Why Do We Care So Much About Gaza?

Originally posted by deccal

Originally posted by crmanager

There are 6 million Jews and 2000 dead sailors at Pearl Harbor who might disagree with "war is never the answer."

Can you please be more clear? I didn't understand the rhetoric you are using.

Read the quote I refer to.

The person says "War is never the answer whenever it occurs."

My response is that Hitler systematically killing a race or Japans unprvoked attack on US soil are legitimate reasons.
The poster thinks the Jews are not worth saving and unproveked attacks are not a reason for war.

Darfur is an impoverished, majority-black area of no significance to world trade or politics. Gaza is a political lynchpin on the nuclear grenade due to the number and complexity of political/trade allies on each side including the US, Russia, China and Iran, all of whom have their own double-sided agendas. It also is very close to the Middle East's oil/shipping routes, the disruption of which could definitely alter everyone's life.

It also is becoming a very well-documented war crime in progress, Israel is going way off the deep end and working overtime to run off its few supporters. To put it bluntly, there is so much subterfuge going on around the whole mess that it is conclusively proving how mentally damaged the entire world's leadership is at the moment.

I am one of those people who checks out the Gaza live cam all the time. It does sound morbid doesn't it? Waiting to see and hear death and destruction.
At one point I most likely would have agreed. But I don't think so any more.

It is the only true window into a world that does not bombard us with comments and propaganda (both sides) or opinions. Now you have a camera, a source that is only observing and not telling any of us with words what is going on over there. And because that is real life happening. All the arguments across the different forums can be broken down to nothing more than opinions developed due to ones own perspective of events and the truth remains pretty allusive. None of us is experiencing the violence first hand.

I myself can get pretty passionate and heated about the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. One reason is that my heart always goes out to the underdog. Another reason is that Israel has placed itself above criticism and exactly who are the Israelis or Jews that the rest of the world will cower in front of them? We talk big and threaten but we never walk our talk. The only time the West seems to walk their talk is when the Jews are being criticized……next thing you know the knee jerk reaction of anti-Semitism rears it's ugly head. And to be honest the Arab world is no different.

What I view through that camera is the David and Goliath story……only this story is not done being written.

But that's me and my perspective.

Why does this conflict get more attention than others? I think it has different reason for different people……….but there is a driving force of why this conflict over the years has taken precedence over others. The media. And it does not matter if it is mainstream media, or an alternative source they are the ones who keep this conflict in the foreground so much so that you have to wonder if someone believes the value of a life differs dependant on racial or cultural background.

I was wondering the same
too many publication,
is it because a secret operation of another kind
is taking place right this momnet and
this war is the decoy?

Aha!

reply to post by tengkorak


So what is this 'secret operation' then as I'm dying to hear the truth?

I find this whole mess of interest largely because my money, our money is funding this slaughter. We supply them with arms, cash, and even the WP they are dropping "accidentally" on the population. The US is the largest and soon to be only ally they have. Perhaps it is all the Zionist crap flowing over the airways via John Hagge, Rod Parsley, Pat Robertson and every other fundie out there. The reasons are many.

The war crimes in Africa are terrible, the Congo has been a killing field for decades, Rwanda, Darfur, Tibet the list goes on and on. I cannot speak for anyone but myself and I am as concerned about these other conflicts as I am about this. I boycotted the opening exercises of the Olympics in protest of China and their involvement in the Darfur mess.

Anti IDF and the Israeli government is not the same thing as anti-semitism. Period! In like manner Islamic nations do not equal terrorists. I get so tired of people with all of this fear mongering of the Islamic nations. As stated here by others, the Jihadists are the fringes just like the KKK is the fringes of Christianity. I certainly do not judge Christians based upon the ranting of the Grand Dragon. Wrong is wrong, killing is killing, and genocide is genocide. Israel is working toward the total genocide of the Palestinians period.

Good thread and question.

I'll try to convey my say on this though I'm not sure I will succeed since it has several layers.

Compunction :
Jews were the target to persecution, oppression, exiles, pogroms, humiliations, dehumanization for centuries, and finally with the systematic industrialized extermination of the Holocaust.
No nation and no government ever lift a finger to help, even when they clearly had the chance to do so.
There was no justification for that:

fcit.usf.edu...

present: How can anyone live with the knowledge or accusation of extermination yet they did nothing? They turn the table and accuse Israel/ Jews/ Zionists of being an entity of evil. It is so much easier to justify it when the one being exterminated is evil from the day he was created.

Hypocrisy.
To add to the above, most if not all major countries were (or still are) involved in colonialism, conquest and suppressing other populations.

9.11 truth
Since the 5 dancing Israelis BS story, the "truth" movement was incredibly eager to find another culprit that fit the profile. Just say "Mossad" and all of the sudden everything is so much clearer now. Conspiracy –true or not- must be complicated and so much more exciting with every new revelation.

www.911myths.com...
(I have my views on 9/11, but it goes beyond this discussion).

Economy
This has old roots, but it pretty much say it all when you look through Nazi Germany's propaganda against Jews who were the scapegoat for just about any wrong doing in the world.
All you need to control the messes is an economy breakdown and a scapegoat. If a Jew is caught in a major fraud, even better.

Psychology:
The number of Muslims in Europe alone reaches about 54 Million. They are the majority behind the protests against Israel and Jews. The larger and louder the protests, the more it excite the messes. It is similar to Domino effect.

Media:
Explosions, a crying child, hunger and death in general are what they are interested in. The best reality show of the year just at the push of a button.

Anti-Semitism
Most if not all of the above have some sort of relations to Anti-Semitism. Some will not admit it, or try to sugar coat it with anti Zionism, anti Israel and so on. Some are just anti Israel's actions, and some are what there are: Anti- Jews. Many don't even know why they are so full of hate against Jews, but it is strongly imprinted inside, there is no way to find rational explanation for that.
This conflicts give them yet another perfect opportunity to spume hate.

Religious and social animosity.
How can the "Chosen people" do such things, and what makes them better than others in the first place?
All I can say is the common Israeli do not act or speak of themselves as superior to other. It is just another weapon used by Jew haters to rationalize their acts.

Compunction :
....No nation and no government ever lift a finger to help, even when they clearly had the chance to do so.
There was no justification for that:

Past: Obviously something was done to help with the holocaust. Incase Jewish people haven't noticed it happened and was stopped about 70 years ago.

Hypocrisy.
To add to the above, most if not all major countries were (or still are) involved in colonialism, conquest and suppressing other populations.

I agree with part of that although i disagree with the part about "most if not all" and would substitute it with "some". Colonialism, conquest and supressing the middle east can be seen everyday.

9.11 truth
Conspiracy –true or not- must be complicated and so much more exciting with every new revelation.

The truth is, 9/11 was where the term "terrorist" came from. It is now a word which is commonly used to refer to all people of Islam. Like the Nazi's dehumanised the Jews to promote their cause and gain support from the people to eliminate the Jews, the same thing has happened to Muslims.

Economy
All you need to control the messes is an economy breakdown and a scapegoat. If a Jew is caught in a major fraud, even better.

The middle east has the biggest supply of oil and Afghanistan is the largest producer of opium = BIG $$$$.

War = short term financial input for long term gain.

Psychology:

The number of Muslims in Europe alone reaches about 54 Million. They are the majority behind the protests against Israel and Jews. The larger and louder the protests, the more it excite the messes. It is similar to Domino effect.

The number of Palestinian refugees is over 4 million. The Number of Jews in Israel is about 5 million. So that means another 1 million Palestinians need to be removed/eliminated and guess what? There's only about 1 million left living there.

Media:
Explosions, a crying child, hunger and death in general are what they are interested in. The best reality show of the year just at the push of a button.

That part should have been under the "Psychology" banner. That comment is just messed up. How can you enjoy watching that?

Anti-Semitism
Many don't even know why they are so full of hate against Jews, but it is strongly imprinted inside, there is no way to find rational explanation for that.

I guess what you're referring to here is the lable of "terrorist" that get's applied to Muslims. A term which the media has created and affiliated with a particular religion over the actions of very few people.

Religious and social animosity.
How can the "Chosen people" do such things, and what makes them better than others in the first place?
All I can say is the common Israeli do not act or speak of themselves as superior to other. It is just another weapon used by Jew haters to rationalize their acts.

They call themself "chosen people" doesn't that mean that everyone else isn't chosen. Doesn't that make them superior? To claim that your people are of such a significance or importance in comparison to the rest of the world is an excuse to rationalise their actions against all other beings on this planet.

reply to post by masonwatcher


Way to utterly miss the point of the thread. The question wasn't "do Israeli's have a right to oppress Palestinians?" the question was why the Gaza-Israel situation is getting so much activity while massacres elsewhere get little to no attention.

Seriously, step out of your rhetoric bubble for a second and actually listen to the questions before trying to answer them.



(btw, Ill post my personal answers to the questions once I get through the thread. I like the questions asked and I am interested to hear the answers.)

reply to post by RussianScientists


This post stood out to me as the epitome of ignorance and propaganda so far in this thread.

You, also, completely missed the point Raven made with the question she asked. You fail to comprehend a simple question which challenges the very logical of the explanation you just gave.

The question isn't "are you outraged and why?" its "why are you outraged about this, AND NOT these other events?" and it is a very legitimate question.

If your reason for following the Israel-Arab situation is solely based on oppression and slaughter, where are your posts about Darfur? Where are your posts about the slaughter of the monks in Burma? Wheres your outcry toward the Chinese government for the events in Burma?

Answer the questions that Raven originally asked, cause your original post failed to do so.

Main reasons for people following the conflict that I have seen:

1. Anti Semitic Views- Yes they are here. There are people who simply hate Israel. They don't care about the people of Palestine, all they care about are groups like Hamas attacking Israel. They don't care how many Palestinians die, they just want them to continue attacking Israel because they hate Jews. They disguise their BS with the idea they are fighting for freedom of Palestine, when they really aren't. They are here to find as many excuses and chances to kill Jews as possible. They will support ANY cause against the Jews, whether it be Hamas or other.

It has nothing to do with freedom, land, etc. and for them it is just about killing the Jews.

2. Anti-Arab Views- There are MANY people here, that also simply hate Arab people. They couldn't give a DAMN about Zionism, a Jewish state, or the Israeli people. All they care about is having the Israeli government kill those "terrorist Muslims" whenever they can. That is the reason they support Israel. They hate Arabs. They don't care if 100,000 Israeli's had to die to kill off the Arab race, they would consider it worth it. They consider it worth it because A. They don't care about the Israeli's dying, and B. they want the Arabs to die. They hide behind claims of self-defense to promote violence against the Arabs, wishing for more violence to erupt.

It has nothing to do with defending innocent Israeli's, defending land, etc. and its just a matter of how many Arabs they can get the Israeli's to kill for them.

3. Resource Relevancy Issues- The middle east is a big supplier of Oil. The place matters in today's current geopolitical world. The middle east will remain important until they run out of viable resources. This is pretty self explanatory. These people don't care about the Arabs OR the Israeli's, nor the innocents that die. Their only concern is money and resources, and how events in the middle east will effect their wallet.

4. Military Relevancy Issues- Israel has nukes, Iran is possibly going for them. No nations are more likely to engage in Nuclear war than the middle eastern nations. They are the most polarized and radicalized in today's world. These people are merely concerned with an escalating chain of events where irreversible damage is done. Against, this has nothing to do with the innocent people.

5. War- Some people just love war. They like watching the world burn itself down. They watch the situation unfold just like they watch all the others, and right now, this one is the most active of them all. They don't care about anyone, period.


I pretty much said with each one of these it has nothing to do with the innocent people because of this main point:
If it were about the innocent people, this would get no more or less attention than Burma, Darfur, Rwanda, etc.

This is not the case. So for anyone who is following this event in particular, as opposed to all equally, from what I have seen, these five explanation have fit their reasoning. They either:
Hate the Jews
Hate the Arabs
Worried about resource and money damages from war
Worried about military damages from war
Love war, and this one is the current hot thing.

Those 5 can pretty much summarize almost all of the reasons people follow this conflict so closely, yet not other massacres.

(my reasons in the next post.)

My reason for following this so much closer than all of the other conflicts and massacres is this.

Complexity.

The complexity of the Israel-Palestine conflict is probably the most complex conflict in today's world. This type of complexity can only be rivaled by the Iraq-Iran-US conflict complexity. They have pretty much nothing to do with Israel and Palestine conflict history. In that sense, they are two different events, with their own massacres.

The complexity of the Israel-Palestine conflict draws me to attempt to more aptly understand said conflict. I want to understand it because a solution becomes more challenging, since the reason for the conflict becomes more complicated. This means that because of the complexity of the issue, we are much less likely to find a simple clear cut solution to the conflict.

I am a person who loves puzzles and trying to figure out problems. That is why this draws me so much deeper than the rest. It is so complex and intricate that I am practically stumped as to how to solve the issue reasonably. It creates an enormous challenge.

Anyone who knows my interests with history know that one of my next favorite topics is the Iran-Iraq-US conflict, and it is for that same reason. So much happened to make it such a complex issue that a solution becomes harder to find, and thus more of a challenge.

That would be my main draw to the conflict. I am equally drawn to any situation where innocents die, but this conflicts draws me in more because of the challenge it presents.

Problems are meant to be overcome, and I believe this conflict is one of the greatest problems of our era. That is why I am drawn to it.

reply to post by ravenshadow13


People care about Gaza because it is a government killing civilians.