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How long before the public services stop running?

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posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 03:55 PM
States and entire cities are now beginning to go broke folks, some states like California are weeks away from being entirely without finances to operate the state.

How long before we see public benefits stop flowing, city buses and trains stop running, even worse how long before entire cities can no longer afford to pay for sanitation workers or even worse fire and police protection?

To me it seems likely if not inevitible, if the economy does not improve soon we are bound to experience some serious budget shotfalls. Would the federal gov bail these states out? Or better yet, would the fed be able to bail out municipalities if entire states start to go bankrupt one after another?

Could we see this happen? Picture an entire state like Michigan with no police force active. Perhaps this is why they are training the military to be domestic police? Maybe they know what is coming?

Bankrupt state governments are no longer speculation, there are several teetering on the verge of going broke as we speak. What would be the first things to be cut? Im thinking unemployment benefits, welfare and maybe even SSI could stop being mailed out. Police would probably be the last to go because they are the only thing keeping criminals from taking over entire cities.

Thoughts? Comments? What are things looking like where you live?

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 03:57 PM
reply to post by BlackOps719

I don;t know how feasible it is that these things will actually happen in the way that you describe, but if they do, I hope it will bring people together... you know, get more local economies going.

It would be a good wake-up call, at least, for those who think that everything should be free.

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:00 PM
reply to post by asmeone2

I wouldnt have ever thought it could happen either, but the money has to come from somewhere. States are now going belly up, and the federal government can only print so much funny money to give them before the money itself becomes worthless.

I agree in that I would hope it would draw people together to work as a community, but knowing what I know about people in general I seriously wouldnt count on it.

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:03 PM
First thing first. Most city and state governments need to cut the fat from the offices. Get rid of the no work no show jobs. It needs to be streamlined. Second, maybe some of that bailout money should go towards basic needs for communities (fire, police, sanitation workers) and to make sure it only go towards those workers. Third, some areas can enact (if absolutely necessary) an .5% sales tax to help subsidize income for the city/state/country.

Outside of that, things do look grave indeed. If they only would have had better money managers and chop the fat from the budget a long time ago instead of being so corrupt. America. Your future is in a grim state.

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:03 PM
There would be a long and difficult winnowing process, sure, but in the end I think it wold change a bit for the better.

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:11 PM
Well the thing that truly has me worried ..I just read that home foreclosures rose 81 % in 2008 from the previous years totals. Being in the real estate field I knew that things were bad but wow.

The problem is that all of thoses states are relying on the property taxes from those homeowners as well as tax from new home sales in order to meet basic budget requirements.

Foreclosures arent just taking a huge toll on the public at large but they are also killing state tax revenue totals. And the decline is worsening as we will surely see more foreclosures as designer loans reset through 09-2011. Eventually the tap will run dry.

California is now two weeks away from being financially bust per the Governator, what does that mean for people who are relying on state benefits or unemploment to feed their families? How many weeks could a police officer or state worker go without getting a paycheck before they have to move on?

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:15 PM
California is a good example of why the border states need to crack down on illegal immigration even if the Feds do not back them.

In addition to the problems you described BO, We cannot continue to support millions of people through tax dollars who do not contribute back into the system.

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:24 PM
This is a real concern and there are a ton of services that could be cut for a couple years until we get back on out feet. I'm thinking supplies more than salaries, except when you get into higher white collared workers. A lot of businesses and communities are switching light bulbs out to safe on electric bills. I bet work could be streamlined so that every state truck is full instead of 1 driver per truck on the jobsite. I sell on eBay in the winter and I can tell you that this is the slowest in 10 years. I'm already taking outside work for spring at below my usual rate.

Be prepared.

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:25 PM
I thought CA was supposed to fall off into the ocean by now?

Its a global economy, it truly is. The world did it to itself. My wife and I for the past 8 years have wondered how people around us can afford 2 big SUV or sport utility cars, large homes and all the goodies like clothes for 5 kids. Credit is how. They never owned anything.

[edit on 16-1-2009 by IntelRetard]

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 04:46 PM
Damned easy solution to the property tax issue... municipalities have within their power the abillity to amend the law to state that, if the banks hold a reclaimed foreclosed upon piece of property, they (the banks) are responsible for paying the tax on those properties. This would do one of two three things
1. Make banks think twice before foreclosing on mortgages.
2. Prevent these property owner defaults from taking huge chunks out of state & local government budgets.
3. Redistribute the money the federal government is giving these banks to the local level budgets and reduce the banks' abillities to just shuttle those funds overseas or mismanage them in some other way.

If the banks refuse or fail to pay, another simple solution, local & state government siezure of properties from banks for failure to pay property taxes. Sell the homes back to the public for a modest adminsitrative fee plus back taxes due on property with former private owners who were foreclosed upon by the banks being given first priority refusal of sale... give the people a chance to get back into the home they were booted from.

(edited for spelling thanks to fat, overly excitable fingers)

[edit on 16-1-2009 by burdman30ott6]

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 05:09 PM
reply to post by burdman30ott6

Good sound ideas and it all makes sense on paper, the only problem is finding people who want to buy the homes that can actually still qualify. Not really sure how banks will eat the loss on homes that they can only sell for half of the amount still owed on the original note..

Hard times are indeed on the horizon, more so than a lot of folks seem to want to believe.I do agree that banks should be forced to move houses instead of letting them sit and rot. Look at places like Stockton, CA and parts of Florida, whole entire neighborhoods are empty and going to waste.

For Stikkinikki I hear ya 100%, things seem to be tough all over right now. A lot of small mom and pop stores and restaraunts here where I live are shutting down and moving on. The pawn brokers seem to be doing very well though, and the gas company is gouging their way to a record profit. Unfortunately the only jobs being posted in my area are work from home pyramid schemes and medical related work.

2009 is going to be a real female dog.

[edit on 1/16/09 by BlackOps719]

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 05:25 PM
reply to post by asmeone2

When people make statements like this I wonder just who they are referring to. I would be on the street if the Social Security Disability were to stop. I worked and paid into that system and through no fault of my own became unable to work due to a serious back surgery.

I have thought about this alot lately. I wonder if I will be able to live with things going this way. This is a very real possibility and it is frightening not only to the disabled population but the retired people too.

Heck with all the talk of fleeing to the hills it is bad enough we can't afford to. I guess we had better make those checks stretch. LOL

posted on Jan, 16 2009 @ 06:26 PM
This will all only get worse as those that have overpaid in income tax begin to file for a refund in the coming months. Get your income and property tax returns filed early if you are due a refund, or your name will end up on the bottom of the IOU list. Also, those that make a habit of over paying their taxes may want to consider changing their exemptions so that they are NOT due a refund next year.

There's a lot of FAT on the public payrolls, so there are a lot things each state can do to reduce their financial burdens. So, before they start raising taxes and passing the burden onto those that still have a job, they should be forced to cut loose all that pork spending first. They can also stop paying out all them pension benefits too, just like what happens in the real world to the rest of us. And, there is no reason why they can't dump all them living on welfare too - just like how the rest of us living in the real world loose our source of income. Those living on welfare should have to worry about their source of income just like those that are working for a living.

posted on Jan, 17 2009 @ 12:10 AM
So now it appears as though they in fact are suspending all tax refunds and welfare payments (per another thread)?

I knew it had to come sooner or later.

How do ya suppose they will go about feeding the tens of thousands of prison inmates that the state of California currently houses?

If the welfare checks and food stamps stop rolling out we may see riots in the months ahead that will make Watts look like a minor civil disagreement.


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