WORLD: Fanatical Muslims vs. The Free World

reply to post by Skyfloating

The maps and stats prove that the "oh us poor arabs and us poor muslims are victims of the big bad Israel" is not as true as many here say it is.

Tell me something Sky, if Israel are the victims, and the big bad arab bullies are just about to destroy them.. tell me any one arab/muslim country that is attacking Israel? .. oh that's right.. Israel are the ones bombing Gaza.. Israel are the ones who bomb Lebanon.

And before you use the rockets being fired at Israel excuse.. let me just say.. that both you and I know very well how the mossad operate. Is there an arab/muslim equivalent to mossad in terms of power, deception, or resourcefulness?

Originally posted by Majorion
Tell me something Sky, if Israel are the victims,

Hold it right there! When I say "The arabs are not the poor victims", that does not automatically imply that Israel is. Dont give these false "either/or" things.

And before you use the rockets being fired at Israel excuse.. let me just say.. that both you and I know very well how the mossad operate. Is there an arab/muslim equivalent to mossad in terms of power, deception, or resourcefulness?

Would you like me to give you the figures on the financial, military and intelligence power of states such as Iran, U.A.E., Quatar, Syria, etc.?

reply to post by Skyfloating

Hold it right there! When I say "The arabs are not the poor victims", that does not automatically imply that Israel is. Dont give these false "either/or" things.

Then what exactly are you implying in the OP? .. with respect, the message you're trying to send is quite evident.

Would you like me to give you the figures on the financial, military and intelligence power of states such as Iran, U.A.E., Quatar, Syria, etc.?

No, But I'd like you to show me an arab intelligence agency like the mossad that evidently operates on religion as evident by the symbol of the mossad below.

Let's not forget their famous motto;
"By way of deception, thou shalt do war"

reply to post by Majorion


The OP message is: The "muslims are the victims" = not the whole story.

As for the mossad: Yes, its mixed with religion. Im not denying that.

reply to post by Majorion

I never said the Qur'an directs Muslims to blow themselves up.

The problem is that there is such an ignorance about Islam, especially among Muslims! They are the most ignorant.

What happens is many are raised "Muslim" and go through the motions that they've been taught. Don't ask why, don't ask who said, they just take a lot of this behavior for granted.

Some actually convert to Islam, and again, they are taught the Qur'an, and usually, the translation is somewhat "watered down."

So then you have the guys, the Mullah's, those who know all the elements of not only the Qur'an, but the writings if Bukhari, Ishaq, Tabari, etc., and they start extrapolating the words of Allah, with the examples and words of Muhammed.

And that friend, is one evil selection of texts. Muhammed's Allah is a reflection of Muhammed himself as he went through life. He created Allah in Muhammed's image.

So when these dumbasses are shown, chapter and verse, and those words are extrapolated and combined, you have the most evil, destructive force on modern man.

It can all be summed up in one word: ignorance.

I realise not all muslims are this deluded and inherently bigoted... and that rabid extremism is a problem in most organised religions (particularly abrahamic ones) but radical islam does seem to be a growing phenomenon,especialy in the UK.

This is a report from the well respected British broadsheet newspaper the Times stating that 'fifty' per cent of British mosques are now under hardline,fanatic deobandi control:

www.timesonline.co.uk...

Almost half of Britain’s mosques are under the control of a hardline Islamic sect whose leading preacher loathes Western values and has called on Muslims to “shed blood” for Allah, an investigation by The Times has found.

Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain. The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain’s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.

Seventeen of Britain’s 26 Islamic seminaries are run by Deobandis and they produce 80 per cent of home-trained Muslim clerics. Many had their studies funded by local education authority grants. The sect, which has significant representation on the Muslim Council of Britain, is at its strongest in the towns and cities of the Midlands and northern England.

Figures supplied to The Times by the Lancashire Council of Mosques reveal that 59 of the 75 mosques in five towns – Blackburn, Bolton, Preston, Oldham and Burnley – are Deobandi-run.

A commentator on religious radicalism in Pakistan, where Deobandis wield significant political influence, told The Times that “blind ignorance” on the part of the Government in Britain had allowed the Deobandis to become the dominant voice of Islam in Britain’s mosques.

Khaled Ahmed said: “The UK has been ruined by the puritanism of the Deobandis. You’ve allowed the takeover of the mosques. You can’t run multiculturalism like that, because that’s a way of destroying yourself. In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It’s mind-boggling.”

Also Channel Four's very revealing 'Undercover mosque' documentary:

Google Video Link

A Dispatches reporter attends mosques run by organisations whose public faces are presented as moderate and finds preachers condemning integration into British society, condemning democracy and praising the Taliban for killing British soldiers…

Dispatches has investigated a number of mosques run by high profile national organisations that claim to be dedicated to moderation and dialogue with other faiths. But an undercover reporter joined worshippers to find a message of religious bigotry and extremism being preached.

He captures chilling sermons in which Saudi-trained preachers proclaim the supremacy of Islam, preach hatred for non-Muslims and for Muslims who do not follow their extreme beliefs - and predict a coming jihad. "An army of Muslims will arise," announces one preacher. Another preacher said British Muslims must "dismantle" British democracy - they must "live like a state within a state" until they are "strong enough to take over."

The investigation reveals Saudi Arabian universities are recruiting young Western Muslims to train them in their extreme theology, then sending them back to the West to spread the word. And the Dispatches reporter discovers that British Muslims can ask for fatwas, religious rulings, direct from the top religious leader in Saudi Arabia, the Grand Mufti.

Saudi-trained preachers are also promoted in DVDs and books on sale at religious centres and sermons broadcast on websites. These publications and webcasts disseminate beliefs about women such as: "Allah has created the woman deficient, her intellect is incomplete", and girls: "By the age of 10 if she doesn’t wear hijab, we hit her," and there’s an extreme hostility towards homosexuals.

reply to post by dooper


Exactly, you will find that problem is not with Islam but with Arab culture. Indonesia is a perfect example of a Muslim country that is not socially backwards. It is the largest Muslim country and the most prosperous. Arab culture is the antithesis of civilization. To them the Quran is only a means to an end. A means to hatred and ends to civilization.

Originally posted by dooper
So then you have the guys, the Mullah's, those who know all the elements of not only the Qur'an, but the writings if Bukhari, Ishaq, Tabari, etc., and they start extrapolating the words of Allah, with the examples and words of Muhammed.

Let me take the liberty of going off-topic just for a second (even though I've just been slapped with an off-topic today).. to say that that was the single most intelligent post you've ever made here on ATS dooper.

It seems for once you actually looked at the facts and fairly presented them. A big change from the once -hate site plagiarizing- dooper I first met.

However I've not once supported the bigoted Mullahs or the distorted, evil, and inaccurate Hadith, I said from day one that they are the problem and do not represent what Islam is really about.

Originally posted by Founding
Exactly, you will find that problem is not with Islam but with Arab culture.

Even though I mostly agree with dooper, your statement on the other hand proves your ignorance of arab culture, and that you have your own hate issues to deal with.

reply to post by Majorion


Let me help you because it seems you have some trouble. Let say someone says something ignorant then you reply to them with ignorance. Saying I have hate issues does not prove anything but your OWN ignorance. So why don't you reply with facts or coherent points, which would be much more helpful for a discussion.

The point I made about Arab culture is a well known fact. It is not Islam in itself because the Quran is just a book. It is the peoples (Arab) interpretation and actions stemming from the book. Then ask why is it that Arabs are the only ones that act and interpret Islam in such a manner. Which would lead you to examine their culture and social customs. Thus, finding that factors like polygamy, tribalism, and patriarchy all influence their behavior towards Religion.

The muslim and jew bashing on this thread was not intended.
In accordance with our new policies on Hate Speech this thread is closed.