reply to post by Alienmojo
Ok I am gonna try to be nice and not sound like a knowitall but I really have to get this off my chest.
The problem in the world is the religious.Why do people get so mad at religion??
Well first of all the religious groups are the first to tell you that you need to be saved.Lots of talking...they are about as saved as you are and
still need to blab on.Religious people talking like they actually know when they know as much as anyone else on the planet.
Second is that it is false identification of yourself....I am INSERT GROUP.Its group thought which is very dangerous.Don't be led...you have the GOD
given ability to think for yourself without GOD getting pissed off at you.Its the group that gets mad if you don't conform to THEIR standards.
Third I could go around the world and help people without a title or a cause.I don't need to be religious to do it.It should be human to want to
help...religious groups love to take credit for that.The old look at me look at me...I am doing something good,please take note that I am INSERT
GROUP.
Fourth.How many wars have been fought bcuz of religion?
I don't have those fights bcuz I don't as an idividual care to hear about someones beliefs...if they actually believed it then they wouldn't have
to try to convince me,or if they are trying to convince me it is bcuz they are pompous people who think what they think is better.Either way its
obvious that the believer doesn't really believe what he has read in their teachings.If he did then he would shut the hell up and live what he has
been taught.
The shallowest waters can sometimes make the most noise.
To me its obvious that there are two problems in the world....MONEY and RELIGION.
Go do a bit of research on how many wars have been fought on this earth and how many were based on religious hatred.They go to war thinking god is on
their side.I thought killing was wrong??Hmmmm
I think religion is pure ignorance.
I didn't reply to the other thread as I saw that as a given.I wanted to reply to this thread partly bcuz I am blown away that there are still people
on this planet that can't see what the finger is pointing at...all they see is the finger.
Sorry if this sounds mean or harsh...I don't mean to offend.
If mankind is to survive, then religion must continue., page 3
privacy
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 11:06 AM by Freenrgy2
reply to post by Alienmojo
Is there a particular reason you are intentionally plagiarizing this thread?
Your post is almost 100% verbatim what the OP wrote in his/her thread, with the excpetion that you take the opposite opinion. If you disgaree, fine, but at least have the decency to write your own post and not copy and paste a member's post from another thread and try to pass it off as your own with a few sentences changed.
Is there a particular reason you are intentionally plagiarizing this thread?
Your post is almost 100% verbatim what the OP wrote in his/her thread, with the excpetion that you take the opposite opinion. If you disgaree, fine, but at least have the decency to write your own post and not copy and paste a member's post from another thread and try to pass it off as your own with a few sentences changed.
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 11:50 AM by Freelancer
Why does the Opening Post sound very much like this one?.
Surly your opposing views should be stated in the thread I have just given rather than starting an entirely new one. It is plain to see you are already aware of the previous thread since your Opening Post is worded very similar.
This is nothing but a cheap shot in capitalizing on the interest generated from this thread.
Opps, Freenrgy2 beat me to it.
[edit on 24/12/2008 by Freelancer]
Surly your opposing views should be stated in the thread I have just given rather than starting an entirely new one. It is plain to see you are already aware of the previous thread since your Opening Post is worded very similar.
This is nothing but a cheap shot in capitalizing on the interest generated from this thread.
Opps, Freenrgy2 beat me to it.
[edit on 24/12/2008 by Freelancer]
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:10 PM by Muundoggie
reply to post by tigermoff
Well said.
Religion can and is corrupted, spirituality can not be corrupted.
Well said.
Religion can and is corrupted, spirituality can not be corrupted.
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:17 PM by Ghost147
reply to post by Alienmojo
Has anyone else noticed a drastic increase of response topics to highly provocative other new topics?
anyway, im not here to bash the OP. It seems that my post in the original post of this topic (that you're [OP] responding to) has overlooked my response. So I'm here to not only re-post it, and hopefully get some sort of acknowledgment, along with correcting some misinterpreted bits i've read in your first post.
heres my original post
And on to some of the misinterpretations i see in your OP.
In generalizing an example of yours to why religion can better a person, you say that many religious people go out of their way and use their time and money to help others. which is correct, however its not as if you need a religion to do these. I myself am volunteering to help breed an endangered species on the cayman islands next month for around 3 months (i am atheist, to remind you). Bill Gates donates Billions of dollars to help find cures for things like Aids and Malaria. here's a more detailed list
en.wikipedia.org...
I believe Gates is Atheist as well.
You don't need god to find good in this world.
As much as i would like religion to further ones esteem in humanity, the vast majority of followers do not. in fact 90%-92% of all prisoners in the states are Theists.
I am really sorry to here that without religion you would be so much worse off. I am really truly sorry to see that many religious people believe that without the thought of a god, man kind would run through chaos.
I'm sorry if this sounded like an attack, But there are a few things that bugged me in that OP of yours.
Has anyone else noticed a drastic increase of response topics to highly provocative other new topics?
anyway, im not here to bash the OP. It seems that my post in the original post of this topic (that you're [OP] responding to) has overlooked my response. So I'm here to not only re-post it, and hopefully get some sort of acknowledgment, along with correcting some misinterpreted bits i've read in your first post.
heres my original post
Im an Atheist and i am not really against religion per say, but what it has become. Having something to believe in is fine and even a nessisity for some people. Some people just just think that "without enforcement of 'law'(gods word/hell) there would be chaos" and all that. Some people need something to prey for to get that insperational boost they need to get through a tough time.
However, (in America/Canada mostly) corruption in religion is an astronomical problem. Most people don't know what any of their own religion means and stands for. They don't know why there is Christmas, why their is Easter, and so on because its been manipulated by corporations and society in a form that does in-fact brain was people (in a sense).
But! that doesn't mean that religion is wrong and not needed. Many religions stand for great good, "believe in your fellow man" "love your neighbor" and so on. But there is also the great negatives of scientific illiteracy, ignorance, wars... However, all these negatives would still exist with-out religion. The lack of all religion wont solve any problems, just as is with everyone being religious. Both of them have very strong negative points.
And on to some of the misinterpretations i see in your OP.
In generalizing an example of yours to why religion can better a person, you say that many religious people go out of their way and use their time and money to help others. which is correct, however its not as if you need a religion to do these. I myself am volunteering to help breed an endangered species on the cayman islands next month for around 3 months (i am atheist, to remind you). Bill Gates donates Billions of dollars to help find cures for things like Aids and Malaria. here's a more detailed list
en.wikipedia.org...
The Gates Foundation has quickly become a major influence upon global health; the approximately US$800 million that the foundation gives every year for global health approaches the annual budget of the United Nations' World Health Organization (193 nations) and is comparable to the funds given to fight infectious disease by the United States Agency for International Development.[16] The Foundation currently provides 17% (US$86 million in 2006) of the world budget for the attempted eradication of poliomyelitis (polio).[17]
The Global Health Program's other significant grants include
The Global Alliance for Vaccines and Immunization
The foundation gave The Global Alliance for Vaccines and Immunization a donation of US$750 million on 25 January 2005.[18][19]
The Institute for OneWorld Health
The foundation gave The Institute for OneWorld Health a donation of nearly US$10 million to support the organization's work on a drug for visceral leishmaniasis (VL).
Children's Vaccine Program
The Children's Vaccine Program, run by the Program for Appropriate Technology in Health (PATH), received a donation of US$27 million to help vaccinate against Japanese encephalitis on 9 December 2003.[20]
University of Washington Department of Global Health
The foundation provided approximately US$30 million for the foundation of the new Department of Global Health at the University of Washington in Seattle. The donation promoted three of the Foundation's target areas: education, Pacific Northwest and global health. The foundation also lead a study to increase access to high education globally.
HIV Research
The foundation has donated a grand total of US$287 million to various HIV/AIDS researchers. The money was split between sixteen different research teams across the world, on the condition that they share their findings with one another.[21]
I believe Gates is Atheist as well.
You don't need god to find good in this world.
As much as i would like religion to further ones esteem in humanity, the vast majority of followers do not. in fact 90%-92% of all prisoners in the states are Theists.
I am really sorry to here that without religion you would be so much worse off. I am really truly sorry to see that many religious people believe that without the thought of a god, man kind would run through chaos.
I'm sorry if this sounded like an attack, But there are a few things that bugged me in that OP of yours.
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:22 PM by pause4thought
reply to post by Freenrgy2
Hi. Seeing as that other thread has been on the front page for some time most people would have recognized this as satire as soon as they saw the title. And seeing as the OP has actually stayed with the debate, whereas the OP in the other thread opened by saying he'd put anyone who disagreed with him on 'ignore', I say Alienmojo has proved his mettle.
reply to post by chapter29 & Daniem
When it comes to fairy tales, atheism makes Alice in Wonderland look like a treatise on reasoned extrapolation.
The evidence that God is real is there every time you open your eyes and see order and the laws of physics and chemistry at work in the world and the cosmos, every time someone takes the trouble to ponder the biochemical marvels that sustain life in a single 'simple' organism (not to mention the human body) - far more complex than anything billions of intelligent humans could ever put together.
Believing inanimate rocks and elements somehow came together by chance to form billions of life forms infinitely more complex than all the world's computers put together defies maths, logic, and, frankly sanity itself. But no worries - we can't see who did it or even conceive a conscious Being great enough to conceive and then put together an entire universe, laws and all.
...So if we can't fathom it, we don't believe the evidence. That is the logical fallacy of atheism. Well, only one of them, if we are to be honest. Then there is the suggestion it is possible to be sure about a negative - 'There is no God' - (espoused by some, not all who don't believe) or the fallacy that chance mutations could lead to exquisite designs from the fish that bejewel coral reefs to birds of paradise to Queens of Sheba.
For Christians there is the evidence God personally stepped into history in the form of a man, having foretold the same over the course of several millennia. The incarnation. ("They shall call his name Immanuel, which means 'God with us'." Happy Christmas.)
Evidence abounds.
What is not there is total, seeing-is-believing proof.
Which is where faith comes in. And those without it ought to realise faith in God can be based on pure logic alone. Mocking it all too often belies a hatred towards it, the God who is it's object, or the people who espouse it - whether irrational or based on awareness of personal moral shortcomings.
Contemplation of and yearning for the sublime, the ineffable, the Infinite Originator Himself has brought mankind many of it's greatest heights of literature, poetry, philosophy, morality, integrity and inward beauty.
Charlatans, rogues and wolves in sheep's clothing only serve to emphasize the truth of the True Light.
Ridding the world of religion would open the door to a never-ending spiral of egotism and consequent conflict, not to mention brutality at all levels of society.
Think 'Lord of the Flies'.
It is often knowledge of a higher intelligence and moral authority that has kept the world from descending into a never-ending succession of brutal, unjust dictatorships.
It cannot be denied that particular people/groups have sought to justify all manner of evil on the back of their religion. But when you look at the broad swathe of history religious beliefs have brought social cohesion, social and legal justice, individual responsibility, emancipation, honesty and selfless personal integrity to the world.
It is hypocrites who are the problem.
Hi. Seeing as that other thread has been on the front page for some time most people would have recognized this as satire as soon as they saw the title. And seeing as the OP has actually stayed with the debate, whereas the OP in the other thread opened by saying he'd put anyone who disagreed with him on 'ignore', I say Alienmojo has proved his mettle.
reply to post by chapter29 & Daniem
Religions are fairy tales...
When it comes to fairy tales, atheism makes Alice in Wonderland look like a treatise on reasoned extrapolation.
The evidence that God is real is there every time you open your eyes and see order and the laws of physics and chemistry at work in the world and the cosmos, every time someone takes the trouble to ponder the biochemical marvels that sustain life in a single 'simple' organism (not to mention the human body) - far more complex than anything billions of intelligent humans could ever put together.
Believing inanimate rocks and elements somehow came together by chance to form billions of life forms infinitely more complex than all the world's computers put together defies maths, logic, and, frankly sanity itself. But no worries - we can't see who did it or even conceive a conscious Being great enough to conceive and then put together an entire universe, laws and all.
...So if we can't fathom it, we don't believe the evidence. That is the logical fallacy of atheism. Well, only one of them, if we are to be honest. Then there is the suggestion it is possible to be sure about a negative - 'There is no God' - (espoused by some, not all who don't believe) or the fallacy that chance mutations could lead to exquisite designs from the fish that bejewel coral reefs to birds of paradise to Queens of Sheba.
For Christians there is the evidence God personally stepped into history in the form of a man, having foretold the same over the course of several millennia. The incarnation. ("They shall call his name Immanuel, which means 'God with us'." Happy Christmas.)
Evidence abounds.
What is not there is total, seeing-is-believing proof.
Which is where faith comes in. And those without it ought to realise faith in God can be based on pure logic alone. Mocking it all too often belies a hatred towards it, the God who is it's object, or the people who espouse it - whether irrational or based on awareness of personal moral shortcomings.
Contemplation of and yearning for the sublime, the ineffable, the Infinite Originator Himself has brought mankind many of it's greatest heights of literature, poetry, philosophy, morality, integrity and inward beauty.
Charlatans, rogues and wolves in sheep's clothing only serve to emphasize the truth of the True Light.
Ridding the world of religion would open the door to a never-ending spiral of egotism and consequent conflict, not to mention brutality at all levels of society.
Think 'Lord of the Flies'.
It is often knowledge of a higher intelligence and moral authority that has kept the world from descending into a never-ending succession of brutal, unjust dictatorships.
It cannot be denied that particular people/groups have sought to justify all manner of evil on the back of their religion. But when you look at the broad swathe of history religious beliefs have brought social cohesion, social and legal justice, individual responsibility, emancipation, honesty and selfless personal integrity to the world.
It is hypocrites who are the problem.
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:37 PM by weedwhacker
reply to post by FlyersFan
FlyersFan, I rarely agree with you on other issues, but you took the words right out of my mouth....or keyboard, as appropriate.
With all respect to the OP, 'religion' is the problem, as has been pointed out in the preceding pages --- not the 'beliefs' that inspire.
A belief or 'faith', if you prefer is fine. It is each individual's inalienable right.
It is ONLY when ONE GROUPS' beliefs begin to infringe on anothers', that conflict begins to ensue. Why is this?? Well, notice I mentioned 'GROUP'....that being an assembly of (mostly) like-minded 'individuals' who wish to get together and proclaim to others how They (the others) should Feel, and Think, and Worship. Sounds rather dictatorial to me.
Taken to the extreme, that sort of religious 'fervor' has, in our Human past, indeed resulted in untold tragedies of Human suffering. I don't think anyone can deny this?
I don't proclaim any answers....but I am reminded of a term...."Blind Faith". I take that to mean a 'faith' that is resistant to any evidence that contradicts its core 'belief', no matter how compelling that evidence may be. And, I know this might bring trouble to my doorstep, for saying so....but the general lack of scientific knowledge by the majority of Humans on this planet is symptomatic of our inability to move forward in these discussions.
To summarize, building on the OP's point: I disagree with the premise of 'religion' being a necessary requirement for Mankind (Human) survival. At this juncture, Humans must learn some humility (that includes understanding that until some incredible advancement in Space Travel technology) this is the ONLY planet we can live on.
This Planet has seen a lot of dominant species come-and-go, and Nature wouldn't shed a tear if WE disappeared, because life goes on.....
(Hmmmm.....what sort of 'religion' will the NEXT sentient species invent? )
(Second hmmmm.....do ALL sentient species in our Galaxy invent 'religion? OK, discuss!)
FlyersFan, I rarely agree with you on other issues, but you took the words right out of my mouth....or keyboard, as appropriate.
With all respect to the OP, 'religion' is the problem, as has been pointed out in the preceding pages --- not the 'beliefs' that inspire.
A belief or 'faith', if you prefer is fine. It is each individual's inalienable right.
It is ONLY when ONE GROUPS' beliefs begin to infringe on anothers', that conflict begins to ensue. Why is this?? Well, notice I mentioned 'GROUP'....that being an assembly of (mostly) like-minded 'individuals' who wish to get together and proclaim to others how They (the others) should Feel, and Think, and Worship. Sounds rather dictatorial to me.
Taken to the extreme, that sort of religious 'fervor' has, in our Human past, indeed resulted in untold tragedies of Human suffering. I don't think anyone can deny this?
I don't proclaim any answers....but I am reminded of a term...."Blind Faith". I take that to mean a 'faith' that is resistant to any evidence that contradicts its core 'belief', no matter how compelling that evidence may be. And, I know this might bring trouble to my doorstep, for saying so....but the general lack of scientific knowledge by the majority of Humans on this planet is symptomatic of our inability to move forward in these discussions.
To summarize, building on the OP's point: I disagree with the premise of 'religion' being a necessary requirement for Mankind (Human) survival. At this juncture, Humans must learn some humility (that includes understanding that until some incredible advancement in Space Travel technology) this is the ONLY planet we can live on.
This Planet has seen a lot of dominant species come-and-go, and Nature wouldn't shed a tear if WE disappeared, because life goes on.....
(Hmmmm.....what sort of 'religion' will the NEXT sentient species invent? )
(Second hmmmm.....do ALL sentient species in our Galaxy invent 'religion? OK, discuss!)
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:42 PM by chapter29
reply to post by pause4thought
Sanity...interesting you used that word...
For a moment, let's look at this from another angle...
How about recognizing that something, be it a her/him/the all-spark/ george burns, other than an omnipotent being put everything in motion...?
We are just part of the petri dish and I have no problem with that 'possibility'...the 'possibility' I do have an issue with is the one where the individual must adhere to dogma, put into place by those that do NOT have my best interest in mind, before the reward...
You want to go through life with the blinders on, be my guest...but, if you ever choose to lose those shackles and take the journey without the crutch - then I applaud you, for the journey can be lonely and bitter at times; but the pay off is ten-fold as I know what's coming, where you are gonna be let down something big...
content edit!
[edit on 12/24/2008 by chapter29]
Sanity...interesting you used that word...
For a moment, let's look at this from another angle...
How about recognizing that something, be it a her/him/the all-spark/ george burns, other than an omnipotent being put everything in motion...?
We are just part of the petri dish and I have no problem with that 'possibility'...the 'possibility' I do have an issue with is the one where the individual must adhere to dogma, put into place by those that do NOT have my best interest in mind, before the reward...
You want to go through life with the blinders on, be my guest...but, if you ever choose to lose those shackles and take the journey without the crutch - then I applaud you, for the journey can be lonely and bitter at times; but the pay off is ten-fold as I know what's coming, where you are gonna be let down something big...
content edit!
[edit on 12/24/2008 by chapter29]
reply posted on 24-12-2008 @ 12:47 PM by Anonymous ATS
The.Man.Called.Gilgamesh
First off alienmojo, you straight up took robwerdens post idea. for shame for being unoriginal.
www.geocities.com...
theres a list of biblical contradictions and failed prophecies that i have myself verified to be accurate.
also, anyone calling themselved the "chosen people" is bunk. if god created all humans, that would be like your parents telling you they love your sister more than you. rubbish
eventually your abrahamic propaganda will be right next to Odin and Zeus in the museum ... cant wait for they day.
live your life by philosophy and not myth, critical thought and not opinion.
happy festivus
First off alienmojo, you straight up took robwerdens post idea. for shame for being unoriginal.
www.geocities.com...
theres a list of biblical contradictions and failed prophecies that i have myself verified to be accurate.
also, anyone calling themselved the "chosen people" is bunk. if god created all humans, that would be like your parents telling you they love your sister more than you. rubbish
eventually your abrahamic propaganda will be right next to Odin and Zeus in the museum ... cant wait for they day.
live your life by philosophy and not myth, critical thought and not opinion.
happy festivus
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