Originally posted by mystiq
The modernization of the middle east was halted and fundamentalist muslim began to be promoted out of Saudi Arabia, which has close ties to the US, and the west, and owns many of our businesses. I have a question. Why is it that the Bildenburg group, or the Rothchild's, DuPont's and Rockefellers of the world, and their henchmen, our leaders, the cia, and others, are hell-bent in dismantling fledgling democracies everywhere, and promoting ancient barbaric serfdoms, and fascism?

Because I see fundamentalism as their toy for suppression of people.

You might enjoy this book, I did
"Power, Faith and Fantasy. United States and the Middle East 1776 - Present"
- Michael Oren

We were so actively involved in the Middle East in the 1800s, I had no idea.


IF you like videos, there' s a few in CSPANs archives where he gives book tour speech about his book.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by pieman

why do they have a right to their own nation? who gave them this right?

The UN, and the people of the civilized world (not to mention that jews have always lived there to begin with)

And the Palestinians also have the right to their own home.

Unfortunately the Arabs refused a Palestine State back in the day.

[edit on 6-1-2009 by Skyfloating]

It's very important that you do not credit the UN with the creation of Israel.

What the UN did was propose the division of land for when the British Mandate expired.

The Arabs rejected it.

In the meantime, the Jewish people settled teh land and when the Mandate expired, there was no soverignity in that land.

They were there.. so they declared the Establishment of the State and then defended themselves in a war and survived.

That is how nations start. The UN did not form Israel.

Originally posted by blupblup
Well.... i will await this thread and i may have been a bit presumptuous, If that is the case then i apologize.
I look forward to reading the critical-Christian thread.

I once did a thread on Mind-Control-tactics used in Christianity. Recently I also had a thread entitled "Occultism is not Satanism". Not exactly Christian titles.

Or you didn't have time to do a decent post so you've just thrown out propaganda to see what happens?

Calling America/Europe/Israel "satanic" and "evil" and the Hamas "heroes" and "Freedom Fighters"...thats propaganda.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

I once did a thread on Mind-Control-tactics used in Christianity. Recently I also had a thread entitled "Occultism is not Satanism". Not exactly Christian titles.

Not even in the same ballpark my friend......
All religion is a form of mind-control/mass control and that's not even what you have done here...you are continuing the work of the MSM and christian fundies, in trying to equate muslims with terrorism and evil.

Calling America/Europe/Israel "satanic" and "evil" and the Hamas "heroes" and "Freedom Fighters"...thats propaganda.

I'm sure it is, But what you have posted is also propaganda
So your logic is like that of Americas, Israels and others... because they are doing it, so should we.
Hamas has launched rockets so that gives Israel the right to blow the crap out of innocent targets and people?
Al Quaeda "allegedly" caused the 9/11 tragedies to occur so we invade iraq....?
Hmmm... i wonder why??


Can you imagine if Iraq/Afghanistan had a military base/jail where they locked people up(American citizens) without reason, trial or a chance to be heard??
Seriously... think about that for a second, it would not happen because America would blow the crap out of said country/ies if that were to ever happen... yet the ENTIRE WORLD is against guantanamo and does it make a difference.... NO.

Propaganda is the dissemination of information aimed at influencing the opinions or behaviors of large numbers of people. As opposed to impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience.

Your thread is not an impartial view or a " I'm just telling the truth" type thing... there is a slant, Thus... it IS proaganda.

Originally posted by kettlebellysmith

Actually, I don't.

I do. And I can tell you now that what you said is false.

BuT I gey my news from Great Britian via Skynet and the BBC. I can only badr my opinions on my sources.

The BBC said that many of the Muslims in the United Kingdom and Europe were "fanatics just waiting to be told to blow things up?" That doesn't seem right. I watch BBC myself and am in fact watching BBC News 24 as I write this.

(I also read several news magazines every week. They all seem to agree.
What's the problem?

The problem is you're full of #. They may say that there is a problem with fanaticism in the U.K. and Europe (which there certainly is) but none of them will say anything close to "many Muslims in the U.K. and Europe are fanatics just waiting to blow things up." That's a fallacy based on your obvious prejudice. Only a very small percentage are radicals willing or perhaps even able to commit Terrorist acts, not “many of them.”

Originally posted by blupblup
you are continuing the work of the MSM and christian fundies, in trying to equate muslims with terrorism and evil.

I dont need christian fundies or the MSM to ascertain that there's something very, very wrong about suicide bombing for example.

Just because Hamas critisizes other bad guys, doesnt mean they are the good guys.

Your enemies enemy is not automatically your friend.