I’m Sick Of The Anti Israel Sentiment Here On ATS!

Not anymore. You're talking history here. Hamas has morphed into a hardcore terror organization with just one single-minded aim - THE DESTRUCTION OF ISRAEL and toward this end they will go to any extent. Palestinians be damned. Do you think they care? No! They are just cannon fodder.

Why have they rejected the latest UN resolutions for a ceasefire? Because they do not want to allow international observers to monitor the border. If they do, then it's going to prevent them from arming themselves to the teeth as they were doing by transporting their deadly rockets and other war like stores from Egypt, and also prevent them from firing their rockets into Israel. That goes against their strategy.

So how does one get about negotiating with an organization such as this?

In the meanwhile the casualties mount. More blood and gore on the streets. More death and destruction. Will the Muslim countries stop being silent spectators and have the balls to force the Hamas to shut the heck up with their rocket fire and come to the negotiating table as also accept the latest UN resolutions for a ceasefire?

Why are these Muslim countries just wringing their hands and not intervening diplomatically and politically in a more aggressive manner? Why are they being silent spectators? Why can't they pressurize the Hamas? Probably because they themselves fear a terrorist backlash if they do. Impotency rules the roost in the Muslim world, except Egypt which is trying its best to ease tensions and stop the war.

But will Hamas listen?

reply to post by NYCMedic

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Didn't your third grade English teacher warn you about run-on sentences?

Would you like to buy a few periods? Just having some fun here. No offense.

I'd try to analyze that "sentence" but it's too late, and I'm headed to bed.
Nite all! (Now there is a short sentence!)

[edit on 10-1-2009 by ProfEmeritus]

I understand that you're worried about every life that there is and all, but think about our army in Afghanistan and Iraq, I'm sure that we've had more than our share of lifes that have been ended even though we could have avoided it. Point is, that is what has been classified as 'acceptable losses' regardless of how acceptable it is. In any war/conflict/fight you have to expect to take losses that WILL happen.

Haven't you learned anything about the invasion of Georgia? It's not about right or wrong, it's about who can throw their weight the hardest. That's how it works. It sucks, but it's the way of things. I don't like it either, but I've come to accept it until I can make a difference.

I am amazed at the response of the world to the horror of the wholesale slaughter of people in Gaza. Abject apathy. Please note I say 'people'. The deliberate taking of life is abhorrent any which way you look at it. It is horrifying that an entire people 'the Jews' with the support of the 'conservative Christians of America' are practicing and condoning the 'ethnic' cleansing of another entire people 'the Palestinians'. The 'Hamas' (supposedly encouraged by the state of Israel) is without a doubt the result of more than a century of deliberately trying to get rid (ethnically cleansing) of the 'promised' land of its indigent population. The state of Israel came about because of the guilt of the Caucasians in using the same tactics on the 'Jews'. Only they ensured (aided and abetted) that some body else (the Palestinians) had to pay the price for their guilt. So no amount of trying to whitewash the horror being perpetrated on the Palestinians, is going to ensure that people who practice barbarity on others last forever. I am sad to say that. But the reality is a fact. The Nazi's practiced unimagined brutality on the 'Jews' and paid the ultimate price of being erased from earth for it. It is tragic and ironic that these very same 'victims' and their descendants are visiting the same horror on other innocents.
I also would like to point out that religion is the most divisive system designed by human beings and in its name have justified the destruction of life continuously without a break since the dawn of human beings. I also can only conclude that human beings are an anomaly in the 'scheme' of things if there is such a 'scheme' as religions claim.

reply to post by Kiltedninja

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"Acceptable loss" refers to military losses in an effort to achieve a goal. "Collateral Damage" is the term for innocent civilians and "non-combatants" caught in the cross fire.

What is making most so angry right now, is that Israel sees any Palestinians in Gaza as collateral damage. This flies in the face of international law.

Every combating force HAS A DUTY to protect the civilians caught in between, and Israel and Hamas are not even attempting to do this.

Israel, as the invading force, HAS A LEGAL OBLIGATION to protect Palestinian civilians in Gaza, allow aid through and tend to/evacuate the wounded. Instead, it is killing them.

This is never acceptable and cannot be passed off as collateral damage in any sense.

Again, in any other combat zone, if the UN were fired upon there would be immediate international condemnation. Mistake or not, Israel is responsible for the actions of the IDF.

There doesn't need to be any investigation.
Israel fired on and killed UN staff.

Why aren't governments around the world screaming about this one act? There's no debate that it happened.

I guess we've moved too far from history and can no longer see that we all refused to accept or act when our nations were told what the Nazis were doing.
Again in Sudan, again in Zimbabwe.

What is the point in having a UN and international meetings on such things if no government is willing to actually do anything unless it benefits them financially?
Could it be that nations are allowed to kill (lower the global population) as long as it's not "our" people?
Is a failure to act deliberate?

We should all be ashamed of our leaders for failing to do little more than speak harshly about the actions if Israel.

All of our global leaders need to grow some balls and actually speak on behalf of their citizens. They need to send a clear and decisive message to Israel that this will not be tolerated by a member of the international community.
They need to eject Israeli ambassadors now, and then state that if this doesn't end immediately Israel will face an international loss of support in every aspect and every arena.

That is the only thing that our governments can do today, and it will send a clear message to Israel.

Not disputing what you've said. But how about saying the same for the terrorist Hamas organization too? So I would rewrite your sentence quoted above like this, which seems to be more balanced:

They need to send a clear and decisive message to Israel and the Hamas that this will not be tolerated by a member of the international community. They need to eject Israeli ambassadors and Hamas representatives now, and then state that if this doesn't end immediately Israel and Hamas will face an international loss of support in every aspect and every arena.

So there! Let's not just keep screwing Israel. It's time we kick the Hamas too, as well as their international supporters.







[edit on 12-1-2009 by mikesingh]

Israel according to the bible is protected by God both in the old and new testament, both Jew & Christian holds this belief, anyone against Israel is against God, period. Recently I've heard a lot of comments by people "pretending" to be experts on the subject, not only are they not familiar with this belief but they would dismiss it as myth, it's not only not myth, it is the truth that will be seen by everyone in the world at once and become the number one news story world wide. Every muslim nation and nations supporting these muslim nation will eventually attempt to do what Hitler did, exterminate the Jews off the face of the earth, they will fail, even though it will be impossible odds, the Jews will survive.

The palestinians think of the jews the same way Hitler thought of them, they want to exterminate them off the face of the earth, the Jews do not think the same way about the pals, they only want to protect themselves and are protecting themselves, they don't want to exterminate anyone, that's the difference between the two groups, that's why one group is right and one is wrong, whether you believe in the bible or not this fact remains.

Wow. Razimus, I'm really becoming a fan. Someone utterly unable to tell the difference between fact, assertion, and myth. Your posts are inarguable simply because they're completely unfettered by anything as mundane as logic or reality. I might have a go, just for a laugh, until I get bored...



Sources? I mean just for that first part. As for the second, there are plenty of Jewish people who not only don't believe in God, they don't think much of Israel either, or at the very least the way they're acting at the moment.

As for the statement "anyone against Israel is against God, period"... is God someone who chooses sides or loves all humanity? Personally, if a deity chooses sides, it's not one I'd choose to worship or even believe in. This kind of small-mindedness is common to a lot of religious nutcases. Personally, I'd empty a small island in the Pacific (preferably one that's been used already for atomic testing) and let 'em fight it out amongst themselves rather than infecting the rest of the world with their pitiful superstitious nonsense.



See TRUTHINESS.

Myth? Truth? No, it's just your opinion. We've all got those. Can't wait for that number one news story worldwide, though! Anything that knocks Celebrity Big Brother out of the papers would be a welcome break.



No. The Palestinians think of the Israelis, the Zionists, as the ones who

• kicked them off their own land
  
• created the state of Israel through terrorism
  
• get a massive arms subsidy from Uncle Sam
  
• kill over 20 Palestinian children for each Israeli child killed
  
• want to exterminate them
  
• have deprived them of food and water
  
• demolish their homes and olive groves in the kind of collective punishment favoured by the Nazis
  
• have created an apartheid state in which Palestinians have no effective rights
  
• ... I could go on
  

I am sure there are plenty of Palestinians who know that there are plenty of Jews, both inside Israel and out, who understand their situation and sympathise.

Like Jews For Justice For Palestinians, for example. Which brings us to...



Well, I've just demonstrated that "the Jews" are not homogeneous. Neither are the Palestinians. There are differences of opinion in both camps. And the fact is, there are plenty of Jews who DO want to exterminate the Palestinians. Because of that stupid superstitious set of books you're so fond of (the Bible), they think they're justified in going in, doing a land grab, and committing slow genocide in Palestine. Have a look at this video.

At 1:43 onwards you have a couple of sweet old Jewish ladies. One says, "wipe them all out!" The other says, "there's only one way to deal with a cancer, you burn it out or you remove it."



Again, this touching inability to tell the difference between facts and assertions. Here's a hint. I've just demonstrated, to the satisfaction of any rational person, that at least some Jews want to wipe out the Palestinians. THAT's a fact. Your assertions, on the other hand, are the merest wind without anything to back them up.

It's quite funny. The Palestinians are actually MORE semitic than the Jews. Have a look at these guys, for example. A lost tribe returning to Israel. Yet "semitic" is derived from semites:



The word "Jew" can mean anyone of any background espousing the Jewish faith. So it's legitimate to argue that

1. the Palestinians are more truly semitic than the Jews and
   
2. if you're against the Palestinians, you're therefore being even more anti-semitic than if you hated Jews
   

Well, it's been fun.

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Speak of the Devil.......so hate filled.

Here's what Springer actually said:


Calling people zionazis and calling Israel "the apartheid state" was I believe what he was categorizing as hate speech.

You just never learn do you.

reply to post by rich23

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Absolutely on the money. At the heart of the creation of the Israeli state was of a racial ambition born in the dying days of European colonialism.

Conventionally, Europeans seeking to conquer foreign territories declared the land they were after as terra nullius meaning uninhabited land. This did not actually mean that the land was vacant of people but rather that it did not fulfil a set of arbitrary conditions that defines a recognised European state.

Often the only accepted idea of a state had to meet the criteria of being inhabited by Caucasians, that there were recognised borders (had to be recognised by a European power with a mutual accord), there had to be a head of state and finally posses facets of statehood like courts and parliaments in the European model.

It was within this mix that an atheist Hungarian Jew, Theodore Herzl, conceptualised and created the notion of Zionism within a Europe that was going through immense changes. The trigger for Herzl's motive was the infamous Dreyfuss Affair, the persecution of an innocent French Jewish officer as a traitor.

A year later, Herzl published a book which he called The Jewish State and soon after organized the First Zionist Congress. With these two acts Theodor Herzl set in stone the creation of a zionist state in the European model on the land of Palestine.

Israel was a solution for a Jewish problem in Europe with the catalyst being the Holocaust. Religious mythology, references to the ancients, racial identities and God's promise are merely devises used to create a sense of nationhood for a disparate group of people from across Europe that happen to practice the same religion. To incorporate the irreligious the zionist movement transformed an ancient practical religion to a racial identity that subverted and displaced the Semitic people that originally inhabited the whole of Palestine.

An excellent site produced by religious Jews of the Western European stream is

They are one of many spiritual Jewish groups that are appalled by the zionist construct and consider it a blasphemous desecration of the Jewish faith.

reply to post by rich23

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Did you even bother to research the actual data. Or did you just decide to stick with your intuition (ignorance) and propaganda web sites.

The evidence is in and the genes do not lie. European Jews (Ashkenazi) and Non-European Jews (Sephardic) have little to no genetic difference. They are the same one in same Biblical Jews, the Hebrews and Israelites of ancient times. As for the so-called Palestinian people there genes come from a much recent genetic flow, making them Arab. Check the facts before you make unsubstantiated accusations.

Thank you.

That is what so few defenders of Israel (and few Israelis) want to acknowledge - that Israel is simply the last outpost of European colonialism.

To address the anti-semitism angle honestly, of course, one must also admit that many of the founders of Israel were simply seeking a refuge from racist persecution. Very real persecution & genocide, no doubt.

There are no easy answers here.

Can't really understand what you are pointing at here, but you are using 'racist' and 'terrorist' in the same sentence. why?

[edit on 9/2/09 by Reignite]

reply to post by mikesingh

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I am a huge fan of the Israeli people. They have fought with Palestine for thousands of years and sadly it will continue. If the same thing happened here you would get the same type of split opinions from different people. They are protecting there own like our country's leaders are not. We could learn many lessons from them.

Well, Israel has a history of stealing more land and setting off explosives as an excuse to kill and ethnically cleanse more Palestinian people.

Not only that, those #tards killed my God. And are proud of it. As seen in this vid..

www.youtube.com...

[edit on 16-2-2009 by verbal_assassin]

[edit on 16-2-2009 by verbal_assassin]

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