If this doesn't open your eyes on HAMAS I don't know what will, page 1

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Topic started on 9-1-2009 @ 05:02 AM by johnny2127

So many people on here blindly defend everything Hamas does and has done. People defend them as freedom fighters, and say they aren't really terrorists. However, here are some facts:

They want to KILL all Jews and Americans. Yes that is evil and terrorism. So even those of you Americans that defend them, if they had the chance they would proudly kill you and your family. Indiscriminate killing of entire nations of people. That is what you say Israel is trying to do, so if Hamas wants to do the same thing you should have just as big of problem with it.
www.wnd.com...

Hamas is now wanting to target and kill innocent Jewish children anywhere in the world, not just Israel or the middle east. They admit this:
www.worldnetdaily.com...

It was Hamas that broke the cease fire, and it was Hamas the fired over 3000 rockets and mortars into Israel in 2008:
en.wikipedia.org...

Many Palestinians even blame Hamas for these events:
www.memri.org...
current.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.independent.co.uk...

Even many Middle Eastern countries find fault or blame to lie with Hamas:
www.iht.com...
www.guardian.co.uk...
www.aawsat.com...

Hamas self admittedly will not accept peace and will not negotiate. The Hamas Charter:
Article 13:"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences, are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement. Abusing any part of Palestine is abuse directed against part of religion. Nationalism of the Islamic Resistance Movement is part of its religion. Its members have been fed on that. For the sake of hoisting the banner of Allah over their homeland they fight. "Allah will be prominent, but most people do not know."
Article 15: I swear by that who holds in His Hands the Soul of Muhammad! I indeed wish to go to war for the sake of Allah! I will assault and kill, assault and kill, assault and kill!
www.palestinecenter.org...

The sad thing is so many people on here cannot bring themselves to condemn the actions of Hamas. You can both disagree with Israel and have a problem with Hamas. Same as you can support Israel but also condemn many of their actions. Hamas is the major cause of the events today, and if you cannot even admit they share SOME blame, you should look at yourself and ask why

[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 05:21 AM by 5thElement

Yet another "eye opening" thread...

Who exactly cares about Hamas ?

Do you think Palestinians deserve all they are going through because of them ???

People are dying, for crying out loud...

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 05:24 AM by ThePiemaker

stop it. just stop it. we don't need any more israel/hamas threads, especially clones of worthless threads. that other thread wasn't needed and neither is your worthless copy of that thread that just switches blame from one side to the other. I'm tired of the propaganda. you only choose the "news" that supports your side and conveniently leave out anything that makes "your side" look bad.

Don't choose a side. blaming either side is unnecessary, redundant, and stating the obvious. this is a mutual conflict, hamas is willingly attacking Israel, and Israel is disproportionately attacking Palestinians. Quit trying to pin this on one group. there are many groups responsible for the current situation, and some of them aren't located in the middle east.

These threads are worthless. Whose opinion do you really think you're going to change? You don't see all the other threads on this board talking about hamas/israel? you felt that israel wasn't getting enough support so you had to make sure an internet forum had more support for your favorite side of this conflict. It's stupid, so just stop it. Nobody cares, nobody here's going to change their minds, and nobody here's going to do anything to stop this conflict. so just quit posting new threads that don't bring anything new to the table. if it's breaking news, fine post it, but this is just pure fanatical garbage. Enough.

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 05:25 AM by Azador

These threads are like tennis matches my heads going side to side, side to side, watching both sides slug it out.Its getting tiring now and there will be no winner yay!

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 05:51 AM by johnny2127

Of course Palestinians don't deserve this. I am not blaming Palestinians. All I am trying to point out is the responsibility that Hamas has in all of this. So many try to defend them. I just am trying to show that much of the blame lies with them, and getting Hamas out of there will go a long way to ending this sad situation. Hamas will not accept peace so this will not end until they are gone.

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 05:57 AM by wise words spoken

Originally posted by johnny2127
It was Hamas that broke the cease fire, and it was Hamas the fired over 3000 rockets and mortars into Israel in 2008:

well if i was israel and u was hamas and i didnt allow your people to get any food what would happen? would u sit back while your people died or fire several rocket? to be honest if israel was cutting off my food i would nuke israel(just like israel nuked gaza)

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 05:58 AM by Bl0rg

Originally posted by johnny2127
So many people on here blindly defend everything Hamas does and has done.
[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

After this one sentence, your opinion suddenly became invalid. I doubt many people support hamas. Hamas doesnt not equal Palestinian.

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 06:06 AM by johnny2127

reply to post by wise words spoken

Again, the blockade was caused by Hamas's actions and their suicide bombings. Imagine if you lived in San Diego, and some in Tijuana were sending thousands of rockets over the border and landing in San Diego. Now imagine that the US asked repeatedly for the Mexican gov't to stop them, but they wouldn't. What do you think the citizens of San Diego would ask the gov't to do? Protect them. It may start with an embargo or blockade in the hopes that the people of Tijuana would stop the attacks on their own. But if it continued you could be sure that the military would step in and end what those in Tijuana was doing. But your logic would blame San Diego and it's citizens and the military.

I know this is a simple analogy so before people freak out, just accept that its a quick analogy to illustrate a point.

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 06:10 AM by johnny2127

Originally posted by Bl0rg

Originally posted by johnny2127
So many people on here blindly defend everything Hamas does and has done.
[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

After this one sentence, your opinion suddenly became invalid. I doubt many people support hamas. Hamas doesnt not equal Palestinian.

I never said Hamas equals Palestine. Of course that isn't true. Read posts in other threads. Most of the anti-Israel or pro-palestine people cannot bring themselves to condemn Hamas. They justify their actions. I am trying to show that Hamas and Palestine are two separate issues, and you can support Palestine and Palestinians but not support Hamas. Its like pulling teeth to get many people to admit Hamas is a terrorist organization or made mistakes or has committed unjustifiable atrocities. Its like people think that if they admit Hamas is bad it weakens their argument that Israel is bad. You can hate Israel and still not support the actions of Hamas people.

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 06:24 AM by wise words spoken

al-Qaeda does the suicide bombings who funded al-Qaeda? the united states... the united states created its own enemy. do you know that if you buy marijuana in the united states you are a terrorist? do a little bit deeper reseach.. as i assume you know about blackwater? thats a enemy for the future they will soon be terrorist. to be honest anyone that has internet can be claimed to be a terrorist because you can search how to make bombs on the internet- the gov't is watching to hard for any bright ideas

[edit on 9-1-2009 by wise words spoken]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 06:55 AM by johnny2127

reply to post by wise words spoken

The US funded the foundation of the roots of Al Qaeda but not Al Qaeda itself. Your comment is a stretch at best. Its not the fault of the US that Al Qaeda turned into what it did. Most of the money Al Qaeda has has come from middle eastern oil money, not the US. The US money went to the original resistance movements. And Al Qaeda is not the only organization committing suicide bombings. Hamas, Hezbollah and many other radical Islamic groups have and do.

The rest of your comments about Marijuana and Blackwater and internet bombs makers are more like rambling commentary. No one reasonable would say a marijuana smoker is a terrorist, so that is an absurd statement. The only correlation is research showing that many drug organization have ties to terrorism, and in no way did anyone then say a pot smoker is a terrorist. And if someone finds out how to make a bomb online, and makes one and kills people with it, they are terrorists. No way around that.

Respond to the topic of Hamas. Do you defend their actions? Can you admit their faults?

[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:12 AM by wise words spoken

reply to post by johnny2127

read my profile youll get a better understanding of what muslims are the tv has brainwashed you my brother

[edit on 9-1-2009 by wise words spoken]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:18 AM by johnny2127

reply to post by wise words spoken

I know what Muslims are all about my friend. Don't assume to know what my opinions are. My comments are about radical muslims not muslims in general. I know many muslims and not a single one supports Hamas, Hezbollah, Al Qaeda or their actions. They all condemn them and blame them for the view many have of Muslims. I know Islam is the religion of love as many call it, and the vast vast majority are peaceful, loving and compassionate people.

But as with any religion, be it Islam, Christianity, or Judaism, there are extremists. There is no defense of the actions of radical muslim organizations.

And you are proving to be another person with the inability to criticize Hamas or admit they have done a single thing wrong. Very sad.

[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:33 AM by wise words spoken

in my veiws hamas did what he had to do "handle your bussiness and kill no kids" as us muslims say. you are correct there are extremists in every religion for which hamass' people of gaza was starving for 2 years living off 2 dollars a day and israel is claiming that the people of gaza are spending that 2 dollars on guns!!! any man in his right mind would spend that money on smuggled food to feed his children. but israe is giving the people of gaza a chance to buy smuggled gun for the simple fact israel is killing the children of gaza that is all i have to go to work.. why coundnt the jews leading israel be extremists??

[edit on 9-1-2009 by wise words spoken]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:39 AM by johnny2127

reply to post by wise words spoken

The Jews leading Israel can be radicals of course. Never said they couldn't. Like I said, this isn't me saying Israel is great. Its about the evil that is Hamas and how they have lead the Palestinian people to this point.

So you think that Hamas as 'done their business' and killed no kids or innocent adults?!?!? Are you kidding? Where were you while they were having suicide bombers blow themselves up in Israeli buses, cafes and shopping centers?

How can you not even criticize their intent to kill Jewish kids world wide? Is there something preventing you from criticizing them? I know it not religion since the Muslims I know are highly critical of hamas, hezbollah and al qaeda. What prevents you from being critical of Hamas in any way?

[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

[edit on 9-1-2009 by johnny2127]

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:43 AM by munkey66

So hamas are such bad guys because they kill lots and lots of people, they fire lots and lots of missiles and using civilians as human shields.
Hamas fire rockets across the boarder and just randomly hit targets because as we know, there rockets have the accuracy of a bottle rocket.

so how bad is a democracy?
A democracy that is trying to spread democracy to another country by depriving that country of any type of medical aid through sanctions causing the death of half a million children.
A democracy that sold chemical weapons for this same country to use on its neighbour.
A democracy that has such accurate intelligence that they gave the wrong co ordinates to blow up a chinese embassy in belgrade.
A democracy which illegally goes into Pakistan and kills wedding parties.

you are right, Hamas are really bad guys, imagine what they would be like if they where a Republican or democratic party, imagine what damage they could then cause to more innocent civillians.

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:46 AM by wise words spoken

reply to post by johnny2127

in this fight the jews are wrong and i will not fight unless i have to protect my friends/family in the case of the united states being invaded i will kill anyone jew,christian,muslim,ect.. even if it comes to killing children i will control my ground as hamas has done only hamas not the other groups

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:52 AM by johnny2127

reply to post by munkey66

This isn't a contest buddy. I would rather someone be able to admit all of the sides you mentioned have made mistakes or are bad, than to just say one side is bad.

You want to bash democracy, thats fine. Thats an argument for another thread. Start it if you like and I'll be happy to discuss. But this thread is about Hamas. You did say something very truth though, even though I am sure it was unintentional. Imagine how bad Hamas would be if they had a ton of funding. Thank God they don't

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:56 AM by johnny2127

Originally posted by wise words spoken
reply to post by johnny2127

in this fight the jews are wrong and i will not fight unless i have to protect my friends/family in the case of the united states being invaded i will kill anyone jew,christian,muslim,ect.. even if it comes to killing children i will control my ground as hamas has done only hamas not the other groups

So is it Jews that are wrong or Israel? Broadly saying "Jews" gives off a certain connotation. And I assume you wouldn't actually mean all Jews.

So in your opinion, Hamas is 'standing it ground' when it kills innocent children? You must be joking. Horrible joke that isn't anywhere close to funny

reply posted on 9-1-2009 @ 07:57 AM by FlyersFan