Originally posted by Ant4AU
When I see the confederate flag I am filled with southern pride, not because I want slavery, not because I believe I am superior to any else, but because I see it as symbol for a group of people who didn’t bow down to the “Man”.

riiiiight...."according to "your" version of history."....


the british empire illuminati etc caused the civil war.. schism to halter the advance of an incredible country.

you wanna be all tough an good ol' boy go do it man.. you're just being a little puppet pawn planned years before your birth.
you have no idea as to where the real origins of the confederacy originated... so go on being a lil juvinile outburst on the internet for all the uneducated "southern pride means its okay to combine with racist imagery" white trash to chime in on with.
makes for good comedy.

you don't know who the "man" is.
you don't know who you're NOT bowing down to.

just stop.
you're really making a fool of yourself.

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Some responses in this thread have compared flying the Confederate flag with flying the swastika. There is a huge difference between the two. The swastika did not represent the German people, it represented a political party. There was still a German flag during the Nazi regime that represented the German nation.

As for the slavery issue, yes it was a wrong and terrible thing. That was a different time and place and the world's values were changing. The slavery issue was not as important of an issue to the Northerners or Southerners as it is to us today. You can bet the Northern Army was not fighting for black peoples benefit as much their financial future. The secession of the Southern states hurt the north's industry.

Those who find it racist are letting their ignorance show. Slavery wasn't about race; there were slaves who were not black. It was about social status. At the time, the social status of slavery tended to be attached to blacks because they came from less advanced cultures where their enemies (who were also black) sold them into slavery. Slavery was part of a socio-economic order in the past, not some hateful atrocity, and the south supported it because the entire economy of the south was based upon it. The wealth of the south was in slaves, not banks, unlike the north. The Emancipation Proclamation was designed to cripple the South economically, more than anything else, and it was successful. So successful that there are large parts of states like Alabama that look pretty much like a third world country.

Tell me, if someone came and took all your wealth, your LEGAL wealth, and gave you no compensation, wouldnt you be angry? Every slave had a price for freedom, and it went unpaid. As rampant poverty struck the south as a result of all of this, who do you expect the locals to blame for their fall? A slave was not going to be free in their eyes until the wages of their freedom had been paid.

People need to get past their ignorance of history and become able to look at things through the lens of past social orders. Remember, too, that most of those slaves who were sold into slavery and brought to the Americas actually got a better life here than they would have had back in Africa. After all, if they hadn't been worth anything in the meat market, they would have been killed outright. Understand that, just because it offends your sensibilities, you cannot ignore reality.

If slaves were treated so nicely? even some of them? Then answer me this.

why did thousands of black slaves immediately join the army to help fight for their brothers freedoms!

propaganda is good but cmon! those people lived it.... you cant trick someone who was there!

if thousands joined the army to fight the south they mustve had some good reason to risk their lives.

correct me if im wrong.

(on a side note they may have done it for fresh food and water and wages? but that doesnt seem like a good enough reason to go into one of the deadliest wars of the era)

It has been awhile since I read any history but here goes.

The Civil War was not at all about slavery in the beginning. It was about States Rights, meaning that the Constitution was saying that the States held the power, not the federal government.

It did not become a war over slavery until the Emancipation Proclimation was given. That in itself was an economic weapon designed to reduce the agricultural exports of the south which was the only export the south had.

Most of the southern population was poor and had no slaves, but would have faced criticism and charges of cowardice if they had not gone to war with their neighbors.

As someone who lives in the South and had ancestors fight for both sides I am proud to be an American. That being said I choose to live in the South for a multitude of reasons that have nothing to do with racism. The thing I am most proud of is the FACT that there seems to be a disproportionate number of Southerners enlisted in the military and has been for many generations.

Please read Clay2Baraka's post which shows a quote from the Confederate President in his "Cornerstone" speech which clearly states that it is about slavery and that blacks are inferior. Page 2

Sounds a lot like the Lincoln quote.

I think it may have to do with your definition of "Southern Pride."

I'm proud of being a Southerner (Texan.) I'm proud of the heritage of my state, proud of our hospitality and warm friendliness. I'm proud that we are the sort of folks who will stop to help someone stranded on a road or offer assistance to someone in any kind of trouble. I love the silly traditions like eating blackeyed peas on New Year's (most of the stores are out of blackeyed peas right now... I know, because I went to buy 'em.)

I'm not particularly proud (or disappointed) at the gun ownership, because "fightin' with weapons" is something that was part of a more distant culture. I'm not proud of the racism that was in the past or the slave ownership. I'm proud that the state has gotten over that and we see people of all races and cultures in many important positions.

I don't display a Confederate flag for pride, but I do wear "Proud to be a Texan" shirt and I do have state pins (from state parks) that I wear. And I do have a selection of cowboy hats that I love to wear.

There's many ways to show your pride in your heritage and your culture. If an offensive symbol is the ONLY way you can express your pride in your culture, maybe you should stop and think why it's so important to you that you simply can't express your pride with a more positive symbol.