I don't think any reasonable person on ATS wants to see the destruction of Israel, the US, Mexico, or any other country on the planet.

What we do want is the truth, even if it hurts and goes entirely against the propaganda that has been pervasive in American education and the media. On that note, we are always told that the Muslims are the bad guys, terrorists I should say, intent on the destruction of Western values/traditions and the worldwide conversion of all races and cultures to Islam. Some reactionaries believe that they are brute savages who cannot live in a representative republic and are perpetually inclined to be violent and kill any non-Muslim. Nevertheless, we thought the Native Americans were savages and killed them for their land by provoking them into a fight. While the Native Americans or, in modern times, the Muslims kill 2 of our guys, we kill or killed 200 of theirs. That's not fair and, as a Catholic, I think that any human is capable of attaining rational behavior.

The Muslims are capable of maintaining a republic, we just screw it up for them by keeping dictatorial rule over them (eg. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Egypt, and previously Pakistan). We make sure they have kings and not elected leaders, though we pay widow dressing through the Iraq. Don't Christians want the worldwide conversion of all races and cultures to Christianity? I always hear of missionaries going to desperate Third-World countries and converting the populace through distribution of food and water, as well as dispensing of some services ( like medical care). Muslims don't send missionaries to remote areas of the world, Christians do. They are not intent on destroying Western culture, we'll do it on our own. Just look at the moral degradation in Western societies and the large number of homicides in the US to understand what a self-destructive people we are. Muslims are human, no different than you or me. We just got to stop pissing them off so much by influencing their political systems, putting bases in their so-called sovereign nations, and not giving in to Israeli requests for foreign aid to use to make more weapons.

As a people, we never really asked why September 11 happened. Instead, we let Bush do the thinking, or reacting, through attacks in the Middle East. They problem of terrorism is not a hopeless cause and its not an inherent part of being Islamic. The problem of terrorism could have been solved after 9/11 if a smarter, less corrupt George Bush looked into the financing of the attacks. The financing was from Saudi Arabia and the hijackers were from there, yet the US and the West ignore the facts and play footsie with these jerks. By the way, why does Israel care so much about 2 or 3 people dying by mortar attacks, but they don't see the inconsistency in killing hundreds of Gazans? I mean, come on, cancer, heart disease, stroke, murder, and suicide kill vastly more people and we lead most humans to die? Why are we focused on the threat of dying by terrorism, which has a low probability, and not the threat of medical complications and disease, which has afflicted humanity since the dawn of man?

The Eggman

[edit on 5-1-2009 by theeggman1999]

Most people isnt anty Israel. They simply hate to watch when stronger,rich nation terrorizes its poorer neighbours.
And about new Caliphate wasnt it Americans that started it promoting artificial country, governed by gangsters and islamic neofites-Kosovo...
Peace

Originally posted by FlyersFan
unless you think there is an anti-Israel conspiracy with those that run ATS.

That's exactly what it is, along with the anti U.S. mob here as well. It just so happens that the anti Jew mob and the anti U.S. mob are the exact same people here at ATS. It is also a fact that they tend to be the most liberal...go figure.

Before 911, ATS was a great place to come to let the mind run free and explore the realm of the unknown. It was a place for X-Files geeks like me to congregate. But the original ATS is long dead. The new ATS was born within days after 911 and it has been sliding down the sewer pipe ever since. The anti Jew/U.S. mob have taken over to brainwash people into utter stupidity. I keep coming back here with hopes that things will change but I know it never will. It will continue to get worse and worse as time goes by. And do you know why that is? It is because it makes some people filthy, stinking rich beyond their wildest dreams. Whenever somebody says it's not about the money...it's about the money!

I miss the old ATS, I honestly do.



And Mike, I usually do not follow your threads about Mars and the moon and so forth but I do support you on this topic and I will star and flag you.

Good work brother!

Mr. Singh . You seem to forget that Israel did not exist from 70 ad until 1948 . Thats about 1900 years in which many different peoples of many ethnic origins lived in the area you term Israel. Israel only gained independence by TERRORISM ie by the Stern Gang etc financed by the Rothschild banking families. Ironically this originated in London and this finance killed British / Commonwealth citizens.
If a people dispersed over the world is entitled to use TERRORISM to take over a country and expell the inhabitants surely those same expelled people are entitled to use the same methods ?
If the Jewish people settled in the land now called Israel with out killing , maiming or expelling the long settled people surely the world would be so much safer and more peaceful.
As for the act of taking back land long lost for 1900 years surely the Irish / Scots / Welsh as Gaelic Celts are entitled to recover their homeland , namely the whole of Europe. And the Amerindians are surely entitled to take the Americas by force and expell thepeople there. The absurb notion of conquering long lost lands as some sort of "right" for only one people is not only wrong , unjust and unfair , it also brings the horrific notion that " if they can do it so can we." So Hindus can take Pakistan , Buddhists can take Afganistan, The Celts can take back Takkla Makkan in China, The Ainu of Japan can expell all the Japanese , The Arabs can take back Spain , The Germans can have Poland, The Polish can have the Ukraine & the Greeks can have half the world or at the least Turkey etc etc. The fact is simple if a group of people takes your land , your home & your farms by force you are entitled to fight back . Look at the French resistance or the Greek partizans of WW2 . Were they TERRORISTS ? I am no fan of Extreme Muslims or Zionists or any other group of Meglamaniacs or Control freeks It should be JUSTICE that is the mediumby which we judge any conflict situation. Bias is not a good means of examnining anything especially History and the current situation of the Middle East.Should we give give the Sikhs , Kurds , Basques a homeland ?
They are still living in their homelands which are divided between other countries.Where's the justice ?

[edit on 5-1-2009 by DimensionIntrusion]

Originally posted by theeggman1999
I don't think any reasonable person on ATS wants to see the destruction of Israel, the US, Mexico, or any other country on the planet.

What we do want is the truth, even if it hurts and goes entirely against the propaganda that has been pervasive in American education and the media. On that note, we are always told that the Muslims are the bad guys, terrorists I should say, intent on the destruction of Western values/traditions and the worldwide conversion of all races and cultures to Islam. Some reactionaries believe that they are brute savages who cannot live in a representative republic and are perpetually inclined to be violent and kill any non-Muslim. Nevertheless, we thought the Native Americans were savages and killed them for their land by provoking them into a fight. While the Native Americans or, in modern times, the Muslims kill 2 of our guys, we kill or killed 200 of theirs. That's not fair and, as a Catholic, I think that any human is capable of attaining rational behavior.

The Muslims are capable of maintaining a republic, we just screw it up for them by keeping dictatorial rule over them (eg. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Egypt, and previously Pakistan). We make sure they have kings and not elected leaders, though we pay widow dressing through the Iraq. Don't Christians want the worldwide conversion of all races and cultures to Christianity? I always hear of missionaries going to desperate Third-World countries and converting the populace through distribution of food and water, as well as dispensing of some services ( like medical care). Muslims don't send missionaries to remote areas of the world, Christians do. They are not intent on destroying Western culture, we'll do it on our own. Just look at the moral degradation in Western societies and the large number of homicides in the US to understand what a self-destructive people we are. Muslims are human, no different than you or me. We just got to stop pissing them off so much by influencing their political systems, putting bases in their so-called sovereign nations, and not giving in to Israeli requests for foreign aid to use to make more weapons.

As a people, we never really asked why September 11 happened. Instead, we let Bush do the thinking, or reacting, through attacks in the Middle East. They problem of terrorism is not a hopeless cause and its not an inherent part of being Islamic. The problem of terrorism could have been solved after 9/11 if a smarter, less corrupt George Bush looked into the financing of the attacks. The financing was from Saudi Arabia and the hijackers were from there, yet the US and the West ignore the facts and play footsie with these jerks. By the way, why does Israel care so much about 2 or 3 people dying by mortar attacks, but they don't see the inconsistency in killing hundreds of Gazans? I mean, come on, cancer, heart disease, stroke, murder, and suicide kill vastly more people and we lead most humans to die? Why are we focused on the threat of dying by terrorism, which has a low probability, and not the threat of medical complications and disease, which has afflicted humanity since the dawn of man?

The Eggman

[edit on 5-1-2009 by theeggman1999]

*what about reopen 911...,what about inside job....;just a question

Originally posted by mystiq
There is an enormous difference between hating an ethnic group of people, and condoning their massacre of innocent people and children. Its like the US going under the flag of the Eagle and dismantling democracies and setting up fascist regimes.

Isn't that what they're doing except they're dismantling fascist regimes and replacing them with extremist regimes?

[edit on 1/5/2009 by eldard]

Originally posted by DimensionIntrusion
The fact is simple if a group of people takes your land , your home & your farms by force you are entitled to fight back . Look at the French resistance or the Greek partizans of WW2 . Were they TERRORISTS ?

Just as factual, is that the "taker" is just as entitled to defend itself. It would be ridiculous to think they simply have to "grin and bear it."

I don't recall the French Resistance, or any other "resistance" group of WW2, indiscriminately aiming its munitions at the civilian populace, with a complete disregard for targeting military objectives. Regardless, it is possible to see from another perspective that, yes, they could have been labeled "TERRORISTS".

Huh....I wonder why the West Bank isn't subject to the same military actions? Might it be they haven't been lobbing explosives into Israel?

Meh, typical of the popaganda that both sides spew out.

Both sides are to blame, however, Israel has been quite disperportionate with its over the top responce. How many were killed by rockets? How many have the IDF killed in this one operation alone?

That being said it come back to the basic premise of this:

Any time anyone dares to critisize Isreal it is a typical knee jerk strawman that her apologists draw like a gun: They lable you an "anti semite"

"It is not anti-Semitic to criticize the policies of the state of Israel."
-----Colin Powell

The title of the thread should read:

I’m Sick Of People Not Buying Into Israel Propaganda Here On ATS!

and its companion

I’m Sick Of People Not Buying Into HAMAS Propaganda Here On ATS!


You are with us or against us smack of the whole Bush proclamation post 911. Quite frankly I expected more of people here at ATS

---

---