Destiny vs. Free Will

reply to post by Darthorious

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Very nice, and I really only think the first post in the topic is necessary to read, but a lot of people made great points, as you and the previous poster have made.

Free Will to choose whether or not to do what you came to do, its like signing a contract to do something, and then rethinking it later, but not even knowing you signed it to begin with... Im sure deep down, we do know, but for the sake of new experiences, we arent able to remember until a later time.

If you dont mind me asking, and I am being serious about this question, Who was talking to you, any clues?

thanks,

rekar

Buddy number 3 is correct.

Reading multiverse theory, I take it that each choice, however significant or insignificant, instantly opens a new universe with its own story. To visualize this process, you can imagine a froth of bubbles becoming more foamy every split second and every tiny bubble being created is a new universe, parallel to each other.

Now, with that concept in mind, here is an illustration...

You and a friend are sitting at a table with a deck of cards. Your friend picks up the deck and has a thought. The thought is, "I'll ask my friend to pick a card, any card" and at the exact instant that thought is created, the possibility of 52 new universes, parallel worlds, is formed like a ghostly cloud waiting to be resolved into a physical point by action. For if that expected action is taken, your friend will pick a different card simultaneously in a new and unique universe, one for each card in the deck. 52 new worlds now exist with their own stories being played out as each bubble (universe) expands inside the multi-verse.

Unless, of course, your friend says no and elects not to play the pick a card game. Then, in that instance, the quantum cloud of possibility collapses and does not form any new set of concrete realities.

Therefore, each possible choice presented in any situation is organized but cannot become real unless certain action is taken. Tibetan Buddhists call this cosmic process simply 'cause and effect'.

Informationally organized, new parallel worlds may die before being born and the ones that do become realities fostering more choices and more bubble expanding potential.

Each new universe is on a brane (as in membrane). The largest substance which contains the multiple bubbles or branes is called the 'bulk'.




[edit on 6-1-2009 by switching yard]

reply to post by switching yard

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Buddy 3 always has a nice way of explaining what goes on in that brain of his, hehe. I also agreed, mainly due to the very point you just made. I like the bubble analogy, as it explained the idea very thoroughly and smooth.

Thank you,
rekar

Hmm... Free will... what a load of crap... no one is really free to do anything really... thanks to laws, statutes, and the gray line between right and wrong. personally i live in this gray area. thats how i govern my "life" if i dont feel bad about it ill do it. once you free yourself from the "moral standard" can you have free will. as for life being predetermined.. if thats the case i want to find the prick that chose my life for me and shoot him/her in the face...


Life.. is choices.. its should i have the 10 beers while im hanging out with my ex who keeps flirting with me, or should i say i dont think so...(guess 2 on this forum know how that turned out >_

reply to post by Serinox76000

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WoW, honestly didnt expect to see you in this neck of the woods. Hows life treating ya there? Hehe, I Guess you decided to try and add a whole new category here, lol. Went from a mixture of both, to one or the other, somehow an agruement involving math, and you saying no free will and yet no destiny. interesting combo there, hehe.

Life in Blades Edge I bet is interesting is it not? hehe.

rekar

Great thread. Lots of great ideas presented.

I find that many people struggle to give their life purpose, to say they are meant to be somewhere or do something. Why? You are here. You are conscious in this reality and eventually your body will die presumably taking your consciousness with it. Its as if you are given the greatest gift in the universe and still want more. The only destiny i can think of exists beyond that death and it awaits all of us.

I believe my consciousness is merely a survival tool for the vessel of energy it resides in. And that vessel is just one of many extensions of one life force that exists in this location in the universe. After I pass on, the energy used to run me will be allocated to enliven something else. It is only what we contribute to society and history that makes our lives any more important than they are. As far as the universe is concerned I am just another blip on the radar. I understand many people cannot live with this idea but for me it makes my life all the more precious.

I think we have free will to do whatever our minds can conjure up. All this talk about things being preordained are based upon the concept that there is a future set forth. But I must again offer that time is just a measurement of a"progression" and not necessarily a "real" thing. A point cannot exist on a line if there is no line. Once again, this requires stepping outside of the limits of human perception.

Any aliens on the board wanna chime in?

reply to post by The Savage Khan

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Nice, I think many people struggle with the concept we are discussing here on this thread. It is really a matter of what everyone believes, imho. What a lot of people dont realize is that every choice you make has an effect, it may be just a small ripple in the water, but if you add enough of those ripple together, you can get a pretty big wave

rekar

reply to post by The Savage Khan

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Its a great way to all brainstorm atleast its fun to read others points of view.. oh and i made it into a maths thing after seeing the matrix post lol "sorry couldnt help it"

Still great thread

My destiny is to go down stairs and make a coffee!!

reply to post by theresult

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Welcome back, you havnt posted in a bit, thought you werent coming back . Yes, coffee is a must have, and somebody has to take on the task of making it....

reply to post by rekar

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Hey its good to be back rekar and thanks coffee all round hehe

Well I was reading thru today and its great how we can all debate this it seems we all know what it is.. its very real "destiny and choice and freewill and fate"..

Atleast we dont need to cry hoax lol

Best part of this thread for me is reading others point of views..

Oh and btw i didnt post becouse I was dealing with some maths thing on another thread "i was called a hoaxer" lol

reply to post by theresult

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Its all good, hehe, we missed you here, lol. Yeah, we all come to realize there is something there, whether or not we know what to call it just yet. but the concept is there for it and we all can see it like the sun in the sky.

rekar

reply to post by rekar

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Yea I see that aswell.. was it our destiny to be here with you guys?

If it was im happy destiny is here or it or whatever hehe

I think someone said it best with the putting paint on the invisible man.. that realy made me think alot about what im dealing with myself and my problem of mathmatics..

We are kinda doing that now with this issue "we are talking about it" but we dont see it kinda thing?

So whats your conclusion Rekar? Are you any closer to answering the question?

I must say Darthorius' post got me thinking. There is so much we don't know. Its like formulating a theory with less than 1% of the evidence.

reply to post by The Savage Khan

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hehe yeah its great fun tho!! I guess thats what lifes about talking with others about it and being able to take a view and not have to say hoax or show me the proof!!!! "gets boring" this is a very good philsophical debate and some posters have opened my eyes to things...

others have changed my fate just by posting on here i guess? or atleast my journy to it? im confused again lol

1+1 = 2 Phew im ok again!!

reply to post by The Savage Khan

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I actually done ever think this will come to an end, but At an attempt to show a conclusion, Someone once told me something, and so far, this is the only place it has fit good.

"It is all in the eye of the beholder"

Saying that everyone is going to have a different opinion and reality based on what they believe, and this isnt exactly down to a science, so we cant really come up with a theory from a mixed review of ideas.

rekar

reply to post by rekar

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You make a good point, I try to use maths to understand things.. but at the same time i think maths is flawed..

So I cant realy even work out wtf im trying to ask sometimes lol

Other peoples views help me alot tho.. I mean i do have a goal and a theory.. but its only relitive to me i guess.. unless i do Find something that can change everything.. and i aint but im showng or atleast trying to show others that maths is very odd on its own merits..

Thats why i used it in relation to the matrix film "very good film" I dont see what neo see's tho lol nore would i want to "kinda trippy at the end" lol

reply to post by theresult

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You speak about math alot. (BTW Math is both singular and plural so no 's' is necessary).

I am intrigued by your love/hate relationship with it. You say you are frustrated with its limitations. I offer that it is not the math that is flawed, but your comprehension of it.

Numbers are exponential just as the universe is infinite. So math has no restriction. The more complex the concept the more complex the math. This is why theoretical physics is so hard a subject. The more factors there are to cover the more complex the math becomes.

What do you think of this?

You are so correct.. Do you know You are right when you say this:

offer that it is not the math that is flawed, but your comprehension of it.

You are right I dont understand it why? Odd Numbers Infinity and PI

IS it me? or is it maths? Or both? I ditched maths.. But still use it.. thats my love hate..

Doing calculations is great if you know what it is you are calculating..

try to calculate something like God or How we got here and maths just will not tell you.. or it can but we dont know how to give value to something we dont understand...

Its all very odd indeed and maths to me is odd.. or flawed as i put it.. maybe its the wrong word to use? How i word things maybe i come across in a way i shouldnt...

And the reason why i say Math"s" is becouse there are more than one kind of math hence the S - more than one! even tho its still Math. ect

reply to post by theresult

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Im gonna have to go with what Savage Khan said about the maths part. It is both a singular and plural word. You can catch 1 fish, or 5 fish, same concept as math, you have many different kinds of math, but its still math.

Also agree on the complexity of math is completely relative to complexity of the topic trying to use it on.

This subject is fascinating to me. I would say the concept of many possible destinies for an individual is really an illusion because only one destiny can actually occur for each of us. It's just a question of which destiny gets fulfilled.