Enlightenment. What is it and how do we know when we have achieved it?

Originally posted by Skyfloating
The stream of life diverges to many side-streams and then converges back into the ocean of consciousness...naturally. There is no need to strive to be ocean while you are a stream or to strive to be stream while you are an ocean. Water resists nothing and nothing resists it, therefore it naturally flows where it is meant to. You have the free will to choose your stream, but you to will naturally flow back whence you came...whether you effort or not.

SEE WHAT IS THIS CRAP!

So you think its ok to allow poeple to be ignorant in life because when they die it wont matter? Is this serial killer apologia?

reply to post by Wertdagf


serial killer crap? weird interpretation. The idea that we come from a state of pure consciousness or soul and return to it after death does not contain the premise that it does not matter what we do or dont do (imo at least).

reply to post by Skyfloating

My deepest respects, Skyfloating, but it is not true.

The 'waters' will flow to the half way or balance point, but the pivoting to the 'other side' (matter becoming pure energy, emphasis on 'pure,' not holy) takes Conscious Self-Effort...to rise above the Nature realm.

However, I concede a point here: Whatever has not Achieved through Conscious Self-Effort, and has not Transmuted it's Base Nature Into Pure Awareness (Energy), will indeed return to the One State, When the Refolding (Annhilation of the Universe-set) occurs.

Of course, many of us don't care to hang aroung in these lower levels of 'through a glass darkly' for billions of sequential-time years. This is validated, but I won't argue that point.

The Prophet of Jehovih said: A time shall come when the earth shall travel in the roadway of the firmament, and so great a light will be therein that the vortex of the earth shall burst, even as a whirlwind bursteth, and lo and behold, the whole earth shall be scattered and gone, as if nothing had been. But ere the time cometh, My etherean hosts shall have redeemed man from sin. Nor shall the inhabitants of the earth marry, for the time of begetting will be at an end. Even as certain species of animals have failed to propagate, and have become extinct, so shall it be with man. The earth will have fulfilled it's labor, and it's services will be no more under the sun. But the vortex of the sun shall be round, and the body of the great Serpent coiled up. In the place where the earth was, shall some of my far-off worlds come and fulfill the labor allotted to them. And the atmosphereans who have not been redeemed from darkness in that day, shall alight on the new world and also fulfill their labor. (OAHSPE, 1884; channeled from Algonquin [immaterial] masters to author John Ballou Newbrough)

Fictional? Hardly. The Universe is quite Mysterious. Time has many Aspects. In 'the End,' it may seem all One, because it will be.

But the Rounds Begin Anew, All Over! And the last ones home, don't/won't have much to say...just like on Earth and in society.

As Above, So below; As Within, So Without.

[edit on 12-1-2009 by SS,Naga]

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by Wertdagf

 

serial killer crap? weird interpretation. The idea that we come from a state of pure consciousness or soul and return to it after death does not contain the premise that it does not matter what we do or dont do (imo at least).

So you have some delusion that you come form a state of pure conciousness why?

David wilcocks again?... this guy is screwing more people up than you can imagine.

That junk you wrote does not help anyone udnerstand the thing that go on in their lives.. Do you think that making up some wording that explains your pure superstition is good for anyone? Does that not give everyone permission to validate their own delusions with some ambiguous paragraph?

Arent you just digging a bigger hole for everyone when you lean on mysticism?

JUST LOOK HOW EVERYONE leans of this ignorant faith as a way to coduct and understand their lives..

There are real logical reasons to love everyone... there are logical reasons to forgive....NONE of them INCLUDE JESUS... OR CRYSTALS OR SOME UNIFIED CONCIOUSNESS FIeLD.

[edit on 12-1-2009 by Wertdagf]

That may be a bit of a mis-interpretation of my analogy. Im not saying it doesnt matter what is done within the stream.

I am saying that too much focussing on the ocean makes ones movements within the stream a bit awkward because one is not enjoying the current stream.

If you look a bit deeper behind "striving for enlightenment" you will often (not always) find the underlying thought: "Life sucks".

And "life sucks" is no path to enlightenment, imo.

Originally posted by Wertdagf


David wilcocks again?... this guy is screwing more people up than you can imagine.

Hmmmm. Hence his name. You know in the old days your name offered practical information about you. We really should have seen this coming. No pun intended.

reply to post by Mr Green


A word from Buddha himself:

"Meditation is like the pillar of a mountain, nirvana is like a nightmare in daylight."

Or something very similar....

I don't discourage people from achieving ultimate enlightenment. It helps you relate to everything and anything... but I don't know if it is something super mystical, or something more common that we've just forgotten about. I've experienced mystical magical things, but I think of these things as just like parlor tricks. It's a novelty. That's all anything is. It's a God videogame we're in.... and we are not even we. We are the all seeing I, and the illusion of individualism is like zooming in on a certain part of a kaleidescopic image. Consciousness is fractal in nature... and the truth is that the "spirit" is more like a tentacle of the same essence. Looking at it in an allegorical way, you see a tree, and the tree spreads off into individual branches... and sometimes you may focus on a branch and go "that is a branch" but most of the time... it's just all one tree, and you are only focused on an individual branch for a moment.

Since this is a God videogame... we and our ways have become boring and monotonous... and we either want a new videogame, or we want to advance to the next level AT LEAST, get some cool new upgrades, yada yada....

but if you've grow out of playing videogames, you are just staring at a bunch of moving patterns interacting and changing.... and the only meaning it has is the one you give it.... but if you knew that there was no meaning and you tried making a meaning.... it's like waiting for Santa to come down the chimney when you know he's not real. You'll give up and you'll just watch the patterns appear and disappear into infinity... and that is why you should try to forget it once you know. You'll just naturally become a better person, even trying to forget it. You can never truly forget it. It becomes that little voice in the back of your head, reminding you whenever you are about to judge someone or something that "remember.... you're only judging yourself".

There are many more people than you realize who are enlightened ultimately, but you would never know unless you knew what they knew...
people "enlightened" don't really like to talk about it. It's not fear as much as it is absolute void. It's complete absence of anything. People don't like no-thing-ness. I don't blame them. We're meant to be people, to figure things out in the context of humanity... and when something comes along and says "all your pride and love and achievement means nothing and will within the blink of an eternal eye be gone".

Ultimate enlightenment transcends any chakras or spirit guides or astral adventures or any of that stuff. Ultimate enlightenment is not a magic trick or something to be treated lightly. Ultimate enlightenment is transcending the illusion. Many people have gone absolutely insane when they finally see.

I don't know. It's just not something our "sanity" can constatly handle knowing because it destroys all illusion of anything, whatever density or plane it's on.

I'm not comfortable talking about this much anymore... sorry if my replies are sparse.

reply to post by Skyfloating

I don't know if you were addressing my reply post, or some other, but this is also quite experiential!

I Agree.

Glad somebody is enjoying the ride down here!

reply to post by Wertdagf


For the purpose of relating to the OP I temporarily occupy the standpoint of a pure consciousness being that which the OP aspires to. And in this context I offer an additional viewpoint of that aspiration possibly not being necessary...at least not in the escapist sense that it is used by many.

I do not know who Wilcock is, sorry.

reply to post by Skyfloating


So what would be pure conciousness? Knowing that jesus loves you? Knowing that your soul is a hologram? Your allowing poeple to fill in what they find acceptable so you can appear to agree. You need to cut through this mumbo jumbo... dont let allow others to take this and run with it in their own ignroance.

reply to post by Wertdagf


When I was young, it seemed that life was so wonderful,
A miracle, oh it was beautiful, magical.
And all the birds in the trees, well theyd be singing so happily,
Joyfully, playfully watching me.
But then they send me away to teach me how to be sensible,
Logical, responsible, practical.
And they showed me a world where I could be so dependable,
Clinical, intellectual, cynical.

There are times when all the worlds asleep,
The questions run too deep
For such a simple man.
Wont you please, please tell me what weve learned
I know it sounds absurd
But please tell me who I am.

Now watch what you say or theyll be calling you a radical,
Liberal, fanatical, criminal.
Wont you sign up your name, we'd like to feel youre
Acceptable, respectable, presentable, a vegetable!

At night, when all the worlds asleep,
The questions run so deep
For such a simple man.
Wont you please, please tell me what weve learned
I know it sounds absurd
But please tell me who I am.

Delusional
I believe I can cure it all for you, dear
Coax or trick or drive or
drag the demons from you
Make it right for you sleeping beauty
Truly thought
I can magically heal you

You're far beyond a visible sign of your awakening
Failing miserably to rescue

Sleeping Beauty

Drunk on ego
Truly thought I could make it right
If I kissed you one more time to
Help you face the nightmare
But you're far too poisoned for me
Such a fool to think that I can wake you from your slumber
That I could actually heal you..

Sleeping Beauty
Poisoned and hopeless
You're far beyond a visible sign of your awakening
Failing miserably to find a way to comfort you

Far beyond a visible sign of your awakening
And hiding from some poisoned memory

Poisoned and hopeless
Sleeping Beauty

reply to post by Wertdagf


We`re just having a little coffee-chat. Exploring stuff. Nothing serious.

[edit on 12-1-2009 by Skyfloating]

reply to post by SS,Naga


yep, that was a reply to you.

reply to post by Wertdagf


and what are your views on UFOs?

Life on other planets is highly probable. Life can occur naturaly or through gentic manipulation by a more advanced species. The theory that we were geneticly modified by an advanced speices would explain the many cultural and spiritual referances.

Skyfloating i dont expect you to imagine the pain that this ignorance can cause. This is very serious.. there is nothing more important.

[edit on 12-1-2009 by Wertdagf]

reply to post by Wertdagf


Well then, in search for objective truth, and since we have not found the Book of Thoth (one of the aliens that came in the origins of man) The one who was believed to have the most knowledge on the universe, why condemn what we know to be truths in our hearts? For what is truth in yours, is merely that we are false, yet you have not witnessed these things yourself.

Is it not you who is with the shortcomings? How is seeking enlightenment, delusional? We may express our thoughts in the limited confines of language, but truth can only be realized, so you must understand, whatever skyfloating says is true, but there is a barrier to understanding caused by you not being able to access her mind.

Language falls very short of truth, no matter how hard it tries. But do not condemn and discourage those who seek the path. This is the age of seekers, not seers, and the harder they seek, the universe will find a way to manifest the answer.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
The stream of life diverges to many side-streams and then converges back into the ocean of consciousness...naturally. There is no need to strive to be ocean while you are a stream or to strive to be stream while you are an ocean. Water resists nothing and nothing resists it, therefore it naturally flows where it is meant to. You have the free will to choose your stream, but you to will naturally flow back whence you came...whether you effort or not.

I like this a lot thank you. So much said in only several lines. Thanks for your post Skyfloating.

Free will is something that interests me very much, so much can divert us from this path, so much that we dont understand yet we are allowed to use our free will to choose. Many mistakes are made, yet as long as we remain true to our hearts we can make our way back to the right path. What happens to those who choose wrongly I wonder and dont correct this? Free will is a big responsability.

Originally posted by narin
reply to post by Wertdagf

 

Well then, in search for objective truth, and since we have not found the Book of Thoth (one of the aliens that came in the origins of man) The one who was believed to have the most knowledge on the universe, why condemn what we know to be truths in our hearts? For what is truth in yours, is merely that we are false, yet you have not witnessed these things yourself.

Is it not you who is with the shortcomings? How is seeking enlightenment, delusional? We may express our thoughts in the limited confines of language, but truth can only be realized, so you must understand, whatever skyfloating says is true, but there is a barrier to understanding caused by you not being able to access her mind.

Language falls very short of truth, no matter how hard it tries. But do not condemn and discourage those who seek the path. This is the age of seekers, not seers, and the harder they seek, the universe will find a way to manifest the answer.

Did the salem witch trials come from truth that was only in their hearts? You think its ok to say somthing as truth because you "feel it in your heart" well so did those preachers that thought those poor girls needed to burn alive.

What you have is a bunch of ignorant seekers who are going to take every peice of room you leave in your silly sayings and run with it as far as they can and use it to reinforce their own delusions.

You cannot allow that. You must seal up those holes. Love is not mystical.. truth is not mystical... good and evil are not terms that cannot be explained. GOD is not some magical being that anwsers your prayers.

You do not see the harm this does because you cannot imagine what will soon come. When the SHTF these people will flip and this mysticism will become a nightmare. This is how it always goes for evolution..

These things are logical... explainable... and when the truth is givin there is no room for mistaking what was said.

Originally posted by dunwichwitch
reply to post by Mr Green

 

Ultimate enlightenment transcends any chakras or spirit guides or astral adventures or any of that stuff. Ultimate enlightenment is not a magic trick or something to be treated lightly. Ultimate enlightenment is transcending the illusion. Many people have gone absolutely insane when they finally see.

I don't know. It's just not something our "sanity" can constatly handle knowing because it destroys all illusion of anything, whatever density or plane it's on.

I'm not comfortable talking about this much anymore... sorry if my replies are sparse.

Your probably right, to actually see all that there is is probably very disturbing. Im not sure many of us are ready for ultimate enlightenment, but maybe thats not the idea. Maybe we are just meant to wake up and see there is more to life. Maybe opening our chakras and feeling the love of the being within us is enough for this place in time. I feel some of the illusion has been removed for me but I hardly know how much, this partial removal has tested my sanity so yes I agree with you .

Its fine your replies are appreciated when ever you feel like you want to contribute.