What is Israel trying to hide?, page 1


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ATS Members have flagged this thread 81 times
Topic started on 28-12-2008 @ 04:50 AM by Mdv2

What is Israel trying to hide?


www.boston.com
As Munayyer stated, few Americans are aware that Gaza is a locked prison in which people are denied sufficient food, clean water, fuel, medicine, and access to medical care. Children, who make up half the population, are severely malnourished, and the entire population is traumatized and depressed.

I was recently among a group of international health professionals and academics who were turned away when we tried to enter Gaza to see for ourselves the impact of the siege on the population.

(visit the link for the full news article)


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 04:50 AM by Mdv2
Israel, which earlier prevented Archbishop Desmond Tutu and Jimmy Carter from entering Gaza, detained and then deported Richard Falk, the UN special rapporteur, when he arrived at the airport in Tel Aviv on Dec. 15.

What is Israel trying to hide? US taxpayers, who subsidize its actions at about $3 billion a year, should demand to know, and call for an immediate end to this inhuman collective punishment.


A couple of weeks ago a Dutch TV crew was also denied access to the Gaza strip by the IDF. Secretly, they went into Gaza and witnessed themselves what is happening. They filmed a hospital in which newly born babies are dying as a consequence of power fall outs. The Gaza power plant does not receive enough fuel to provide Gaza, and thus the hospital, with constant power supply.

Some on this forum have said ''It is Hamas that broke the truce'' and they are to blame, not Israel.

Although there cannot be a reason to justify violence against innocent civilians like Hamas has done, I do understand their desperation. Before Hamas broke the truce, the Gaza strip had already been sealed for months. Fruits and other kind of foods which were cultivated for export are forcefully sold on local markets against a loss. Most of the corporations in Gaza have filed bankruptcy long time ago. (Food) prices have skyrocketed and food stocks are extremely low.
Consequently, 80% of the Gazans is dependent on food and medical aid and the average income is $2,- a day way too little to pay a family's meal.

Some on this forum have said: they are smuggling in weapons, so I don't feel sorry for them. You must be seriously retarded to think that people spend their $2,- on weapons rather than on food for their children. Every person with an average IQ could understand that these people spend their $2 on smuggled food and in some cases medicines. Of course, weapons are smuggled into Gaza, but it is Hamas and other terrorist network which smuggle weapons.

We, the world, are not allowed to see what is happening. And if Israel is really so honest as they pretend to be, they should allow reporters to go in there and let them witness themselves what is happening, rather than censoring the news.

One more thing. The US strongly advocated free elections in Palestine. The Palestinians elected Hamas, which made the US decide to immediately cut off all aid. Hamas proposed a new peace deal in which Israel would return to the borders of 1967 , but Israel immediately turned down that idea. In other words, Israel did not even give peace a chance.

Once again, I do not advocate their use of violence, but with no freedom to move, no fair chance to build a country, there will never be peace.

Consensus is the key. We have seen what 8 years Bush and no talking to ''enemies'' has done, like Iran. It further isolated them, increasing the risk of terrorist attacks.

Although I would once again like to stress I condemn the use of violence against innocent civilians, one Israeli has died so far while over 200 Palestinians have died. That response is, like Sarkozy said, disproportionate, or like one ex prime minister of the Netherlands said: a war crime.

Could someone distinguish the difference between a concentration camp and Gaza? Could someone explain me why refusing people foreign aid and starve them to death is any better than what the Nazi's did to the Jews in Europe?

The whole world sees what is going, yet America is turning a blind eye to Israel's disproportionate response. During the Lebanon - Israel war, thousands of innocent civilians died because two soldiers were kidnapped by Hezbollah not by the Lebanese government. What makes them, the Israeli government, less terroristic than Hamas?



www.boston.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 28-12-2008 by Mdv2]


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 05:34 AM by St Udio
they're not really hiding anything (except for maybe the Ghetto of GazaStrip)... they have an impasse because of all the conflicting negotiations spanning the whole peace process...


Egypt had modern claim to 98% of Gaza Strip property...
in the interim, Israel extracted their citizens & forced Arabs into Gaza...

in the view of the international community, Israel as custodian of Gaza
is responsible for the Gaza residents safty & well being...
but the overlapping treaty negotiations results in the Gaza residents to not be represented rightly...



see:
www.palestinefacts.org...

The only prohibition in these agreements is that neither side take steps to change the status of the West Bank and Gaza Strip,
such as unilateral declarations of statehood or annexation, prior to final status negotiations.
The Israeli Government has voluntarily frozen the building of new ...


so, Gaza is in a perpetual 'Limbo'... and the USA witholding the former 'aid' because the Gaza Palestinians elected & installed Hamas as their political leadership in what the rest of the world views as free elections.

not saying the USA is/should be required to furnish 'aid'
but, UN aid or humanitarian help should not be blocked either.



hiding what? ... how about a heart-of-stone


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 07:13 AM by serbsta
Originally posted by pause4thought
Top-notch OP. Real quality: well written & well argued. Starred & flagged.

Israelis need to wake up to the fact that their government's actions with respect to Gaza have been the final nail in the coffin for many people around the world. Israel is now widely regarded as a pariah state.

It's no good Israelis whinging about Hamas militancy as justification for collective punishment. A mediaeval-style siege has no place in a civilized world. Two wrongs don't make a right, especially when most of the victims are civilians.

If you're an Israeli reading this I have to say it's unfortunate your government is turning world opinion against you. You have lost the moral high ground. Had you maintained it you would have maintained a balanced degree of sympathy in the face of violent attacks.

As it is, Israel is increasingly regarded as a cruel persecutor bent on destruction. Israel complains about Palestinians wanting to destroy their nation. But in reality the Palestinians have never come near actually doing this. Israel, on the other hand, has so much innocent blood on its hands through intentional disproportionate responses that the reality has now widely sunk in: it is Israel that wants to crush the Palestinians.




Very well written OP - Flagged.

I have nothing to add to this response, perfectly summarizes my feelings towards this issue and the complete nonsense that is being allowed to take place while the world simply watches.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH - What is happening to the Palestinians in the strip is pure torture and injustice.

GET OUT!


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 07:46 AM by pause4thought
reply to post by seasoul



Well said.

I have never been politically active, but were there to be a public demonstration against the crimes perpetrated against Gaza I would feel impelled to be there. And frankly I hope it comes about.

What is more, if the Israeli army is planning to send in the tanks, as predicted

here

I might honestly start thinking of contacting people who could organize such an event myself, just to see what could be done.


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 07:49 AM by masonwatcher
reply to post by Mdv2



Excellent article and I enjoyed how you disassembled the arguments of the Israeli apologists.

I note that you persistently advocate non-violence by so called terrorists. I think you refer to Hamas. Hamas was formed by Israeli Mossad to act as a disruptive organisation when Israel was gunning for Fatah and obsessed with Yasser Arafat. The agents it employed were Palestinian double agents who gladly accepted Mossad finance and turned on the zionists when they reached critical mass.

In the context of the blockade and the current bombardment by Israel, I find it bizarre for you to insist that Hamas has no right to strike against Israel. Any Palestinian has every right to attack and harm Israel by all means necessary just like Israel is doing to them.

The Palestinians are an unarmed people being brutalised by a very violent and genocidal Israel, yet audiences like us sanctimoniously talk about non-violence. In that case how does one deal with genocide? Die quietly while on the high horse of non-violence?

[edit on 073131p://am3106 by masonwatcher]


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 08:18 AM by seasoul
reply to post by Burginthorn



It is not possible to make things right, in history. The only hope we have is to make things right, today. Speak out about the current injustices, and tomorrow will be a beautiful day for all people.


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 08:30 AM by mrmonsoon
reply to post by Mdv2



Lets take this misinformation one at a time.

The Myth that Israel prevents Gaza from having electricity.
FACT:GAza get over 70% of it's power form Israel, say that again, Gaza gets over 70% of it's electricty from Israel.

Even you now admit it "IS" the Hamas who's daily attacks caused the counter attack.

You talk about the restriction on Gaza, HOWEVER, you fail to mention "WHY" this has been done.
They were done to catch the civillian murdering terrorists blowing themselves up at stores and coffee shops, hoping to kill as many women and children as possible.
They were done as reactions to daily rocket and mortar attacks, they launch

You clearly admit that their elected governemtnonly wants guns and bombs and care nothing about their people.
They don't want food or medicine for their people, they want guns and bombs to kill.

Since you doin't seem to know military thinking, let me tewll you.
When news sources go in and give information on Israels troops strengh/location.....that can't be allowed in a time of war.

You are correct, the palistinians freely elected murdering terrorists and they are suffering from their choice, that is their fault, not others.

Maybe if people stop appologising for the attacks they make, they might say, hmmmmmm

Hamas militarily attacks and gets militaruily counter attacked.

If Hamas did not like/want the counter attacks ( so they can cry poor us) they would not attack a country, especially on with a much stronger military.

Perhaps it is time to stop sympathising with terrorists and say, terrorists, if youi don't attack, you won't be counter attacked.

Such a simple concept, yet one that escapes some people.


reply posted on 28-12-2008 @ 08:46 AM by munkey66
reply to post by Burginthorn


The media feed the stereotypes and the good ol TV junkie just lap it up without a thought, If it was on TV it must be real, doesn't matter that 2 stations showed conflicting reports.

why do people strap bombs to themselves?
because they feel helpless and have no other way of getting justice, what can the Palistinians do to get heard?
what would you do if you feel helpless and feel as though there is no justice?
what would you do if your house was blown up? or your child killed?
most of the conflict comes about from years and years of hatred and the children learn their behaviour from the parents, Palistinian and Isreali children learn, both are taught the other is the enemy.

so lets stop pointing fingers and say who is right or wrong, because both are, the question is what will it take to get peace there?

as far as Aboriginals walking around freely, try being an Aboriginal and drive a nice car and see how long before you are pulled over, or just have a few of you walk through the street and see how long before the long arm of the law questions what you are up too.
they may be free to move around, but they are far from free.


[edit on 28-12-2008 by munkey66]
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