Egyptians open fire on Palestinians

reply to post by GamerGal


The UN stated that Jenin was a massacre - you do not believe the UN inspector therefore you dismiss it.

whilst it might not have been the `extreme` loss of life that one party wants to portray , it most certainly wasn`t the `myth` you wish to show - a fight DID happen and people did DIE.


please read the UN official report.

[edit on 2/1/09 by Harlequin]

reply to post by Harlequin


They claim a massacre, as it turns out it wasn't. It was fake. People did die but they called five wolves when there was only one.

Originally posted by ladysharrowandherbarrow
This thread much like the real situation that is happening. so toodlepip some people need to see humans as we are.

The children should be saved.

I will feel no need to defend my point of view. I will feel no need to convince or persuade others to accept my point of view. I will practice acceptance.

My harsh comment in another column was that terrorist are born to be terrorist. This has gone far beyond who throws the first bomb after another round of peace. Centuries of fighting do not exactly mirror successful peace negotiations.

reply to post by Harlequin


Well maybe the problem is vocabulary.

I consider a masacre to be the wholesale slaughter of unarmed people.

To say that a "fight" happened implies that both sides did the fighting and were armed. That is what I would call a conflict.

I went to the Getty images site yesterday. I did a search on "Palestinians starving" and there were no photos. Only links to the very same "grass eating" story that was posted here. It seems that the grass eating story is from a single source.

I also found an article from two weeks ago, in which the UN says that nobody is starving in Gaza.

I also found a story about the Palestinians smuggling a whole herd of sheep through the tunnels to celebrate the end of Ramadan. Big, big, feast time. I also found a photo of a cow making the passage through a tunnel.

It seems that the starving Palestinian story has no basis in fact.

I did some more research. Check it out:

judaica.jpost.com...

PS: the above is not for anti Israeli Hamas lovers who support the Hamas oppression of the good people of Palestine and put them in harms way.

reply to post by GamerGal


apparantly you are choosing to ignore the UN report - which states quite clearly that unarmed people were massacred by the israeli troops.

your in a minority of 1 over this matter.

so if you want to argue thats fine - go argue with the UN who say its a massacre.

reply to post by Harlequin

apparantly you are choosing to ignore the UN report - which states quite clearly that unarmed people were massacred by the israeli troops.

your in a minority of 1 over this matter.

UNITED NATIONS (AP) — A U.N. report released Thursday found no evidence to support Palestinian claims that Israeli forces massacred up to 500 people in the Jenin refugee camp, but it criticized both sides for putting civilian lives at risk.

The long-awaited report accused Palestinian militants of violating international law by stockpiling weapons and putting fighters among civilians in the densely populated camp. It in turn accused Israel of delaying critical medical and humanitarian aid to the Palestinians and raised questions about the massive destruction of homes and buildings in the camp that left 17,000 people homeless.

www.usatoday.com...

This article says there was no massacre. The UN quoted 52 deaths. The Human Rights watch quoted 22. I believe the minority of 1 is correct in this matter, no massacre.


Personally, I think Israel, Hamas, Egypt, and Fatah are all putting civilians at risk, not just Gaza but in Israel and Egypt as well.

[edit on 2-1-2009 by jam321]

Thanks for that Jam! As I said people did die but it wasn't a massacre, it was Pallywood calling it a massacre. It was crying five wolves when there was only one.

Originally posted by GamerGal
reply to post by UScitizen

 

That wouldn't work. Not all of them are terrorists, or support them. Just the majority of them, proven by the election of Hamas. Still crazy that Egypt does the exact same thing Israel does but gets a pass for it. At least there is no Egywood. They don't need it though they can shoot at Palestinians, like in this case, and no one cares. They're all screaming about Israel.

I don't care, look at what they are doing. One side is lobing rockets over with no idea who or what they are going to hit and the other side is using pin point targeting but still killing innocent people so what does it matter? They don't only kill their enemy either. Oops my mistake there won't be any innocent people killed they are what we call "collateral damage".

reply to post by jam321


www.un.org...


^^


that is the offical report

that is the UN link

they use the word `massacre` 7 times

right , if you wish to actually read what i said about the events in Jenin instead of mashing reply whilst angry you`ll see i said

whilst it might not have been the `extreme` loss of life that one party wants to portray , it most certainly wasn`t the `myth` you wish to show - a fight DID happen and people did DIE.

read the report - since i linked it

the IDF rolled into Jenin and killed people - the death count comes from ceath certificates issued by the hospital - the figure of 500 comes from the Paletinian side , the IDF acknowledge using bulldozers to knock over houses that may or may not have had people and families still in them.


Jenin was a massacre - the UN report says that 7 times.

whether you want to deny the slaughter of unarmed women and children in there homes as they were bulldozed thats up to you - but you tube has israeli tv pictures of homes being flattened , to find the bodies a short time later still inside.


or do you take glee to see people die?

reply to post by Harlequin


Sorry dude, wasn't angry. The report uses massacre but it is not the UN using those words. The witnesses are using those words. Remember, at the time this report was written up everybody was still leaning to massacre.

I present the following.

Human Rights Watch found no evidence to sustain claims of massacres or large-scale extrajudicial executions by the IDF in Jenin refugee camp. However, many of the civilian deaths documented by Human Rights Watch amounted to unlawful or willful killings by the IDF. Many others could have been avoided if the IDF had taken proper precautions to protect civilian life during its military operation, as required by international humanitarian law

www.hrw.org...

Palestinian officials yesterday put the death toll at 56 in the two-week Israeli assault on Jenin, dropping claims of a massacre of 500 that had sparked demands for a U.N. investigation.
The official Palestinian body count, which is not disproportionate to the 33 Israeli soldiers killed in the incursion, was disclosed by Kadoura Mousa Kadoura, the director of Yasser Arafat's Fatah movement for the northern West Bank, after a team of four Palestinian-appointed investigators reported to him in his Jenin office.
[Two weeks ago, when European and particularly London newspapers were reporting estimates of "hundreds" massacred, Israeli sources in Washington said they expected the Palestinian toll to reach "45 to 55."]
U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan suggested yesterday, in the wake of the Palestinian body count, that he may disband a U.N. fact-finding team that was to visit the camp to determine whether a massacre had taken place.

www.papillonsartpalace.com...

No, I do not see glee in seeing people die. The thing is that war, battles, or skirmishes are hell and sometimes civilians get caught up in the middle of it all. It is unfortunate and tragic, but it happens whether we like it or not.

reply to post by jam321


Starred. Anyways, Jenin was not a massacre as you and I have shown time and time again. Lowest count was 22, nearly 20 times less then what the Palestinians claim. 22 does not a massacre make. Also, it is also reported as "fighting". So I guess when US and German troops fought and American troops killed 22 German troops it was a massacre?

reply to post by GamerGal


The official figure is 52 and thats CIVILAINS not german troops

big difference

a soldier expects to fight , a civialin siting in there home when a bulldozer drives through it does not;

and i like that you ignore other massacres ;

Virginia Tech - death toll was 33

Columbine - 11


St Valentines day massacre - 7

so how do YOU , Gamergal , define a massacre then? since i have show with 3 out of many examples , that numbers killed do not make a massacre.

or is because there not american its not a massacre?

[edit on 3/1/09 by Harlequin]

reply to post by Harlequin


Again, lowest count was 22. As for using massacre when they aren't, well, I don't name them. 7 people a massacre? That's like saying an army was decimated after 7 were killed. Look up the definitions of massacre and decimated and you'll see 7 isn't a massacre no matter who labels it that.

reply to post by GamerGal


"it was Pallywood "

That doesn't exist. You made it up.

reply to post by GamerGal


oh but the


`St Valentines day massacre` is well known as that


so by YOUR definition its not , but historically it is known as that - and 7 ppl died.


edit:

Massacre - the deliberate and intentional killing of a large number of human beings, under circumstances of atrocity or cruelty, or contrary to "the usages established among civilized peoples" (International Humanitarian Law term from the Martens Clause).

so whilst YOU don`t think it was a masacre - by definition it was as the specific number killed is actually not relevant to calling it a massacre.

[edit on 3/1/09 by Harlequin]

reply to post by Exuberant1


actually Richard Landes with Ruthie Blumm in the Jeruselum Post coined the term ` Pallywood` , the problem though is that whilst richard landes pretends to be unbiased , its really easy to find out his close and persoanl relationship with ruthie blumm and how much work he has actually done for JPost in the passed.

edition.cnn.com...


Virginia Tech Massacre - 33 people died

its called a massacre


52 people died at Jenin - official figures from the Death certificates issued per cadaver;

why is Jenin not a massacre according to you??

You just said it wasn't. A deliberate act of killing a large number of people. 7, 33, 52, is not a large number. Especially when we're talking about millions of people. Also, I didn't make Pallywood up, its been documented and proven in courts.