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Originally posted by Byrd
A clone is a twin born many years after the original.
So, if you believe that babies born through in-vitro fertilization ("test tube babies") have souls and if you also believe that twins have souls -- then yes a clone has a soul.
Originally posted by Ambient Sound
In my theory, the soul/spirit is the actual being and the physical body is just a shell or game piece if you will. The soul/spirit is the immortal componant and exists before the body's creation and continues on after the body's destruction.
Why? Well, why do you play any game? To experience. Like any game, part of the fun is to set limits on yourself and your tools and see how well you can do despite
handicapping yourself in this way.
It does make one wonder about how souls are allocated doesn't it? Is it luck of the draw, or do we get a say in it? Did I choose to be a white male this time or was this just the next newly developed brain/interface that was available?
Anyway, I would say that a clone that has a suitably complex brain would attract a soul/spirit just as a normally developed one would.
Originally posted by Amarillo_Brice
Also it brings in the question of when are we human. At what point in our development does the brain become complex enough to host a soul? Does a foetus have a soul? has a newborn baby got a brain that has developed into a complex enough state in which a soul can be housed? If so, does an unborn baby? And at what point in the gestation period does that unbon baby get one?
We must obtain our souls at some point along the way (and not have them inherently), as we all start of as ameobas, the question is, at what point do we obtain one?
[Edited on 8-4-2004 by Amarillo_Brice]
Originally posted by Ambient Sound
You are correct. Those are the questions. If we had those answers, this disscusion wouldn't be nessisary would it?
I'm not sure that in this context I would assume that complexity equals quantity. It may not be a factor of how many braincells but rather the organization of them that matters. It could be that God has to breathe "life" into it as the Religious would maintain. It may be that conception does have some kind of metaphysical magic to it (in which case the clones are SOL, I guess). It may be a combination of those or something we haven't even considered yet. I'm certainly not trying to put this theory forth as fact.
I'm just trying to find a way to reconcile our science with the possible existance of a soul/spirit. If you accept the existance of a soul you have to start thinking about how it interacts with physical reality and what mechanism is involved. It's logical to assume that the brain is the link and mechanism since it is the only organ that cannot be removed, replaced or done without.
Originally posted by Ambient Sound
the brain is the link and mechanism since it is the only organ that cannot be removed, replaced or done without.
Originally posted by Amarillo_Brice
Originally posted by Ambient Sound
the brain is the link and mechanism since it is the only organ that cannot be removed, replaced or done without.
Yet.
Originally posted by Ambient Sound
No, I'm still going to stand by my assertion that the brain is the seat of consciousness and the interface for the soul/spirit. I think if we were advanced enough to do brain transplants, the soul/spirit would go with the brain to the new body, not stay in the old body.
Lack of Brain activity is what we use to determine death. It's pretty well known if you want to make sure you have killed someone, the best way is to cut off the head. Also, in humans, the Brain is at the top of the body for safety and a better view since almost all sensory organs are located in proximity to it which makes data transfer from those organs to the brain as quick as possible due to less distance the data must travel through the nervous system. The body exists to support the brain and to provide it tools to affect the envorment it finds itself in.
So, I guess the question as it pertains to cloning is, is the fact that you have a brain of sufficent complexity enough or does something outside of it have to interact with it to truely make a living, thinking being? If something has to interact with it, how is that triggered? Guess we'll have to ask the clones, because there is little doubt that someday soon, clones will be created.
Originally posted by Muaddib
The brain is just the "motherboard" of the body. Does the brain in itself have the energy necessary to make a body function? No.
As I was saying on the analogy of the brain being like a motherboard. The energy that is actually making a computer function is "electricity," which the motherboard cannot "create," since nothing is really created or destroyed in the first place.
The brain, just like a motherboard is what conducts energy throughout the body and interprets information.
When you feel hurt emotionally, for whatever reason, deeply hurt, as in your longterm relationship with the person you care about the most has just ended. Where is the first place where you feel hurt? is it the brain?