Originally posted by Mikey84

Originally posted by desertdreamer
So let me ask all of you this question.

How many tours of duty is acceptable for any one soldier? Where is the line drawn?

However many is needed in the term they signed up for. I don’t know what the standard leinght to sign up for is in the USA (how many years, 3? 6?).

Everyone knows these things when joining the military, regardless of how dumb they may be or what the recruiter didn’t tell them, everyone knows the military is for defending the country should the need arise and you may have to go to war, everyone knows you have to agree to a certain term.

Your job is to defend the country, you could be in the military for 6 years and not even see gun fire, you could be in it 6 months and be shipped off to battle... that’s the way the cookie crumbles.

I can understand people running off if they were conscripted, but this is not the case.

Maybe they should do what they do in a lot of European countries, once you finish high school you do a year in the military (you don’t go to war) and then after that you go to University – it gives everyone a taste of military life but they don’t have to commit to anything long term, not to mention would give them great life skills.

Mikey

There are several choices when you sign up (at least when i did). There was 2, 3, 4, or 6 year enlistments. I found one of your comments interesting;

However many is needed in the term they signed up for

Remember when I said earlier in this post that I got out 2 weeks before they involuntarily extended everyone? What if I told you that some of my buddies that were not as lucky as I was, were supposed to get out after a 4 year enlistment and woke up one morning and were told that they had been involuntarily extended. This means that their enlistment just grew by at least 1 year, and that they were being deployed t Iraq. Now, I do not believe that is the situation that this young lady is facing, but those are the the kinds of things that happen when you are in the military.

Do you believe that those friends of mine still had a duty or an obligation to go over there, even though they had served "the term that they signed up for"? Here is an even tougher question. Do you think if one of my friends was involunatarily extended, and he went willingly to fight, and he had signed up for the College Fund money. Meaning, he would get X amount of dollars when he successfully completed his allotted term that he signed up for. Do you think that if he would have got killed in Iraq that the US Government would have paid that college money that he earned to his widow, or his family, or maybe even his kids? Let me know what you think.

Originally posted by desertdreamer

Remember when I said earlier in this post that I got out 2 weeks before they involuntarily extended everyone? What if I told you that some of my buddies that were not as lucky as I was, were supposed to get out after a 4 year enlistment and woke up one morning and were told that they had been involuntarily extended. This means that their enlistment just grew by at least 1 year, and that they were being deployed t Iraq. Now, I do not believe that is the situation that this young lady is facing, but those are the the kinds of things that happen when you are in the military.

Do you believe that those friends of mine still had a duty or an obligation to go over there, even though they had served "the term that they signed up for"? Here is an even tougher question. Do you think if one of my friends was involunatarily extended, and he went willingly to fight, and he had signed up for the College Fund money. Meaning, he would get X amount of dollars when he successfully completed his allotted term that he signed up for. Do you think that if he would have got killed in Iraq that the US Government would have paid that college money that he earned to his widow, or his family, or maybe even his kids? Let me know what you think.

I agree with you on that, it’s not fair to impose an “involuntary” extension as this removes the whole point of free will and choice. They should only be there for the time they agreed and signed up to. But as you said this is not the case with this woman.

As for the college money, I can see your point that the family should maybe get the money. At the end of the day, the person died serving and protecting their country, so I think that would be fair to give the intended college money to the family.

My whole point is just with choosing to sign up, she wasn’t forced to join and everyone knows and has a general idea what the military is about. You also have to look at this situation, if they didn’t punish her how would it look for other women in the force? Or women with children, would this hold them back getting moved up etc?

Mikey


[edit on 7/1/2009 by Mikey84]

Also, thanks to Drums and Mil for responding as well. Thanks for your comments, they shed light on both aspects of this story.

Originally posted by MilitieTempliSalmo

You chose to be out of harms way, not risking your butt to be shot down (thats what your "etc" means to be btw ) while having your license for free so you could go to private sector and buy one in the safety of your nest.

Or sometimes theres just some bad choices, the ones you end up sayin "holy s**t what have I done!"

I mean... sending a mother to iraq again whos already been there once is pure insensibility and some replies in here just show off how emotionless and heartless can arm-chair generals be.

Well my main reason for the choice was that I cannot commit, but sure I would prefer to go through this life without being shot at or have to shoot at someone. But at the end of the day if that’s what really scared me, I wouldn’t of taken Australian Citizenship, when I took the oath and got citizenship I signed and agreed to “defending Australia should the need arise” – yes we actually have conscription here, so should a war break out against Australia (highly unlikely) I would be forced to defend in the military, can I complain about it? No, because in reality it was a choice I made when I applied for Citizenship.

Yes she is a mother, but if you start making and changing rules because she is a mother, a woman etc etc then what else will get changed, how will that impact mothers in the force who do want to go to Iraq, will they be stopped from going and be left on a desk in the states?

Mikey

Still no one has answered and I’m just curious, do you have the “buy out option” in the US Military.

It’s if you want to get out before your agreement is up you can, but you have to pay back all costs that have been used so far.

Mikey


[edit on 7/1/2009 by Mikey84]

Originally posted by Mikey84
Still no one has answered and I’m just curious, do you have the “buy out option” in the US Military.

It’s if you want to get out before your agreement is up you can, but you have to pay back all costs that have been used so far.

Nope, the US military doesn't have that program.

Originally posted by Mikey84
Still no one has answered and I’m just curious, do you have the “buy out option” in the US Military.

It’s where if you want to get out before your agreement is up you can, but you have to pay back all costs that have been used so far.

Mikey

No....there is no buy out option. The only way out is through disciplinary actions against you (bad obviously), a medical discharge, or do your alloted time. I believe that there are a few other ways (hardship, etc.), but it has been a while. But I am positive that there is no buy out option. Do you know of one in another country? I have nebver heard of this.

Originally posted by desertdreamer

No....there is no buy out option. The only way out is through disciplinary actions against you (bad obviously), a medical discharge, or do your alloted time. I believe that there are a few other ways (hardship, etc.), but it has been a while. But I am positive that there is no buy out option. Do you know of one in another country? I have nebver heard of this.

Ireland does it – I know someone was in it for months and didn’t like it, it cost him thousands to get out. About 2 years after getting out and paying all that money he ended up joining again, lol... is still in it.

In Australia I’m sure they do it as when I was at a recruitment session about 5 years ago they explained it all and to leave was very expensive, you had to pay for every single thing that had be put into you (only fair you have to give it back) they gave us examples and the costs where around $70,000 and over. Weather they still allow it I’m not sure (can’t find anything on the website) but at the high costs, I doubt many people took that option and just stuck out their term.

I know it the UK you used to be able (only in the RAF) but it was something you had to apply for and be approved call PVR, and I don’t know if they still do it (someone correct me if i'm wrong).

I’m sure other countries might have something similar.

Mikey

Originally posted by Now_Then
She signed on the dotted line - perhaps a little more thought should of gone into that decision. Sorry but that's a truth.

Soz bud that doted line is BS if it means you have to kill innocent people and dont have a choice to change your mind
I fully support her action and wished more soldiers used there head instead of being brainwashed into killing machines.

We are all people.

kx