Originally posted by Skyfloating
Watching the sunrise at the beach gets you closer to God than sitting in Sunday church does. Thats for sure.

If you're thinking about what the person next to you is wearing or whether they're singing on-key in church, then you're probably right. If your mind is on God while in church, then you'd attended for the right reason and therefore would be close to Him there.

[edit on 22-12-2008 by saint4God]

An important OP Skyfloating. Starred.

Occultism is not a reaction to Christianity but is nevertheless a conflicting path. That confliction was not, however, propagated by Occultism (or Christ for that matter) but by later theological Christianity which sought to denounce and demonize existing traditions - for this was the only way it could dethrone an institution (if you can call wider Occultism an (institution") far older than itself. Much of Christianity's two millenia has been focussed upon misrepresenting all forms of Occultism for the Bible teaches that no man or woman participate in traditions of mysticism.

If I may, Skyfloating, I'd like to use this thread to make another important point:

The NWO and all crimes committed by are commonly linked with Occultism. The overriding belief has now become that anyone connected with the Occult must be sympathetic towards the NWO agenda and most likely approves of 9/11 and the illegitimate wars since. While I enjoy Alex Jones' radio show from time to time, this is one of my major gripes with him. He regularly concludes that because his evidence shows NWO 'players' conducting Occult rituals, that Occultism is inextricably linked with evil agenda. This isn't true. In fact, I thought about creating a website along the lines of "Occultists For 9/11 Truth" or something.

On the contrary, if it weren't for those interested in Occult symbolism (which has its links through sacred geometry and things like numerology to spiritual Occultism), we'd all be more in-the-dark about the true nature of the NWO than we are. Occultism is truth-seeking, not truth-hiding. There is actually something inherently 'Occult' about exposing the NWO.

Originally posted by Cythraul
Occultism is not a reaction to Christianity but is nevertheless a conflicting path.

True.

Originally posted by Cythraul
That confliction was not, however, propagated by Occultism (or Christ for that matter) but by later theological Christianity which sought to denounce and demonize existing traditions...

Source please? I quoted Old Testament which did include many practices of occultism. For those piecing together the timeline, Deuteronomy was a few thousand years before Christ came to earth.

I'd also like your source to show occultism is older than "In the beginning..."

Originally posted by saint4God


If you're thinking about what the person next to you is wearing or whether they're singing on-key in church, then you're probably right. If your mind is on God while in church, then you'd attended for the right reason and therefore would be close to Him there.

[edit on 22-12-2008 by saint4God]

Yes, of course.

The word "occult" is a rather broad-sweeping term. The more description you're adding, the more I recognize which belief system in particular is being referred to. Why then say occult of you're meaning something more specific?

Originally posted by saint4God
The word "occult" is a rather broad-sweeping term. The more description you're adding, the more I recognize which belief system in particular is being referred to. Why then say occult of you're meaning something more specific?

I mean occult as it was originally outlined by initiates, secret societies, gnosticism and mystics...not by scam-artists out to make a quick buck with divination.

Occultism/Magick is actually the practice of focussing and playing with "energy".

[edit on 22-12-2008 by Skyfloating]

I know I'm putting my head into the fireline of BOTH sides here, BUT: I do not believe that true christianity and practising occult truths and practices automatically contradict!
. o O (I'm not even going to go towards 'high magic' that actually quotes and uses the bible and shows respect for the christian God and Jesus....)

What is wrong with knowing your herbs, understanding the four elements, believing that God create stones and crystals for one more resaon and meditating?
Oh wait: Christians meditate on what they want, they call it praying and I think it's safe to say that there are churches where there is more chanting, idols of pagan Gods and Godesses, and candle-magick than on your average pagan altar!


But I'm helping drag the thread away from the subject, sry OP!
As an ex-christian what annoys me most when speaking to ex-fellow christians (incl. my mother) If I can't understand it or it doesn't fit my views then it's induced by Satan.
Especially remote-viewing OOB etc. She didn't like it when I asked her how come she was telepathic... ... I know that was a deep hit...


I just wish people wouldn't be so scared to open their minds and hearts to possible truths and fellow men'n'women!
Blessed Be,
Samuel

Originally posted by Skyfloating
I mean occult as it was originally outlined by initiates, secret societies, gnosticism and mystics...not by scam-artists out to make a quick buck with divination.

Occultism/Magick is actually the practice of focussing and playing with "energy".

We're getting warmer, just not quite there yet. Per your perspecitve on 'cheap parlor tricks' it's obvious you don't accept all secret societies, magicks, etc.

Since occult means of the hidden I'm of the opinion that is what Satan is all about Rev 17:8 it seems to me Satan is "the beast that was, and is not, and yet is". He is for real for sure but is hidden and does not want to be seen for what he is!

Originally posted by gordonwest
It was God who commanded his children to sacrifice the animals to God. Oh. I would love to see a christian to make a animal sacrifice towards God. (And there where MANY different types of the animal sacrifice too God) If they can then they are the Children Of God, and not a man made religion as the church.

1.) The ultimate sacrifice of all sacrifices was given 2,000 years ago (which is why it is no longer done) and is why Christ-ians are called Christians.
2.) I think you're missing the point of what a sacrifice is.
3.) A sacrifice is not a visual proof to others to show off their devotion. It belongs to God and God alone.

Originally posted by saint4God
We're getting warmer, just not quite there yet. Per your perspecitve on 'cheap parlor tricks' it's obvious you don't accept all secret societies, magicks, etc.

What Religions and Scientific Skeptics define as "occult" is not what occultism is really about.

Look at the practice of the "Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn" for example. Those are a bunch of people practicing yogic discipline - not gimmicky tricks.

Satanism is part of the Occult, but the Occult is not made up of only Satanism, and not all Occultists are Satanists.

The Roman Catholic Church has been considered part of the Occult, as has Cabala.

Thank you Skyfloating. This is indeed something that needs to be kept in mind.

This was the general conclusion thatmost of us came to in the Led Zeppelin thread. Occult does not mean evil, and certainly doesn't automatically mean satanism.

It seems that it has really become trendy, within certain niches of litirature, to blame "The Occult/Lucifarian/Satanic Conspiracy."

I do think that there are many things within the occult that can be dangerous if they are attempted by someone who isn't spiritually ready. Kundalini maddness is one that comes to mind, also the twats who try to cojure up a spirit just to impress their friends.

I think another real danger is people who go into the occult with a lot of anger or hatred within them. In my expereince many of the occult trappings basically magnify and concentrate, whatever emotions are inside of a person, so these poor individuals can get really messed up.



Edit to add:

You said you are a former practitioner. Out of curiosity, why did you draw away from the occult?

[edit on 22-12-2008 by asmeone2]

Thank you Skyfloating for this thread. I have also subscribed to some of your other threads. Always good topics and discussions!