Over 3000 rockets and mortars fired into Israel by Hamas in 2008, page 1
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Topic started on 8-1-2009 @ 02:32 PM by johnny2127
Many are quick to blame Israel, and argue that they broke the peace agreement. I think its important to remind people about the actions of Hamas that lead to this situation. In 2008, Hamas fired 3000 rockets or mortars into Israel.

en.wikipedia.org...

The border towns in Israel were on constant alert and most lived semi-permanently in bomb shelters. Israel warned for months that this would have to stop or they would invade. Hamas refused and we have the situation now. Now Hamas is placing it weapons placements and caches in civilian areas putting Palestinians in harms way and intensifying civilian casualties. People need to understand, this was all the choice of Hamas. The broke the cease fire and caused the invasion and now their a causing civilian deaths by making them targets. Even now, Israel says they will stop their operations if Hamas certifiably disarms. They refuse. This is all the choice of Hamas. Unfortunately, the Palestinian people are bearing the brunt of Hamas's twisted choices.





[edit on 8-1-2009 by johnny2127]


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 02:44 PM by johnny2127
reply to post by pieman


Not saying that either. But if this way a pie chart that showed responsibility, Hamas would have the largest chunk of the pie by far.

Why do many of you defend Hamas so much? Their actions are indefensible. My post is not about defending Israel, God knows they have made many mistakes, but more about showing many of you that Hamas bears the majority the blame. Hence for this to end, they need to be taken out.



reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 02:51 PM by Cadbury
Originally posted by johnny2127
Many are quick to blame Israel, and argue that they broke the peace agreement. I think its important to remind people about the actions of Hamas that lead to this situation. In 2008, Hamas fired 3000 rockets or mortars into Israel.

en.wikipedia.org...


Here's a post I made in another thread regarding the wikipedia page you cite:

Originally posted by Cadbury

Originally posted by Founding
A quick check on Wikipedia confirms rocket attacks came before the raid.

en.wikipedia.org...


These 'facts' suggest that rocket attacks came before the raid in that specific video. But if you look at the data on your source from June 19th, 2008 (the day the cease-fire went into effect) and the following days you can see that there were also Israeli raids at that time:


June 19, 2008

Through Egyptian mediation Israel and Hamas agreed to a six month cease-fire on June 17th that went into effect on June 19, 2008 at 6:00 AM.

June 20, 2008

Gilad Herman, an Israeli settler in the West Bank settlement of Yashif, unintentionally fires upon an Israeli when he launches a home-made rocket towards Palestinian West Bank. The rocket lands "meters away from a Breslov hassid who was praying in the area." No one is hurt.


June 23, 2008

A single mortar shell was also fired from Gaza late Monday night and landed on the Israeli side of the border fence. No organization claimed responsibility for the attack.

June 24, 2008

Three Qassam rockets fired from Gaza on Tuesday struck the Israeli border town of Sderot and its environs, causing no serious injuries but constituting the first serious breach of a five-day-old truce between Israel and Hamas. Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack and said it had been a response to an Israeli military raid in the West Bank city of Nablus at dawn on Tuesday, in which a senior Islamic Jihad operative Tareq Abu Ghali, 24 and another Palestinian university student Iyad Khanfar, 21 were killed. An Israeli Army spokesman said that Abu Ghali had been involved in terrorism and that he was "killed in an exchange of fire." The man killed with him was armed.


So, which came first? The Chicken or the Egg? Will we ever truly know?


Depending on who fired that rocket on June 23rd, Israel could have broken the ceasefire as little as 5 days after its inception.


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 02:51 PM by intrepid
Originally posted by johnny2127
reply to post by pieman


Not saying that either. But if this way a pie chart that showed responsibility, Hamas would have the largest chunk of the pie by far.


Really? From your source:

From 2001 when the missile attacks started until 27 April 2008, 13 Israelis were killed by Qassam rockets. During this time, for every Israeli killed by Qassam rockets, about 100 Palestinians have been killed by Israel.


Who do you think has the larger share of the pie now? 13 Israelis killed in 7 years. That's not 2 a year. And what brings on these attacks? Economic sanctions against Palestinians. What should they do? Just starve? Well they are anyways but when you're in a camp you do what you can. These ineffectual weapons are all they have to do ANYTHING with. Israel's gov't knows this and use it to win the propaganda war. It's worked forever but this is the digital age, they aren't getting an easy pass now.


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 05:25 PM by johnny2127
reply to post by intrepid


So the effectiveness of Israel's response to Hamas's actions means that they shouldn't respond? You blame this on economic sanctions. Why are there those sanctions? And from multiple nations mind you. Because Hamas is a terrorist organization that now runs the country, and they will not stop lobbing rockets and mortars into Israel.

Remember, Hamas is the organization whose stated purpose is the destruction of Israel and establishment of a Islamic state in its absence. The attempt to kill as many Jews as possible. Thank God they have sanctions and blockades because with better weapons they would kill even more people without hesitation. Israel just wants their people to live in safety and without fear. They respond to attacks, not the other way around.



reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 05:37 PM by johnny2127
reply to post by Wehali


20 Israeli deaths? What are you smoking? Single terror attacks in Israel have killed that many. Find new sources friend.

And calling every Palestinian death as 'innocent' is comical. Apparently you can fire rockets at Israeli troops and try to kill them, but still be innocent.


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 05:40 PM by blupblup
reply to post by Wehali


Now that is just absolute nonsense... Please only speak about this if you're going to be serious.

That is THE single most ridiculous statement I've read in ANY israel/palestine conflict thread!!




reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 06:10 PM by FredT
reply to post by blupblup


en.wikipedia.org...


Perhaps but based on Wiki, there have been 480 isreali fatialities as a result of HAMAS attacks.

This brutal attack alone has resulted in conservativly 700 deaths alone.

Heck the war criminal Ariel Sharon was responsable for anywhere from 800 to 3500 palistinians.

Really who is the butcher here?


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 06:13 PM by blupblup
reply to post by FredT


Hey, I'm not debating who is right, who is wrong?

I took exception to the comment made by the misinformed poster who said:

"In all these decades, Hamas caused less than 20 Israeli deaths.. while in
only the last 13 days, Israel has murdered over 700 innocent palestines.
Israel has murdered hundreds of thousand palestines throughout the same
decades in which Hamas caused those 20 Israeli deaths."


That is a blatant lie... decades of attacks... 20 deaths??

Come on... excuse me for denying ignorance.



reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 06:15 PM by FredT
reply to post by blupblup


Note I said Perhaps eh? I did not agree with his total either.


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 06:19 PM by blupblup
Originally posted by FredT
reply to post by blupblup


en.wikipedia.org...

Perhaps but based on Wiki, there have been 480 isreali fatialities as a result of HAMAS attacks.




Your own comment disproves what wehail said straight away?

i think you may have misunderstood me or something?
I have no idea why you are actually questioning what i wrote, when your own post corroborates what i have said?

very puzzled


Sorry if I'm missing something?


[edit on 8/1/09 by blupblup]


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 06:22 PM by FredT
reply to post by blupblup


I must be missing your point too

Lets just say this:

His totals are off. I agree 100% with that. But his message while exagerated still points to the fact that israel has massacred way more civilians in this attack alone than in a decade+ of HAMAS attacks.


reply posted on 8-1-2009 @ 06:23 PM by intrepid
reply to post by blupblup


I don't know where that came from but check my post above. Seems to have been missed in the rhetoric.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
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