This idea has been floated around for a while now, back since the original stimulus package.

House Republicans even put a bill forth to get this process started, of course the MSM never gave it any attention. (because the public would support it in mass) and it was subsequently destroyed.

Hate to break it to you, but with Obama in office and Pelosi and Reed running the rest of the show, we are going to try and spend and borrow our way out of this mess.

Hold on, it's going to be a long, bumpy ride.

Reform the tax payment system and go to a flat tax. That would result in HUGE money saving for the gov't. The IRS would be reduced by a large amount. The people, the paperwork, the time, the energy, the postage ... not to mention all the headaches that people have trying to figure out how to fill out tax forms.

That would be a great stimulus plan. Flat tax.

Originally posted by nyk537
Hate to break it to you, but with Obama in office and Pelosi and Reed running the rest of the show, we are going to try and spend and borrow our way out of this mess.

Hold on, it's going to be a long, bumpy ride.

Isn't spend and borrow the tactic the Bush administration instituted the moment the neo cons got into office.

It's not GOING to be a long, bumpy ride; for this small businessman; my ride has sucked for 8 long years. I didn't get no subsidies or bailouts.

I'm with FF; give us a flat tax and a huge sales tax on yachts and Rolex's and vacation homes. Time to give the middle class a break and stop taxing beer and beans.

[edit on 9-1-2009 by whaaa]

Isn't spend and borrow the tactic the Bush administration instituted the moment the neo cons got into office.

Yes it is, which partially why were in the mess we are in. Obama, with his infinite wisdom and "change" is going to continue this policy.

I'm with FF; give us a flat tax and a huge sales tax on yachts and Rolex's and vacation homes. Time to give the middle class a break and stop taxing beer and beans.

I'm all for a flat tax, or fair tax. All the way.

But it won't happen, not with Obama anyway.

Originally posted by nyk537
This idea has been floated around for a while now, back since the original stimulus package.

Oh, I hadn't heard it before then.

Hate to break it to you, but with Obama in office and Pelosi and Reed running the rest of the show, we are going to try and spend and borrow our way out of this mess.

Hold on, it's going to be a long, bumpy ride.

Don't worry, you're not telling me anything I don't already know.

As far as the long, bumpy ride.. seriously, I don't think it's going to be all that long, do you? Extremely bumpy but it's not going to take that long for the economy to be totally destroyed!

I'm with FF; give us a flat tax and a huge sales tax on yachts and Rolex's and vacation homes. Time to give the middle class a break and stop taxing beer and beans.

The last time a president tried this, can't recall which one for sure, it was either G.H.W. Bush or maybe Reagan, a huge tax was placed on yachts and all that happened was rich people stopped buying new yachts and yacht building company employees lost their jobs and went on unemployment.

Flat tax, now that is an idea whose time has come.

So I take it you folks think that Obama sits in a room with a notepad and comes up with these plans? In fact, these plans are not his. They are the concensus of economists and policy analysts. Are there desenting opinions? Of course. There always are. But Obama has apparently weighed these and has decioded to go with the plan that he has announced. Who knows what plan is going to work. If any.

I, for one, wouldn't want his job for a minute. Look what he has been handed. But we had all better hope that whatever he decides to do actually works. Because the alternative is not going to be pretty. And being able to say "I told you that Obama wouldn't be able to fix it' while you're standing in a soup line is going to be very, very little comfort.

1. Cut frivolous spending.
2. Cut some unneeded gov jobs starting at the top.
3. Cut some pay rates of the top paid gov employees.
4. Cut unneeded gov programs.
5. Switch to 20% income tax (10% to Fed & 10% to State) No refunds, no deductions, no tax breaks, and no shelters. Disband all other forms of taxes and fees to include sales tax, inheritance tax, etc.
6. Issue a one time $10,000 check to every citizen of the USA who is living within the 50 states.
7. Supposedly, we have 147.6 million ounces left in Fort Knox at $900.00 an ounce you would have a dollar value of $132.84 Billion dollars. Sell off half of these reserves to pay off our national debt. (We can always mine more).
8. Cut all foreign aid.
9. Stop illegal immigration. (Costs too much money).
10. Push ethics in the work place and frown upon corporate greed.
11. Push for energy independence.
12. No more bailouts.
13. Time to collect a little payback from the new Iraqi gov.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

alternative energy initiatives; investing in infrastructure improvements including the electric grid and broadband lines; modernizing classrooms; and computerizing health records. "The overwhelming majority of the jobs created will be in the private sector," he said, "while our plan will save the public-sector jobs of teachers, police officers, firefighters and others who provide vital services."

If individuals were given a tax vacation, we'd either save the money or spend it on stuff for ourselves. In 6 months, we'd be right back here. Obama's plan has the added infrastructure elements, whose effects will last for years to come.

Disclaimer: I don't generally support bailouts and stimulus packages and I'm not at all sure this is going to "work", but I'm willing to give it a try.

I agree that if individuals were given a tax vacation, we'd either save the money or spend it on stuff for ourselves. That's what the economy is! Us (you and me and our friends and family... individuals) working and then spending or saving. When we spend we support businesses that would otherwise "go out of business" (and people losing jobs). When businesses go out of business, their suppliers lose business and "go out of business" (and people losing their jobs), and so on.

When we save our money, banks have more to lend to individuals (to buy more things) and to businesses (to buy more supplies) and to invest (hmm in companies that would do more alternative energy research maybe?)... Do you see where I'm going?

Let's talk about the alternative energy investment example for a minute. We do need alternative energy investment but the way for this to happen is for government to get out of the way. Which in the current climate, is more likely to happen now. BUT we don't need the government "encouraging" this. Energy companies have smart people leading them that know that in order for their companies to stay in business they have to change with the times. When companies are strong (their customers are buying their products) they do these investments. When companies are not strong (their customers are not buying their products and they can't get financing) they don't.

As far as infrastructure is concerned, you have to have businesses open and operating in order to build things like roads, bridges, etc... The government doesn't build these things, contractors and their suppliers do. Yes, you do have to have someone "ordering" the work but this is mostly done by the states anyway (and should be). Don't you think we have corporations who are interested in upgrading things like the electric grid and broadband lines? Of course we do, but they need people (us again) buying their products and banks lending to and investing in them in order to be solvent enough to make these upgrades.

In a capitalist economy it all boils down to the INDIVIDUAL either spending or saving their money.

BUT... who said that the tax holiday only applied to individuals? It would apply to businesses as well. They would be freed up (financially) to pay into or off things like their pension plan encumbrances and other obligations that are currently forcing many companies and corporations out of business.

[edit on 10/1/2009 by Iamonlyhuman]

I believe Obama's latest proposal for a stimulus package includes rather large tax cuts, mainly for the middle class.

I know what I would do with mine. I'd save it. The way the economy is going, I'm going to need every penney I can keep. And I'm already cutting my spending down to what is essential. Unfortunately, most people would probably do the same. That would take a lot of money out of circulation, a mistake that was made during the Great Depression. Everyone stopped buying and started keeping what they had under a mattress (the banks were all failing) and the economy came to a halt.

Many well-known economists, including Paul Krugman, favor injecting huge sums of money directly into the economy by shoring up not only the banks but also businesses and industries that create and support millions of jobs. Also creating new jobs, to replace those that are being so rapidly lost, through work on the infrastructure, schools, green energy, etc. -- all the other programs Obama is talking about. When people have jobs and some degree of job security they spend, the solution to a faltering economy.

The idea isn't new. It's what FDR did during the Great Depression, and though it took about ten years, it eventually worked. There are naysayers who maintain it didn't work then and won't now, but many, many economists believe it is our best shot.

lets face it the money system dont work at all we need alternative energy initiatives and alternative food initiatives