when will the Rapture happen?

I pray that I will not be left behind because when descibing tribulation will
be terrifing at the least.

to try and understand Tribulation and Revelation gets confusing for me.

after watching "The Moment After and Left Behind" these movies were
great but when thinking about the rapture reminds me did we miss it or
are we closer than we think.

Quite frankly, there is no rapture.To believe in a rapture, you have to turn a blind eye to many scriptures, for instance....

1Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
[...]
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1THESSALONIANS 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign forever and ever.

Scripture says the dead are raised first before the those living are changed to immortal beings, and the first resurrection doesn't take place until the last trumpet (the 7th trumpet of the seventh seal) is blown by the seventh angel, which is at the the end of the tribulation. I've always wondered how believers in a rapture explain away these scriptures. I've heard the excuse that Christ first comes secretly to gather the elect, but even that contradicts scripture, and that very passage itself says that this event takes place AFTER tribulation, and again talks of the final trumpet....

MATTHEW 24:
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28 For wheresoever the carcass is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

The is no pre-tribulation rapture, it is a blatant lie.

[29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:]

This does not happen at the last trump ..if we are to go by the seven trumpets of Rev ..In fact it happens at the FOURTH TRUMPET ..
Rev 8:12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.


The verses you quoted are about THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST ..not the rapture ...which there are people in heaven prior to the second coming ....


How do you explain these people in heaven at the FIFTH SEAL ?(WHICH IS BEFORE THE SEVENTH TRUMPET?)
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they [were], should be fulfilled.



You see there is alot more to it than what you think ...

I dont even think the last trump spoken about in Thess is the final seventh trump at all .(Rev had not even been written at the time Thess mentions the last trump so how could he have known about the seven trumpets when John had not even been given the vision till he was in prison ?) ...because there are many instances of where trumpets are blown ...you need to dig deeper into the trumpets in the OT with Israel ..
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
There is way more to it than meets the eye ...

Originally posted by Simplynoone
[29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:]

This does not happen at the last trump ..if we are to go by the seven trumpets of Rev ..In fact it happens at the FOURTH TRUMPET ..
Rev 8:12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.

The fourth trumpet talks of one third, the verse above does not. Besides, if you take the verse you quoted above in context, it is most definitely talking of the last trumpet, the return of Christ...

MATTHEW 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

The verses you quoted are about THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST ..not the rapture ...which there are people in heaven prior to the second coming ....

And does it or does it not say that the resurrection takes place at the return of Christ? And does it or does it not say explicitly, more than once in scripture, that the dead are raised first?

How do you explain these people in heaven at the FIFTH SEAL ?(WHICH IS BEFORE THE SEVENTH TRUMPET?)
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they [were], should be fulfilled.

Does it say these people are in heaven? Does it say the are resting? Where does scripture say that the dead rest? Does it say these people were raptured, or does it say they were killed?

I dont even think the last trump spoken about in Thess is the final seventh trump at all .(Rev had not even been written at the time Thess mentions the last trump so how could he have known about the seven trumpets when John had not even been given the vision till he was in prison ?)

Wasn't both of which was written by Paul and John inspired by God? Surely you agree God knew?

...because there are many instances of where trumpets are blown ...you need to dig deeper into the trumpets in the OT with Israel ..
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

As you just pointed out, this trumpet is blown when the dead are raised, which happens at the return of Christ, and which trumpet heralds that event? Simple, the last of the 7th trumpets of the seventh seal. Sometimes you don't need to dig, the answers are right there in front of your face, you simply have to open your eyes and admit that what you have been taught is incorrect.

Originally posted by doctorex

[29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:]

Rev 8:12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.

The fourth trumpet talks of one third, the verse above does not. Besides, if you take the verse you quoted above in context, it is most definitely talking of the last trumpet, the return of Christ...

Are you trying to tell me that you believe there are two events that will happen where the sun is darkened and the moon does not give her light etc etc ....because one verse says 1/3 and the others do not >? I have never heard of there being two events where this happens ....They are both the same events ..one just goes into more detail .......

MATTHEW 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And does it or does it not say that the resurrection takes place at the return of Christ? And does it or does it not say explicitly, more than once in scripture, that the dead are raised first?

Yes at the RESURRECTION (not the same as the rapture) and yes the dead in CHRIST are raised first even in the rapture ..those who died in the Lord before the RAPTURE TOOK PLACE ....then again at the end the dead in Christ rise first

Does it say these people are in heaven? Does it say the are resting? Where does scripture say that the dead rest? Does it say these people were raptured, or does it say they were killed?

So where are they given these white robes on earth ? And where are they resting ? On earth too ? And no it does not say THEY WERE KILLED ..it says they need to rest till those who are GOING TO BE KILLED are .......
And you and I both know the word rapture is nowhere in scripture ....so lets not even go there ...

As you just pointed out, this trumpet is blown when the dead are raised, which happens at the return of Christ, and which trumpet heralds that event? Simple, the last of the 7th trumpets of the seventh seal. Sometimes you don't need to dig, the answers are right there in front of your face, you simply have to open your eyes and admit that what you have been taught is incorrect.

You said it happens at the last trump which would be the VERY LAST ONE AFTER THE SIXTH TRUMPET ..not at the FOURTH TRUMPET as that verse suggests ...or are you saying there are seven trumpets blown for each seal ? Show me where it says that >?

I think you need to read more about the FIRST of the FIRSTFRUITS (Christ said he was the FIRST of the firstfruits which the firstfruits are not the same as the harvesting of the REST OF THE CROPS) ....and the HARVESTS there is MORE THAN ONE >>.there are MORE THAN ONE FRUITS to be harvested ..(Barley,Wheat, >>.There is also the WEDDING .......which CHRIST DEScRIBED THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN LIKE >.there are wedding GUESTS >>(Guests of the bride and the Groom )(Which I believe are those who believed because of the influence of those people in their lives ..Rev discusses this when the PRAYERS are answered etc etc ..........the BRIDE Is taken for SEVEN DAYS and HID from the world ...(They consumate the wedding during that time) after the seven days (represents the seven year trib) then everyone is invited to the WEDDING SUPPER which takes place AFTER THE TRIB ..thats when the DEAD IN CHRIST and those TAKEN ALIVE (Raptured ones) MEET UP >>>>.at the WEDDING SUPPER AT THE END OF THE WHOLE ORDEAL >>>(which is right after his second coming ) .................


[There were three harvests in ancient Israel's agriculture. First was the barley harvest, associated with Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. Next came the wheat harvest, associated with the Feast of Weeks. Third, the harvest of the fruits of trees and vines, associated with the Feast of Tabernacles and the Last Great Day. Many harvest scenes and other activities familiar to the ancients are associated allegorically and metaphorically with Gods plan of redemption and are used as type/pictures of events in the plan. The phrase, "for the harvest of the earth is ripe" in Revelation 14:15, indicates God deliberately timed His holy days to coincide with Israel's harvests.]



Notice there are THREE HARVESTS with THREE SEPERATE FOODS harvested >>(symbolic for PEOPLE) ....
(NOt to mention the FIRSTFRUITS that GOD required from EVERY ONE of them )
BARLEY
WHEAT
FRUITS OF THE VINE


Now tell me there was no significant meanings in those harvests ?
And that those three are the same and will be harvested at the same time ? They wont be ...One is Spring harvest one is summer harvests one is Winter harvest ...(Three seperate harvests ) ONE HAS ALREADY HAPPENED (THE FIRST OF THE FIRSTFRUITS was CHRIST there are MORE FIRSTFRUITS TO COME >>....and more HARVESTS TO COME >>

Seriously how can anyone just ignore all of that >?

I dont agree completely with this guy (there is just a few things in the article but the parts below I do agree with ) ....

"Harvest" is always the bringing in of those crops that have been planted, have grown, and have matured during that year’s harvest season. Ancient Israel had a harvest season that ran roughly from April through October. Most countries today in the northern hemisphere have a harvest season which runs through those same months.


Not all crops are harvested at the same time during the harvest year. Some crops are such that they can be harvested early, because they come to maturity early. Others are harvested late, because they mature late. Sometimes the time of the actual planting varies as well, and affects the harvest time. But regardless, the time at which each type of crop comes to maturity directly determines the time of harvest for each. You don’t harvest crops when they are half grown. You wait until THEIR time.



Israel had THREE phases to their annual harvest cycle. These three phases were directly related to the annual feasts which God commanded Israel to keep. God gave Israel SEVEN annual feasts, or holy days. These SEVEN feasts were divided into THREE groups, each of which corresponded to one of the THREE harvests of Israel’s annual season.
www.goodnewsarticles.com...

Each in His Own Time

The harvest seasons aptly picture "each man in his own order." You cannot harvest a crop until it’s time. There are many people in this age whom God has never called. But they are not lost. They are simply in another harvest season that we who ARE called are in.

This pattern of resurrection is again outlined in I Corinthians:

But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the first fruits of them that slept. For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first fruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. (1 Cor 15:20-25)



Paul tells us that Christ was THE first fruits of those who were dead and then raised. He hastens to add that in Adam ALL must die, but all who are in Christ shall be made alive. Thus, he says, "But each man in his own order." The word for "order" here is togma, which signified "that which has been arranged in order," It was especially a military term, denoting "a company;" it is used metaphorically in 1 Cor. 15:23 of the various classes of those who have part in the first resurrection. It was used of a precession after a great victory, when a winning army passed through a grand archway – each in his own "togma," according to rank. So we see, if nothing else, that in the plan of God there IS an order. Just as each crop in the harvest has it’s time and season, so does each person in God’s plan.



Paul actually tells us the order. He says, "Christ, the FIRST FRUITS." Then, "all who belong to Christ AT HIS COMING." Then, Paul says, comes the END – or to compare this to the words of Christ from John, then are the rest of mankind "harvested." In this progression, we see once again the same scheme as Jesus described in John. We see Christ, during the Passover festival raised from the dead on First Fruits. Then we see all those who accept Christ being spiritually raised during the Pentecostal age, and then bodily raised at the fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets. But there yet remains another festival and harvest: The rest of the dead – who were not of the Body of Christ. This would include all those who rejected Christ, but also all those who never heard of Him. Those who rejected Christ would be raised unto condemnation. Those who never heard will be judged and be given the opportunity to embrace Christ during the fulfillment of the Day of Atonement. The consummation of it all will be the fulfillment of the Feast of Tabernacles.

So we see that we not only have three festival seasons, which correspond to three general harvest seasons, but we see that each corresponds to the ORDER, or "togma" which is built into God’s plan for humankind.
SEE THE REST AT LINK >
www.goodnewsarticles.com...



Look why not just do some more studying ..and you will see there is more to it than everyone thinks ....What will you LOSE to just read more on it ? And study it a bit more (It is all in the OT in the feasts and the harvests) ..We all know that SCRIPTURE does not always point things out in BLACK AND WHITE ..you cannot just read it like a book and think you have it all figured out from just the LITERAL reading of the word ......if it did then we would not need the HOLY SPIRIT to DISCERN IT FOR US now would we ?

I dont have a thing to lose if I am wrong about a rapture ......you may have the rapture pass you right up because you dont believe in it ...(according to your faith so be it unto you ) ....................and because you chose to believe it was a lie .....then so be it unto you ....

Originally posted by Simplynoone

Are you trying to tell me that you believe there are two events that will happen where the sun is darkened and the moon does not give her light etc etc ....because one verse says 1/3 and the others do not >? I have never heard of there being two events where this happens ....They are both the same events ..one just goes into more detail .......

MATTHEW 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

That is because you are taking both events as physical, and this doesn't have to be so, but yes, if one instance talks of 1/3 being darkened, the other talks of it being darkened completely, do the math.

And does it or does it not say that the resurrection takes place at the return of Christ? And does it or does it not say explicitly, more than once in scripture, that the dead are raised first?

Yes at the RESURRECTION (not the same as the rapture) and yes the dead in CHRIST are raised first even in the rapture ..those who died in the Lord before the RAPTURE TOOK PLACE ....then again at the end the dead in Christ rise first.

So there are two resurrections that take place before the 1000 year reign of Christ? What does scripture say?

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Sorry, there is only one resurrection before the end of the 1000 year reign, not two, and that resurrection takes place, plainly, at the end of the tribulation, at the return of Christ.

Does it say these people are in heaven? Does it say the are resting? Where does scripture say that the dead rest? Does it say these people were raptured, or does it say they were killed?

So where are they given these white robes on earth?

These people are dead, it is a spiritual event. Notice it is talking about "souls", the actual greek word means breath, remember that.

And where are they resting ? On earth too ?

Genesis 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art , and unto dust shalt thou return.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

What is interesting is in the verse above, the word translated as "spirit" also means breath.

And no it does not say THEY WERE KILLED ..it says they need to rest till those who are GOING TO BE KILLED are .......

Are you sure about that? Read it again....

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellow servants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Look at it, it says to rest until their brethren are killed, just as THEY WERE, and verse 9 says they were slain.

As you just pointed out, this trumpet is blown when the dead are raised, which happens at the return of Christ, and which trumpet heralds that event? Simple, the last of the 7th trumpets of the seventh seal. Sometimes you don't need to dig, the answers are right there in front of your face, you simply have to open your eyes and admit that what you have been taught is incorrect.

You said it happens at the last trump which would be the VERY LAST ONE AFTER THE SIXTH TRUMPET ..not at the FOURTH TRUMPET as that verse suggests ...or are you saying there are seven trumpets blown for each seal ? Show me where it says that >?

What? Here is the verse in question...

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

This verse says nothing about the fourth trumpet.


[edit on 5/1/09 by doctorex]

[edit on 5/1/09 by doctorex]

Originally posted by Simplynoone

I think you need to read more about the FIRST of the FIRSTFRUITS

Believe me, I've done plenty. You are breaking things downs into different types of harvests, when there were two main times of harvest all together. There was the first harvest of the year (first fruits) and the second larger harvest at the end of the year....

Exodus 23:16 And the feast of harvest, the firstfruits of thy labors, which thou hast sown in the field: and the feast of ingathering, which is in the end of the year, when thou hast gathered in thy labors out of the field.

Exodus 34:22 And thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end.


The early harvest (first fruits) had with it a wave sheaf offering . Christ was the first of the first fruits, he was the wave sheaf offering that was raised before God during the week of unleavened bread. This is why Mary was not aloud to touch him after his resurrection until he had risen to his Father, they were not aloud to partake of the first fruits until the wave sheaf (first of the first fruits) had been offered up (Lev 23:14).

John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Read Leviticus 23:10-15, talking about what begins the count until Pentecost (first fruits) The first of the first fruits is the wave sheaf offering, not a specific harvest. Scripture and prophecy talks of two harvests, the first, smaller resurrection (the return of Christ), and the rest of the dead not living until the 1000 years are up, the larger resurrection, how can you ignore that?

1Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

[edit on 6/1/09 by doctorex]

I haven't been baptised, and I don't affiliate myself with Christianity.

I guess when the time rolls around and hordes of Demons roll around, I guess it's time for...



Ah...To battle to MIDI music...Maybe it won't be so bad after all.

reply to post by crazyjames65


crazyjames65:

Happy New Year to you

I don't believe we have missed the Rapture, but I do believe it is closer then we think. I know people have been saying that for years, but something just won't let me stop researching about it. I do fear for those who will be left behind (me included) it will be a most miseriable time here n this earth. All the more reason we need to stay close to God in our quiet time and listen closely to what he tells us and stay in contact with other Christians who will help us in our disceernment of events.

Keep the faith James,

Peace,
Grandma

reply to post by Solomons


I think it's funny when people say that Jesus never existed because it shows just how little they really know about the religion they're so ignorantly condescending. Jesus was real, no matter what religion you are or aren't. He was here just like Einstein or Hitler. (and no I'm not comparing Jesus to Hitler I'm just using it as an example) He was a real person, but the whole "believing" in Jesus is believing that He is the Son of God, not believing that he was alive.

Something to keep in mind in regards to scripture.

You are either being spoken to or you are not being spoken to. In other words, application of scripture is at a personal bases ("to you who are on the inside it is given to know the secrets of heaven, but to those outside everything must COME IN(side) parables") or it is a group bases (those outside).

What you are all speaking of is outside because, you have placed it outside of you and are awaiting it, but it is inside of you.

This is made clear by Jesus time and time again. Again it is made clear by Paul. You are the Kingdom. You are the shadow of things to come namely children. Children are the son of man. "Unless you become as a child you shall not enter the kingdom of God".

The same word that is used to invent the idea of "The Rapture" is the same word used for the "smite" of the cheek. Harpadzio...Have you ever "Harped" on something, get "caught up" in a subject. "To catch with the Palm". To smack you back into reality.

So indeed, the rapture is the smite of those being gathered out of the earth who offend by murdering the innocent. Who will that rapture take? The ones waiting for it, the evil and adulterous generation.

You live in Debt, or you cancel your debt and the only way to cancel your debt is to put the son of man on the cross.

Just as with outside/inside there are two choices here. One the tree of life and one the knowledge of good and evil. The tree of life is just what it says only we call it the "Family Tree". This is also called "crossing at the Jordan", which would not correlate in English because, Jordan has not been translated.
Jordan means "the Descender" as in Descendant.

So the tree of life is the passing of the spirit who's life is in the blood, being shed (in semen) to make a new creation "the place prepared" in the belly of the earth (woman), so that after three Trimesters or Tribulations a son (male in Hebrew means "Remembered") is born, male and female. This is the True Saviour of the World and the meaning of the name Jesus who has no form that we should see him. His name means "Self existent Salvation"...God OF the Living.

That leaves the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. You have heard anyone being hung on a tree is cursed forever. Jesus the Idol is hung on a tree and his image that we give life to as an image is false and is Anti-Christ. His name has been many names first being Adam last Eve for in these are all the rest. First was the living being and last was the life giving spirit.

Do not forget..."It is an evil and adulterous generation that seeks after a sign and none will be given except, the sign of Jonah (dove). For as Jonah was in the belly of the Leviathan 3 days and 3 nights, so to must the son of man be in the belly of the earth".

It is the Chief People that Murder "Self existent salvation/Jesus". The head is always unfolding like a lotus and is the reason that the kingdom of heaven (existence) is given to the children, who are not given or taken in marriage.

The Lord is not difficult and does not change. His ways are light and always living. What the world needs to work on remembering is who we AM together, a living body in whom the holy (hallowed) spirit dwells who's kingdom has no beginning and no end. The Baal of Hosts.

That is why we retain only a 10th and why the tide washes out every EVENing Time.

"Do not let the sun go down on your anger" There is a secret anger against the creator in accepting unseen salvation from an Idol who can not save"
By choosing the scapegoat of the Image, you give the image power to abominate till desolation is achieved of each family, the burden of Cain/Christ to complete.

Mark of the Beast. The Cross...x marks the spot. If you have accepted the cross, instead of real redemption, you are scheduled for termination, I know you won't believe that because of the strong delusion we are all under, but if you see truth as it has been since the beginning and realize true is easy, not hard and not magical, then the true Christ will appear in you and you will bring forth salvation in the light of a new generation as that is the only salvation there is...the living memory of you.

The only one Jesus could not retain, was himself Judas, all others he kept. It only speaks of the 12, not the 13. Jesus/Judas death cut the number to 11.

"I am Jacks burdening hate"...Love, Tyler Durden

Remember Jesus went willingly. The one who betrayed him also had his hand in the dish...they were both his hands. "Out of chaos, comes order" or "Let your left hand not know what your right hand is doing".

"Repent (re-think), for the Kingdom is at Hand"

Love


Son of Man/Thrown of the living God=New Generation
Two lampstands who stand beside the whole earth/two witnesses=Parents
4 Living Creatures=Grand parents
24 Elders round the thrown who cast in their "Crowns" at the feet of the thrown of God ( a newborn baby) Great Grand parents and Great Great Grand parents...The elders of him...Eloihim saying 9 times "Holy" or 9 hollowed months.

See everything for what it really is. It is right in front of you the whole time, if you accept a strangers death for yourself, you too will die for free. Not all who have accepted that are doomed as the spirit discerns the heart, not a religion or an Idolized image and thought. God always wanted you to be responsible for yourself and serve him only (mankind), not bow to Molech, but to be in the order of Molech Tzadic, the Rightious King.

Mork Signing off

[edit on 7-1-2009 by letthereaderunderstand]

[edit on 7-1-2009 by letthereaderunderstand]

Originally posted by doctorex

Originally posted by Simplynoone

I think you need to read more about the FIRST of the FIRSTFRUITS

Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

[edit on 6/1/09 by doctorex]

A fold, Approx. 14 Generations

7 Times (back and forth) I will pass over you.

Every 14 generations is one cycle of 7, male and female, spring harvest and fall harvest, beginning and end.

"I am Jacks Generational memory loss"...Remembered by Tyler Durden

Thank you Grandma,
Happy new year to you as well and I have faith but sometimes remain
quiet and just listen to what the holy spirit tells me.
I do still like to read all oif the near death expeirences, I dont know why but for some reason these events intrests me to hear when God tells what needs to be done and sharing the events for those who havent had these
types of things.
As for the Rapture I am still waiting and will pray for all who are left behind, because there may be a reason for this to happen.
When left behind there is still work to do for God, thats all I could think of.

reply to post by crazyjames65


crazyjames65:

By the way I like your new avatar.

I agree that we need to be in prayer for those who will be left behind. They will certainly need all the supernatural help they can find. It will be a very lonely time for those souls. I do feel that the Rapture is close. I have nothing to base that on. Just a feeling I have in my spirit. You know, be on my toes for anything happening.


Have a great evening,
Grandma

Originally posted by crazyjames65
Thank you Grandma,
Happy new year to you as well and I have faith but sometimes remain
quiet and just listen to what the holy spirit tells me.
I do still like to read all oif the near death expeirences, I dont know why but for some reason these events intrests me to hear when God tells what needs to be done and sharing the events for those who havent had these
types of things.
As for the Rapture I am still waiting and will pray for all who are left behind, because there may be a reason for this to happen.
When left behind there is still work to do for God, thats all I could think of.

James, I implore you to read the scriptures.

Jesus prayed for his followers that they should NOT be taken out of the world, but to be kept from the "Evil one". He will send out his angles to gather out of the earth all things that offend.

The only Rapture that is coming is that of those who offend to be gathered up and tossed living into the lake of fire...A giant Volcano.

The "Rapture" is part of the Strong Delusion poured out on people. The rapture is False and will only take the false with it.

Please folks...please, God is Blasphemed daily with this doctrine of men...and I stand boldly out and say to you "Re-think".

Jesus came that you might HAVE LIFE, which you have already, but also that you might have it abundantly.

Take up the load of a child who's ways are easy and light and follow them where ever they go, don't let your love grow cold. Don't "kiss" off your life, that can have "Great Reward", believing in untrue things.

I don't mean to offend anyone, but God is True. The rapture is not true. You don't get something for nothing. If you give nothing freely, you will receive nothing freely as Jesus will say, "away from me you wicked servent, I never knew you". Get to know the son of man, who is meek and LOWLY, forbid not the children to come to him.

The prince of this world has NOTHING IN HIM, and is thus removed.

Please friends,

LOVE Ltru

Think about what the "Twinkle" of the eye means.

We were all a twinkle in our daddies eye. I know people think it is bad to see salvation for what it is and this is the work of the serpent.

We are in the Garden of Edom/Eden and the snake is telling you that you will not be hurt by eating, moreover you will be like God having your eyes opened.

Ask yourself what "Paradise" Jesus was speaking of when telling the thief "he would be with him in paradise". It is a perpetual cycle if you are not born again of water and blood (new generation), not just blood (dieing).

Is their a twinkle in your eye, if so, then give that light to the earth as you were commanded so long ago. Be Fruitful and Multiply. Add as you were given, so give. You were given this life freely, not born in sin. Sin only becomes, when you stop taking responsibility for it.

There will be no blaming the image saying, "the serpent tricked me". Moses heighten the serpent/supplant, you are to heighten the son of man, as he is ascending into his world, the same world with a renewed outlook and time.

Jesus said to them that arrested him, "My world (time of being) is not of this place, if it were so, do you not think I could have 12 Legions of angles from my father?" He wasn't saying he was an alien, he was speaking of the times as in "the world to come"..."The time to come".

LOVE

Originally posted by crazyjames65
Thank you Grandma,
Happy new year to you as well and I have faith but sometimes remain
quiet and just listen to what the holy spirit tells me.
I do still like to read all oif the near death expeirences, I dont know why but for some reason these events intrests me to hear when God tells what needs to be done and sharing the events for those who havent had these
types of things.
As for the Rapture I am still waiting and will pray for all who are left behind, because there may be a reason for this to happen.
When left behind there is still work to do for God, thats all I could think of.

The ones left behind are the ones he is with. He came to those who did not know him. They will say to him, "When did we see you that we took care of you?", to which he replies, "to the least of these, so too have you done it unto me".

Do you think people will see in your post that, "I will pray for them" and think that you are being righteous or that it might make people wake up? You are rubbing it in peoples faces that you are somehow worth more then the next man and speaking of God, as if, you are regarded more then the next child. This is a grave mis-judgment.

I pray we all seek humility because you will either find it willingly, or you will be made it.

"Re-think (repent) the kingdom is at hand"

If you only knew how long I've been in prison being reformed from the confusion of my own vanity that should of been obvious to me the whole time.

God tells us things because they are so, not because he wants to be mean. It's like saying, "don't touch the stove". Regardless what you tell the child, the glowing orange coil draws a child want to touch it out of curiosity. A child doesn't know "Burning" and neither does anyone not remembering what is true (seen) and what is untrue (unseen). 5 Senses and 5 Emotions. Emotions have no oil to light the lamp, only senses tell you it is empty.

"Some standing here shall not die, until they see the kingdom come in all it's power" "They shall seek death, but not find it"..."Many who are first, shall be last, and the last shall be made first". Life 101 is a really long class, so pay attention to what your professor is saying. Don't nap even though your eyes are shutting. Stay awake in this last hour...

Faith, hope and Love. And the greatest of these is Love. Faith might move mountains, but love makes them.

LOVE, Ltru