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Mandatory knife jail terms backed

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posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 12:03 PM
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reply to post by Retseh
 
Yes Detroit is bad specially in wrong area, I was working down there in daytime, guy came up and told me I was in wrong part of town. Then my guys were laughing at me when I made them all get down, when the automatic gun fire started up. But heck if one of them got shot in head my workers comp would go up.
But in Detroit you can go to ball game and get shot killed, if have nice car get car jacked.
I don't drink but when I did you would not catch me in bar.
But then again was in Florida, went in nice Holiday Inn hot spot, had on nice sport coat all slicked up, just went for one or two drinks.
Got set up by bouncers, they said I was drunk, had one drink, but did trip just a bit on rise in carpet, I said let me talk to manager, those guys jumped me, not to say what happened but once we got outside they got the worst end of deal. They wouldn't leave me alone once outside.
When the cops came I said arrest that guy that guy and that guy for assalt, they wouldn't arrest them and drove me down to my car, end of story. Only thing if cops had not come would have probablily got shot I was alone and not watching my back.




posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 12:31 PM
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I cant speak for the whole of the uk,but knife crime in up here in Scotland, Glasgow particulary is just damn well scary,i refuse to go out on the weekends to Glasgow.Because i know if its a regular thing i will be stabbed eventually,the city is the murder capital of Europe if figures are to be believed.I think stumason is leaving out one VERY important thing when it comes to neds or chavs as the english call them,binge drinking and alcohol is almost as natural as breathing in most towns and cities in the uk and almost certainly fuels the violence.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 12:37 PM
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From an older post www.abovetopsecret.com...

First gun control next KNIFE control ?

Due to the rash of knifing s in the UK they are introducing new measures to combat this threat !

Since people must be protected from this new scourge . The government will institute new regulations to protect our citizens from others or them selves .
All pocket knives can not have a blade longer than 5 cm and must be as dull as a butter knife .
And all butter knives must be firmly attached to the dinning room table to prevent removal from table and used to stab some one .
All steak knives must also be firmly attached to the dinning room table also .
The table attaching device must be no longer than 30cm .
All food preparation knives cleavers choppers or other sharp kitchen utensils must be registered with the local police department .
The licenses for sharp kitchen tools is only available after a thorough background check and a intensive training course for the proper use to kitchen tools .
All knives choppers cleavers ice picks or other sharp pointed object that can be used to damage another human being must be stored with a locking bladed cover to prevent accidental injury or unauthorized use .
While kitchen tools are in use they must be firmly attached to the kitchen counter . This attachment must be no longer than 60 cm long and be a uncut able material like cable or small chain with eyelets for the sharp object use lock .

heavy on the sarcasm !


[edit on 12-1-2009 by Lostinthedarkness]



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 01:04 PM
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Someone should start business in UK selling Kevlar t-shirts and underwear, could made a killing and prevent some at same time.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by googolplex
Someone should start business in UK selling Kevlar t-shirts and underwear, could made a killing and prevent some at same time.



Could make a killing



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 02:19 PM
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Besides the fact that Kevlar is completely useless against a knife .. But w/e right?

lol @ Kevlar shirts to protect from a sharp object.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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...over the last decade there has been a significant increase in the number of people sentenced for carrying a knife. In 1996, 890 people were sentenced for possession of a knife in a public place. In 2006 the total was 6,284. In the same period the number of those under the age of 18 sentenced went from 114 in 1996 to 1,226 in 2006.

Amid growing public concern, the government took the step in February 2007 of increasing the maximum sentence for carrying a knife from two years to four.
BBC Source

For many years the UK has played a numbers game when it comes to sentencing. If you were sentenced to a term of 5 years and under, you would serve only half the time. The only way to serve more than half would be through other offences committed whilst inside. The 2003 Criminal Justice Act changed it again.

Since then, admitting guilt would get the standard automatic reduction of 33%. The 2003 Criminal Justice Act would then take another 33% off. The mandatory 4-6 year jail term suggested by the UK Government is all smoke and mirrors to appease the tabloid media and it's public. 6 years becomes 2 before the knife carrying juvenile problem even walks through the gates of the prison. Add good behaviour and the current 18 day deduction due to over-populated prisons and the deterrent has no teeth.

A serving detective runs a blog and says this...


Fines? Fines? Paid off with a nominal benefits reduction or weighed off for a day in police cells. Community Service, see the above regarding the attitudes of those serving them. Asset confiscation? Failing in trumps. Right now, prison is an option that takes bad people out of the population but even this is being diluted with it being very hard to get time served of over 5 years no matter how bad you are. Cough the job when your bang to rights for the first 33% off and the Criminal Justice Act 2003 will lop off another 33% for you without your brief having to utter a word.
Source: Nightjack Blog

The kids that are carrying the knives and especially the ones that use them are'nt isolated entities. They come from communities within communities. They know that the chances of being caught by the Police is small. They know that the chances of the Criminal Prosecution Service taking them to Court is minimal. On top of that, they know that sentencing will rarely be custodial. If it is, it'll be short. They know this because they have friends and family that are in and out of prison.

I think the Criminal Justice Act needs to be overhauled so that a 4 year sentence means 4 years. Good behaviour has to be considered because it reinforces the supposed rehabilitation aspects of prison, but not to the extent that you serve a third. It's laughable.

I work with these kids. They are often excluded from mainstream education or just don't attend. They have broken families with pretty poor examples of responsibility. There's rarely a wage-earner in the family. It's all welfare, social services, alcohol and weed. Coke is going at £20 a gram, pills (X, Es etc) are £1-2. They aren't all bad people, but their actions can be.

Lock up the ones that are a danger to society and make sure the sentence is meaningful. The biggest thing, in my eyes, is to do something constructive to reduce the underclass of England. It's a growing problem that won't go away by locking them all up. It's far more complex than a mandatory jail term


[edit on 12-1-2009 by Kandinsky]



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 02:55 PM
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This is really annoying in the fact that it will be the innocent that get punished here.

Say i was cutting a box up, outside, to fit into a recycling bin/whatever.
on my property. then phone rings.

I need to go somewhere and fast. grab keys. run bus/taxi/train/place of interest.

Then someone, calls the police for fun, to get me arrested,and put in prison, saying that i carry a knife constantly...(you would be suprised, but idiots do this, for stupid things, like not saying hello as you walk past them..)

this is an example.

People will be calling police on builders/electricians/boatmen/survivalists/campers.

It's a tool. and a hugely nessesary one.

You could also hide a Garden shovel, in your pocket....

Why do People carry knives as a weapon?
To be macho. To feel supereor. If someone attacks you. you have a magic peice of metal, that makes them go away. forever..



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 03:48 PM
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Originally posted by googolplex
Someone should start business in UK selling Kevlar t-shirts and underwear, could made a killing and prevent some at same time.


Kevlar wont do anything against a stabbing but I recall more than one story from the beginning of the school year about parents frantically buying up "stab-proof" backpacks and other protection for their children. Encouraged by some high school football star being stabbed for his shoes or some such nonsense.

British buying stab-proof uniforms

School uniforms made slash-proof

Just a suggestion but... with a little tweeking this could apply to the stabby idiots running amuck awash in booze among the neutered law-enforcement.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 04:04 PM
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New member here.
Been reading the Jellystone thread since its inception.

As one who carries two knives daily, I think this kind of law is ridiculous.
I carry a large 4.75 folder, and a smaller one just like it. The large one is rarely used, as I do not want to scare the sheeple. When needed I use it, and no one seems to mind, even at work. I use the smaller 3.25 knife multiple times a day both at work and at home. No one seems to mind one bit.

I should also say that I have a Concealed Weapon License and carry two guns every day as well. So the knives are not for defensive use when I have two guns just for that purpose. Now just because I have that license does not mean that I go looking for trouble. I avoid it like the plague. But if I have to be in a bad neck of the woods, it sure is nice that the government trusts me to carry a gun. The local police here do not even comment on knives, as everyone has one or more. The local gas stations and corner Stop-And-Robs all sell switchblades anyways.

Why is it that in England guns are stictly prohibited, and yet they are so easy to obtain? I thought England was utopia! And you cannot even defend yourself in your own home? What kind of garbage is that? Here if someone breaks into your home, there is no question I can fill them full of lead, and go to work the next day. Its called The Castle Doctrine. your home is your castle and you are free to defend it as necessary. If you all would prosecute the criminals instead of the victims, you might not have this problem.

Try it sometime.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 04:44 PM
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It is clearly the people who are the danger, not what they happen to be carrying on their person. A good person with an Uzi is less dangerous than a criminal with a pencil. These laws are just a way of evading the real issue. Some people are bad and need to be separated from society. No amount of laws will make them safe to leave on the streets.

Those kids in the pictures with the knives would be no less dangerous with a branch off a tree or a tire iron from their cars trunk.

Only when society admits to itself that there are indeed bad people will we be able to deal with violent crime intelligently. It is the mindset that we can let violent people live freely among us that leads to out of control crime, not the weapons.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 04:54 PM
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reply to post by cbxer55
 


You CAN defend your home...with reasonable force. If a 15 year old breaks in unarmed to steal some jewellery, it wont be accepted if you stab him with your kitchen knife....but if somebody breaks in with a knife, and tries to harm you...you can stab them back.

Reasonable force... It's very easy to defend yourself in your house.


As for those on the street, why do you need to carry around a blade over 4 inches really, other that activities like fishing and camping...where you will likely be let off anyway. If you have a reason, you should be okay...


Guns ARE fairly easy to obtain, but not as easily as people make it out to be...if it was really as easy as some say, there would be more guns.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 04:57 PM
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Armed or not, you break into my house, you better be prepared to get hurt. That anyone doesnt feel this way is amazing to me.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 05:02 PM
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reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic
 


Why would I want to seriously hurt another person who means no actual physical harm to myself? Someone breaks into my house thinking there is nobody in...I catch him and he tries to run, he doesn't want to hurt me....I am going to stop him, but why do I need to hurt him.


If however he comes at me with any sort of weapon, I will do the same to him...the banning of larger knives limits one of the most common weapons he will use.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 05:04 PM
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I guess it comes down to your faith in man. if someone enters my house without permission, I consider that a threat. You are entering my sanctuary. There is no in between. You come in, you are threatening me. Period.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by StevenDye
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic
 


Why would I want to seriously hurt another person who means no actual physical harm to myself? Someone breaks into my house thinking there is nobody in...I catch him and he tries to run, he doesn't want to hurt me....I am going to stop him, but why do I need to hurt him.


If however he comes at me with any sort of weapon, I will do the same to him...the banning of larger knives limits one of the most common weapons he will use.


Also, the banning of large knives just means he will be carrying a kitchen knife, not a hunting one.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by StevenDye
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic
 


Why would I want to seriously hurt another person who means no actual physical harm to myself? Someone breaks into my house thinking there is nobody in...I catch him and he tries to run, he doesn't want to hurt me....I am going to stop him, but why do I need to hurt him.


If however he comes at me with any sort of weapon, I will do the same to him...the banning of larger knives limits one of the most common weapons he will use.



How do you know the criminal has a weapon until you give him the opportunity to use it... and it may be to late once that happens. Why do you think the criminals have no fear.. what's the conviction rate 5% or less...

Crazy.... If someone comes in my door or window in the middle of the night I WILL NOT chance my family's safety on hoping the guy doesn't have a gun or other weapon.... I seriously do not understand the thought process here.

If your criminals knew that they are risking their LIFE when committing home invasion or burglary your crime rate would plunge dramatically.

Hell, why not do crime there.... the people are in fear of being prosecuted or using "excessive force" in their own damned homes and the criminals have little to no fear..... so a 70 year old guy cannot shoot a 20 year old buffed out thug because it is excessive force? Nuts... so the old guy can hope he doesn't get his neck snapped because using a weapon to defend himself against an unarmed opponent will land you in prison?

Guys, that is moronic in my opinion... your home is your castle and you should have the right to feel safe in it.... and you would if you were allowed to defend yourselves.

And this ""the banning of larger knives limits one of the most common weapons he will use''

Do you think criminals follow the Law... are you daft man? They are criminals.

[edit on 12-1-2009 by infolurker]



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 06:18 PM
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Why don't they think about why people are carrying offensive knifes in the first place? Passing a law is just a scapegoat to not dealing with the problem.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 06:36 PM
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reply to post by infolurker
 


Dont you know if somebody breaks in to your home you should ask them what weapons they have to you dont use unreasonable force. Also, if theyre smaller than you you should keep one arm behind your back in case of a tussle.

If they just want to steal something and cause you no physical harm you should show them where the item is and, if large or heavy, help them remove it from your home ledt they injure themselves and sue you.

When the hell did this "bend over" culture become the accepted norm?

Dont forget to leave your shed's unlocked. That gem was suggested by the authorities over there. If the door is locked after all the crook might get mad and smash a window.

When did the collective testicles of the UK ascend up into the pelvis?

Just be loud enough, drunk enough and carry a knife and the island makes you king.



posted on Jan, 12 2009 @ 06:43 PM
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You can take away thier knives and thier guns but if they realy wanted to they could probobly club you to death with a London Times.

People are always gonna kill other people it's been happening since the dawn of time.



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