CNN (quote) amnesty bill WORST piece if -Snip- EVER!!!

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posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:10 AM
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reply to post by pizzaguy
 


I think many realize this, but I think that people are discussing this issue as it remains a pressing crisis in this country where 10% of the population is illegal.




posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:16 AM
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You anti-illegals which is really anti-Mexican are just too much. You scream and holler about them causing all this chaos, maybe raping daughters, as if there are no American born Nationals that are capable of doing the same thing.

I find it funny that shortly after 9/11, the border issue came up and the bash the illegals began. Was it to take attention away from the hijackers entry into the US? Why the rush to close the Southern Border and NOT the Northern border? Do you really believe that 12 million illegals can do more damage to an economy than the 300 million who reside here legally? There is a reason for all this bashing and that is to get your attention off the real issues that we face.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:17 AM
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Originally posted by stinkhorn
Being a citizen must mean something, if it just a word, then our constitution is dead. Why dont we just cross mexicos border illegaly and enter their country...ooohhh thats right, you would be arrested for breaking their law and jailed, you might be deported after a year or so if you are still alive.


I can't quite concur with your statements about Mexicans and their behaviors - I can see you feel strongly about the matter as many americans do. But I must say that Mexico does seem to have an illegals problem of their own. Most illegals from Central and South America work their way into the USA via Mexico.

" Soberanes has reported that Central American and even Mexican migrants in Mexico are subject to abuse at the hands of police and military personnel, and that immigrants are detained in municipal prisons.

According to Soberanes, "the Mexican government mistreats ‘indocumentados’ that cross its territory, it keeps them in jails, in overcrowded conditions, many times without food, without medical attention and overall, violating their human rights."

Mauricio Farath, another CNDH official, reported that in some Mexican states, Central Americans "go to the municipal jails, where they stay for days and weeks. In some small rooms there are dozens of them and they do not separate the men and the women." [CNDH: Aquí se criminaliza a los ilegales, Victor Ballinas Enviado, December 21st, 2005]"

Mexico the land of the free



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:20 AM
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Originally posted by jam321
You anti-illegals which is really anti-Mexican are just too much. You scream and holler about them causing all this chaos, maybe raping daughters, as if there are no American born Nationals that are capable of doing the same thing.



Can you give us the link to where someone posted this accusation? Because I don't think the majority of people believe that to be the main problem.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:29 AM
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reply to post by Mynaeris
 


page 3 of this thread. Are you talking the majority on this thread or majority in general? I must admit that this thread compared to other threads I have seen on illegal immigration has been very soft.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:31 AM
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reply to post by Mynaeris
 



Absolutley I knew that I did not have the right to vote, I knew I was illegal, had known it since my parents told me when I was about 14.

Being an American to me was always so much more then about a piece of paper - When I voted I was so proud! When I saw my W2s at the end of the year I felt like I'd done my part in contributing. When I put my hand over my heart and pledged my allegience to the flag, I damnwell meant it.

To this day I identify as American - Even though I don't have a piece of paper which says that I am.

Of course I don't think the people who go the legal way are chumps - But the truth is that to go the legal way costs lots of money - argue that all you want, but unless you're a successful asylum seeker ( rare) it takes cash. The people from the poor countries who do no qualify for asylum aren't doing it the legal way becasue they can't afford to.

I only told my story to show people that being an illegal alien doesn't mean you're a bad person, or a criminal - Sure the US goverment says I'm a criminal ( I did vote for Gore and Clinton...*grins*) but am I really?

For the people who say "why can't they go the legal way" please go research what the legal way is...it isn't as easy as you think, and it sure as hell isn't cheap.

I always post in these types of topics, it's a subject near and dear to my heart, I lived it and feel it is unfair for people to to judge all illegals as criminals and bad guys..



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:31 AM
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Thank you Mynah. Here in Texas ( Tejas? ) we are all well aware of the issue it stares us in the face daily as we pass by the day workers stand. It is posted with legal city signs saying come pick them up here. 30% of Texas drivers do not carry car insurance, though its mandatory to drive, get a drivers license, and keep your car legal. Somehow our illegals already bypass all this stuff. I just appreciate up to date info on these things. Does this bill that Lou Dobbs reported on still have a life? Is it it still being considered in its entirety? How has it changed? This is about votes and tax dollars for our governing officials. They will not let it rest. My own Congressman Sam Johnson, has the question of Amnesty up for vote on his website on the front page no less. The system is corrupted through and through. The question remains for those people who love the United States. What will it take for us all to say no more? We have to feel really FEEL the desire for freedom. Not Superbowls, not corruption as usual, not American Idol, but us, our neighbors, our culture. In truth, we all will see that things will get much worse before they get better. I have seen that it will be no less all of our freedoms, money, and worldy goods stripped away from us by us before we say it is enough. We all listen here, the general population will not listen. They are just not inspired. So the thing here as in all other similar posts is what does this country need to get this changed. We are very good at dwelling on the problems. I challenge each and every one of you at ATS. Lets not dwell on the problem but let us find the solution.

PG



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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Originally posted by jam321
You anti-illegals which is really anti-Mexican are just too much. You scream and holler about them causing all this chaos, maybe raping daughters, as if there are no American born Nationals that are capable of doing the same thing.



My objection is NOT that there are no legal immigrants that cause problems, or that there are no natural born Americans who cause problems. My objection to giving amnesty to illegal aliens is that they are ILLEGAL.

These are people who by their actions have a demonstrated disregard for the laws of America. There are lots of people waiting patiently, going through the process of LEGAL immigration into this country. People who HAVE regard for our country and her laws. A bill such as the one proposed is a slap in the face to anyone who respects our laws, and it is a reward to those who do not.

It is an unjust proposal. It is unjust to the law abiding immigrants patiently waiting their turn and going through the process, and it is unjust to the American citizens who are asked to bear the burden financially for those criminals, (for that is exactly what you are if you violate our laws) who think that laws are for suckers.

I am not "anti-Mexican" I am anti-criminal. I dont care what nationality the illegal immigrant is. Because you are right, we have enough criminals here already. I am also opposed to our leaders weakening our borders in advance of an apparent move towards forming a North American Union. Which may make THEM criminals as well if it is an attempt to undermine our Constitution for their own gain and that of business interests.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:42 AM
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reply to post by Marmota monax
 



You seem to miss the whole point. You clearly relate that you worked, paid taxes and voted... all while being a productive immigrant.

In the end you were charged with a felony and found it necessary to leave the country.


My felony was to have voted whilst being an illegal alien. My parents came to America whilst I was an infant and just never went home.

I remember the day I got my voters registration in the mail, I was so proud ( Almost twenty years ago!).
That day I apparently broke the law so horribly that the United States government decided that I was a criminal not worthy of US citizenship.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:58 AM
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reply to post by Night Star
 

Oh no you DID NOT! You are the lamest by putting that excuse, what the hell do you know about the hardships they go through. At least you are one of the phagocytes who lives from the government while they don't even have that right. About taxes, they pay the same as you do, and even worse they don't get any REFUNDS! So, if I had to choose I wouldn't want to be paying your unemployment neither your retirement, as by the time I need them they surely won't be there since people like you that are TOO LAZY to get a job, because at least go wash dishes at a restaurant!! So don't talk crap! You just want to keep doing the same job you always done, WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 09:59 AM
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Originally posted by Merigold

Of course I don't think the people who go the legal way are chumps - But the truth is that to go the legal way costs lots of money - argue that all you want, but unless you're a successful asylum seeker ( rare) it takes cash. The people from the poor countries who do no qualify for asylum aren't doing it the legal way becasue they can't afford to.



Illegals are criminals by definition. For those like you whose parents committed the crime, and you were just along for the ride, I think there is less culpability.

And, if the problem is that immigration is too expensive, then lets fix that. Not give a free ride to those who think that laws are just too inconvenient or costly.

Do you realize that many of the natural born residents of the US's ancestors sold themselves into bonded servitude to have the money to get here? They also did not have the money just sitting around. Or, in more modern times they scrimped and saved for years before immigrating. Very few of us here today had immigrant ancestors that came from lives of wealth and luxury. Most of our families were abjectly poor as well, and they had to raise the money to travel here as well as be processed through.

I am all for streamlining and making more affordable the legal immigration process, but no one who is here illegally should be allowed to cut in front of all the others who have been trying to go about the process legally. There are people living in much worse economic and political conditions than those in Mexico. Some places in Africa for instance. They have stories too, you know. They have dreams, feelings, ambition just like your family and you do, and, they are following the laws. They want to be proud Americans just like you do.

In Iraq, there are translators and other Iraqi's that are actively working to assist the US, and their very lives and that of their families are at risk because they are helping us, and they have to go through the legal process to get here. THEY are not being rushed through. Why should anyone else be allowed to?



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 10:04 AM
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reply to post by Illusionsaregrander
 


I agree with everything you said.

I'm just sharing my story, not to get sympathy, but to fight the "Illegal aliens=bad" mentality a little.

I want no sympathy, in the end leaving the United States was the best thing that ever happened to me.

As for the Iraqi's who are risking their lives to help the Americans it's a crime that they aren't being fast tracked, they sure as hell deserve it.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 10:24 AM
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Let me guess ... Bush's fault right? ... These are the guys that are gonna be behind Obama..

If buyers remorse hasn't hit yet I suggest you get the lube ready.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 10:31 AM
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Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman

Originally posted by Marmota monax
reply to post by lucidclouds
 


Last thought, why are we not questioning how many illegal alien votes were cast in the recent election? Maybe because if you are Legal=Citizen=Productive you don't count.


Or, if I may be so bold as to edit your thought...

Legal=Citizen=Productive=your vote doesn't count near as much as it would have
(do the math)

Iamonlyhuman

Agreed!



[edit on 20/1/2009 by Iamonlyhuman]



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 11:51 AM
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by the way all yall stating racial discrimination , I do not descriminate ! Any Illegal in this country is just that ILLEGAL. The only reason they come is because there is work that the people of this country (not all populace but quite a lot of em) have gotten to lazy , we have a welfare society and even when jobs are available too many just sit because that work is beneath them . So please do not lable me as a racist or hater , if anything I am just an american who aint afraid to get his hands dirty.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 12:03 PM
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The crime statistics bere out that our neighbors from the south are causeing more trouble than they are worth. In 2006 the stats are astounding and heres a link to show that the problem isn't going away;

www.renewamerica.us...

Since this report was made, crime from the illegal sector has been on the rise at a rate of 200%. Repeat crimes by this sector of illegals atounds me because after the first arrest they come back and continue. This bill wil only make things worse. Those that we allow under legal immigration have something to contribute to the country as a whole. We don't need the uneducated, we have plenty here already due to the dumbing down of our children.

Zindo



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 12:12 PM
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reply to post by Merigold
 


I also went through the process - it's not cheap (though that is a relative term) and it has it's pitfalls, but I believe that it is the only way to enter a country.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 12:25 PM
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Courtesy, Please

There's plenty of room for disagreement on ATS, but not for arguments based on ad hominem fallacies.

For anyone who may have missed it, I recommend reading this.

Please focus on the topic.

Thanks.



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 12:46 PM
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To everyone that says anti-illegal = anti-Mexican. Look, if I had a heard of cows running through my living room tearing everything up I'd probably be anti-cow. If they were horses I'd be anti-horse. If it was a whole bunch of cows and just one horse I'd probably be mostly anti-cow now wouldn't I? If you're concerned with it then change your ways. Don't complain that nobody likes you because you're a horse. Take some responsibility please.

Look, it happens to everybody. Look at fundie religious people like terrorists that give everyone in that religion a bad name by doing something retarded. So, you have to stand up and say no, that's not what we stand for! You're making us all look retarded! Who in the illegal community is doing that? Anyone? Look, there's a lot of laws I don't like, but I have to follow them or I'm a criminal too. You can't as a group do everything wrong and then turn around say, oh you just don't like me because I'm a Mexican. No, that's not it. Trust me, that's not why people don't like you and as long as you think that you'll never solve the real problem.

Now, I didn't say that was fair. Welcome to the real world. Welcome to the States where they wanted to come. Sitting around and hoping that one day they'll be white isn't helping anybody. If they want to be seen in a more positive light they're going to have to make it happen. It's not my responsibility. It's their responsibility and they're going to have to do that.

See, they can't change their skin color. So, your solution is seriously to sit them down and say, look buddy. There's nothing you can do. You're just the wrong color. You probably should just give up because nobody is ever going to like you. Seriously? That's your solution? No, we need to focus on real solutions here because their race isn't going to change and isn't important. We're just wasting our breath even bringing it up because what we really need in this country is jobs. Focusing on their skin color isn't getting us anywhere.

[edit on 20-1-2009 by tinfoilman]



posted on Jan, 20 2009 @ 02:51 PM
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Originally posted by pjslug

Originally posted by GhostR1der
When will people wake up, unlock their gun cupboard and march on this out of control government?!?! It has betrayed the will of the people SIX TIMES NOW. Hopefully more people will go do some 'target practice' at the border to send a clear message.

Build a fence, instead of a NAFTA superhighway.


I dunno, when will YOU wake up and do it? All you guys that speak of having marches and bringing your guns to protests, I've yet to see anyone of you do it. Less talk, more action.


Ehm, don't you think that is a little harsh way to express it? You know GhostR1der, you are saying that you justify murder in this case?
And, pjslug, you say armed rebellion is the solution?

I think this sound a little...crazy sort of.





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