, and all paths are equally unconditionally loved.


I don't think you understand exactly what your saying. In the big picture love also does not exist, since we love and hate that which is good or evil, depending on our nature.

I agree that all may do as they wish, but if you want to bring redemption into the picture, you cannot do as you wish and also obtain redemption without qualification. It may be that eventually, in some life (if you believe in reincarnation) you will, but if you just do whatever you want, well that doesn't lead to freedom, liberation or enlightenment in almost every example one can point to.

Furthermore I would say that to talk about all paths being loved, one is talking about a being or a state of consciousness wherein love and hate exist, and therefore that state of consciousness also recognizes a form of good and evil, and so to whatever being you refer, rather its yourself, some god, or God Supreme, your speaking of a being which does recognize good and evil.

To say, however, that a being to whom good and evil did not exist unconditionally accepted all paths would be at least theoretically correct, since it would have no bias upon which to base a judgment of the worth of one path over another.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 07:27 PM
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reply to post by Seventhdoor
 


Love does exist in the bigger picture, it is just you do not understand the unconditional love that I speak of. True love. Of the deeper sense.

There is no evil or good, there is no labels, there only IS.

Free will, and Love.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by Psychonaughty]



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 07:31 PM
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reply to post by Psychonaughty
 


OK then, so this being loves the path of the man who repeatedly rapes little girls, unconditionally, for who he is, because that's just who he is? He doesn't need redemption, his holy sparks are not fallen, they are perfect, it is his divine purpose to molest and, having done so, he has accomplished the work of Love in the universe?

I only bring this up because you have stated that essentially there is no need for redemption, people can do what they want, and in this context you state there is no good or evil, only love.

So what of things such as this?

I do understand higher love by the way, but in the context of fulfilling ones divine purpose through consciousness of ones own Inner Light. Love is Law, Love Under Will.

[edit on 2009/11/13 by Seventhdoor]



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 07:43 PM
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reply to post by Seventhdoor
 


That person is the Infinite One just like you are, and just like I am.

All experiences are equally beautiful and unique.

I'm not saying I agree with 'molestation' I'm saying that it does not matter what it is that you do. Your always loved unconditionally, infinitley.

This context of truth is a reason why such religions have been created to fabricate it. Christianity for example saying that the Infinite One is a seperate revengeful entity that judges people in this one and only incarnation. Which is not the case, considering there is nobody that you can hurt but yourself.

Do some research, where was the bible written? I'll tell you, in a place where the main stream beliefs were reincarnation, what questions does this raise? Listen to yourself, only embrace that which rings true, use your inner voice, and only yours. Do no believe me, find your own path.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by Psychonaughty]



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 08:02 PM
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Originally posted by Psychonaughty

That person is the Infinite One just like you are, and just like I am.



I agree, however he is manifestly ignorant of the Infinite One, thus he causes pain to himself and others.


Originally posted by Psychonaughty

I'm not saying I agree with 'molestation' I'm saying that it does not matter what it is that you do. Your always loved unconditionally, infinitley.



Of course not. However it does matter what you do, since your actions either lead to consciousness of the Infinite, or into ignorance of the Infinite.


Originally posted by Psychonaughty

Which is not the case, considering there is nobody that you can hurt but yourself.



Which is why I begin by saying the teaching of redemption is to save yourself. If you can hurt yourself, then again it does matter what you do, since your actions lead you further into pain and separation from divinity, or further away from pain and closer to divinity.


Originally posted by Psychonaughty

Do some research, where was the bible written?



The Bible was edited and written for decades and centuries after the death of Christ. It is based largely upon previously held beliefs about redemption from other cultures, a combination mostly of Judaism and Gnosticism. Originally the streams of thought were more philosophical, at one point Dionysus and Bacchus were identified as Christ figures during the first five centuries after the death of Christ.

These ideas of redemption do indeed come from places where reincarnation is believed in, from the Gnostic angle, it is Egyptian and Greek, with heavy Orphic influences.

The Judaic teaching essentially comes down to the idea of Tikkun, the restoration of the Light of God, which can only be performed by the individual and indicates that there is a disconnect between human consciousness and consciousness of the Infinite.

In the far east the teachings are more well defined than in the west, since most of the esoteric knowledge of the west originated at some point in the east. However, in all cases the teaching is never "Do what you want and God will reveal itself" it is always outlined as a specific process which must be followed in order to reconnect with the divine.

Why would every single tradition of every age and every religion in every culture teach this if it didn't matter in the slightest what we did or did not do as individuals?

Thus, if anyone as an individual wishes to achieve union with the Infinite, they must follow one of the many paths which will lead them to the consciousness of the Infinite.

This was probably the original teaching of Christ, as he was first Dionysus, Osiris, Orpheus, and many more. Yet as is often the case, the words of a prophet are often corrupted by the disciples, and the veil falls again and again over the holy of holies, as a wiser man than I once said.

My whole point being that modern Christianity has completely lost touch with the original esoteric teaching of redemption. Their idea of being Christlike is to adhere to a set of exoteric ideas and actions, rather than ascending within to their own inner light. This is why so few people respect it as a religion, and why so many people have so many problems with it and other religions which have experienced similar forms of corruption.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 08:16 PM
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reply to post by Seventhdoor
 


All religions are but a core of truth drowning in a sea of perversions.

People should understand that they don't need Jesus as their saviour, he would be bewildered if he saw this come of his teachings.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 10:00 PM
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reply to post by Psychonaughty
 


They can't have Jesus as their savior because the original mythological and esoteric context that he represented is mostly lost, or only to be found if you dig deep. The bible doesn't give one the means to truly have this experience, only the means for fundamental beliefs and a lighthearted form of spirituality.

I think however we agree. Religion itself becomes evil, but contains the truth. I certainly agree that Jesus would be bewildered at what has become of his doctrine, but perhaps, as a prophet, he knew, and saw some inevitable course humanity must take in order to learn to grow up.



posted on Nov, 13 2009 @ 10:12 PM
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reply to post by Seventhdoor
 


All anyone need is love.

Humanity is waking up slowly, although a transition nears us, not soon enough for most.

It does not matter what happens, no matter what you do how "Good" or how "Evil". No matter if you live through something or die, you are never changed or altered by the physical illusion. Merely you are changed by the experience, catalytic lessons that push you ever further into unity.

This is why I iterate quite often, when asked for specific information, that it pales to insignificance, just as the grass withers and dies while the love and the light of the One Infinite Creator redounds to the very infinite realms of creation forever and ever, creating and creating itself in perpetuity.

Why then be concerned with the grass that blooms, withers and dies in its season only to grow once again due to the infinite love and light of the One Creator? This is the message I bring. Each entity is only superficially that which blooms and dies. In the deeper sense there is no end to being-ness.

As I bow with my hands close to my heart I say to you namaste my friend.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by Psychonaughty]





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