Occultism is not Satanism

Seek and you shall find.

There is no reason to seek if the answers lay before you.

There is no reason to seek...unless it is 'hidden' or not to be seen on the surface of our what we perceive to be 'sight'.

We must seek past material things for Thee dwells in vessels that contain life.

Use one eye, not two. Use the inner eye.

I just want to thank all that have put time forth in this thread. Highly needed discussion I do believe.

Thee is within all, just as though Thee tells us, cut the wood and I am there.

LV

"Seek and you shall find. "

*****I have done years of searching for truth. I have found it. I have found that God exists. Jesus exists, Satan exists. This life we are in is temporary. there is a war between good and evil going on around you NOW! its real, its present and its almost ready to break loose. The Holy Spirit gives truth who seek truth. Those who seek the son, Jesus christ seek truth. Those that do not seek truth will find death and eternal separation from God.

"There is no reason to seek if the answers lay before you."

*****Exactly my point. And you just justified why I have a restrictive view because I have found truth so why seek but now to learn about Jesus and give him service.

"There is no reason to seek...unless it is 'hidden' or not to be seen on the surface of our what we perceive to be 'sight'."

****New Age Stuff..........make it simple...Romans 10:9 and repent.

"We must seek past material things for Thee dwells in vessels that contain life. "

****Exactly.....we seek God through his son, Jesus. The Holy Spirit will guide you.

"Use one eye, not two. Use the inner eye."

*****No, there is no inner eye, it is called the spirit. We are made up of the body, [Jesus] the soul [God] and the Spirit [Holy Spirit]. We are a microcosm of the bigger picture. However many have not accepted Jesus as their savior and therefore the spirit is not connected.

the only way to walk with God, is through Jesus Christ.

Matt. 7:21-23: “Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will. Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name . . . ?’ And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness.”

Ability to perform “great signs,” or “miracles,” is not necessarily proof of a true prophet

Matt. 24:24: “False Christs and false prophets will arise and will give great signs [“miracles,” TEV] and wonders so as to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones.”

NOTE: Fear means respect and not the fear like being afraid.

Deut. 13:1-4: “In case a prophet or a dreamer of a dream arises in your midst and does give you a sign or a portent, and the sign or the portent does come true of which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us walk after other gods, whom you have not known, and let us serve them,’ you must not listen to the words of that prophet or to the dreamer of that dream, because Jehovah your God is testing you to know whether you are loving Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul. After Jehovah your God you should walk, and him you should fear, and his commandments you should keep, and to his voice you should listen, and him you should serve, and to him you should cling.”

Since the Bible says that “a friend of the world” is an enemy of God, are clergymen who urge their parishioners to get involved in the affairs of the world promoting true worship? (Jas. 4:4; 1 John 2:15-17)

Jesus taught his followers to pray for God’s Kingdom, and the Bible cautions against putting one’s trust in earthling men, so are clergymen or political organizations that urge people to place their confidence in human rulership true prophets?—Matt. 6:9, 10; Ps. 146:3-6; compare Revelation 16:13, 14.

Matt. 7:15-20: “Be on the watch for the false prophets that come to you in sheep’s covering, but inside they are ravenous wolves. By their fruits you will recognize them. . . . Every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit . . . Really, then, by their fruits you will recognize those men.”

What characterizes their way of life? “The works of the flesh are . . . fornication, uncleanness, loose conduct, idolatry, practice of spiritism, enmities, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, contentions, divisions, sects, envies, drunken bouts, revelries, and things like these. . . . Those who practice such things will not inherit God’s kingdom. On the other hand, the fruitage of [God’s] spirit is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, mildness, self-control.”—Gal. 5:19-23; see also 2 Peter 2:1-3.


we don't set the rules he does................we follow them

The ticket to even the first level of Heaven is taking jesus as savior........

Introduction
1. The "good works" of unsaved people are "dead", and are as "filthy rags" to God.
2. We are under Satan's control until we are spiritually reborn through faith in Jesus.
3. We are saved by faith and grace, not works. However, good works after our spiritual rebirth signifies true faith.
4. God is not impressed by the "good works" and prayers of non-Christians.
5. We are not to admire the sincerity and zeal of those in non-Christians religions. We are to avoid participating in their efforts.

www.creationists.org...

reply to post by tgambill


You think it`s all cut and dried don`t you? No need to look for answers, there all in the book. No need to seek God within yourself, he`s in the book. We have no soul, it`s in the book. When you find that part of God you seek within you, it`s not God, it`s Satan, because the book says so. Don`t question anything the book says, if you do, you will go to hell. If you believe other then what the book says, Satan is within you and you will go to hell. Keep your line of thought only in the book, if you don`t, you will go to hell. If you open your mind to things other then the book, Satan slips in, and you will go to hell. You can only be saved by believing in the book and what it says. If you don`t believe in what the book says, God doesn`t want anything to do with you, your dead meat to him. God will only love you if you follow the book and what it says. You must believe in Satan, because the book says so. You will have no peace if you don`t follow the book. God is not all loving, because the book says so. God will not accept you if you don`t believe what the book says. God gave you free will to grow spiritually in any way you want, but that free will is limited to two choices. You dare not have your own thoughts, only those thoughts the book tells you to have. You must allow the book to control your thoughts and your life, if not, you know where your going. There are no other books, other then the Bible, so do not read any other books. If someone comes to you, and tells you how they found God without the book, don`t believe them, it`s Satan talking. God is only within the pages of the Bible, God is not within you. Even though we came from God, we are not a part of him and he is not within us, because the book says so. Even though we have the living force within us that came from God, we are not a part of him, because the book says so. You must interpret the book in one way only......literally, if not, you will not go to heaven.

If that is your idea of how God and his love works tgambill, keep it and your book. It`s more hateful and controlling then it is anything.

"You think it`s all cut and dried don`t you? No need to look for answers, there all in the book."

****** If you find truth then why keep looking? Life is short to keep looking for answers, its time to find truth.

"No need to seek God within yourself, he`s in the book."

******Question? How many people have lived since the dawn of time? Billions, trillions? and not one has found God within himself. I would wager not one has created a universe yet. Its hard to look for water in the bucket when you have a hole in the bottom. one must find the hole. Have it ever dawned on you that many millions have found peace, found God and are saved by him. They have.....its called Jesus Christ.

"We have no soul, it`s in the book. When you find that part of God you seek within you, it`s not God, it`s Satan, because the book says so."

*****You have a soul. Satan is just influencial and thats all. You are more powerful than him by far.

"Don`t question anything the book says, if you do, you will go to hell."

*****Who have you been talking too. God wants us to question and seek. You won't go to Hell for that. Whoever told you that is all wet.

"If you believe other then what the book says, Satan is within you and you will go to hell."

*****Now that is pretty much true. So, you are saying we can make up our own religion and God will honor it? So, how about us believing in Hindu and Mormonism and we can live over and over and also inherit our own planet. This is essentially what you are saying. Who would want to be a christian when we can own a planet right?

"God gave you free will to grow spiritually in any way you want, but that free will is limited to two choices. You dare not have your own thoughts, only those thoughts the book tells you to have."

*****You really want that planet or reincarnation? Or, will he understand your own version and honor it?

"God is not within you. Even though we came from God, we are not a part of him and he is not within us, because the book says so."

*****We didn't come from God. We came from Adam who sinned. We are human but God is sprit but became flesh in Jesus. He is within us if we accept his son Jesus.


"Even though we have the living force within us that came from God, we are not a part of him, because the book says so. You must interpret the book in one way only......literally, if not, you will not go to heaven."

******The book came from God and his love for us that we would know what he is all about. God is the word, and the word became flesh.

Free will.......things are getting ready to change shortly...............

Originally posted by tgambill
"Seek and you shall find. "

*****I have done years of searching for truth. I have found it. I have found that God exists. Jesus exists, Satan exists. This life we are in is temporary. there is a war between good and evil going on around you NOW! its real, its present and its almost ready to break loose. The Holy Spirit gives truth who seek truth. Those who seek the son, Jesus christ seek truth. Those that do not seek truth will find death and eternal separation from God.

"There is no reason to seek if the answers lay before you."

*****Exactly my point. And you just justified why I have a restrictive view because I have found truth so why seek but now to learn about Jesus and give him service.

"There is no reason to seek...unless it is 'hidden' or not to be seen on the surface of our what we perceive to be 'sight'."

****New Age Stuff..........make it simple...Romans 10:9 and repent.

"We must seek past material things for Thee dwells in vessels that contain life. "

****Exactly.....we seek God through his son, Jesus. The Holy Spirit will guide you.

"Use one eye, not two. Use the inner eye."

*****No, there is no inner eye, it is called the spirit. We are made up of the body, [Jesus] the soul [God] and the Spirit [Holy Spirit]. We are a microcosm of the bigger picture. However many have not accepted Jesus as their savior and therefore the spirit is not connected.

Well another sunny day in the neighborhood huh

I too have been a seeker for yrs. and I wouldnt be so full of myself to say I have found more wisdom then you (as tempting as it may be)

Actually, you refined my point, thank you.

We are to seek, bottom line. If all the answers were given, there would be no reason to seek. But they arent all given in a book, they arent all black and white, this would go against the purpose of us learning knowledge and discerning the nature of that knowledge.

So the point, WE ARE TO SEEK, NOT BE ROBOTS.

There is a inner eye, its called OUR BODY where Thee dwells. Thee can only shine if you understand that your body is a instrument for Thee....NOW...lets talk some Quantum.

Your idea of God is cut and dry...this is why you see God as a ruling God.

The beauty you are missing is that Thee is not a ruling God, this is why I dont use the polluted word God much, many think of it as a rulership.

Ive said it before and Ill say it again, the Bible is misleading the masses.

You say 'few' means that not many are saved through Christ.

Yet then you say, millions are.

So many are afraid to move pass the blood rituals.

My oh my, what a clever trick it is.

Sure, God could leave all the answers in a book, cut and dry.....Ive been down this road. For yrs. I preached what you preached, I had the best understanding of all the blood sacrifices and Holy Holidays you could imagine. I had great understanding of what it all meant. But something was not right, my spirit was not sparked like what I was expecting it to be.

I didnt change in a day, it took a couple yrs of much quite time with Thee. Through some spiritual experiences and new understandings of what was going on with this 'special book'....my spirit for the first time really 'soared'.

So many things just fell in to place. It was like a song being written with perfect harmony. Its like poetry. Its like birds singing. Its like the feel of wind on skin. ITS LIFE unlike what I never knew.

There are Hindus that ascend, there are other beliefs that have ascended. There are those who did find God without a book, there are those who did seek within and found Thee with their honest humble heart.

Be careful, God might want to show you something that isnt in that book...you just might miss it.

Shall we meet again tomorrow? Coffee or tea?

My best, always,
LV

A fast reply about Satan existing....

He exists as long as we allow him to do so.

Back to the mind...it is more powerful then what most know.

Our thoughts themselves are eternal.

If you dont give Satan credit, he has no strength. Men need to own up to their wrongs and stop blaming Satan for them.

Its a scape goat for why we must deal with sorrows and hardships, its easy to say its Satan's fault, or Eve's fault, or Adams fault.

The narrow road is not easy, but worth the toil.

If you have this much energy to talk spiritual things, you should be helping raise the vibrations of this world. Talk peace, unity, forgiving....

We are lamps unto the darkness.

LV

reply to post by tgambill


"****** If you find truth then why keep looking? Life is short to keep looking for answers, its time to find truth.'

So answers can`t be truth? We can seek whatever answers we want till the day we leave this life, it`s what we`re here for, to learn and grow. Not to be lead around by narrow minded people who believe all the answers are in a book.

"******Question? How many people have lived since the dawn of time? Billions, trillions? and not one has found God within himself."

And you know all these people didn`t because? Oh, that`s right, you have ALL the answers, don`t you? Let`s see, it was the book that told you this, right?

"I would wager not one has created a universe yet. Its hard to look for water in the bucket when you have a hole in the bottom. one must find the hole. Have it ever dawned on you that many millions have found peace, found God and are saved by him. They have.....its called Jesus Christ."

And they are suppose to create a universe for what reason? You keep saying that like a bad recording that`s in a loop. Sure, many have found God within. There are even many on this board who have, just ask.

"*****You have a soul. Satan is just influencial and thats all. You are more powerful than him by far."

Yes, we do have a soul, that came from the creator, not Adam as you think or believe.

"Don`t question anything the book says, if you do, you will go to hell."

*****Who have you been talking too.'

You, that`s your train of thought, that`s how you think and believe. Remember, it`s all in the book.

"God wants us to question and seek. You won't go to Hell for that. Whoever told you that is all wet."

Want a towel?

"*****Now that is pretty much true. So, you are saying we can make up our own religion and God will honor it?'

God or the creator allows us to worship in any way we want. Free will, remember?

"So, how about us believing in Hindu and Mormonism and we can live over and over and also inherit our own planet."

Sure, we can believe in him any way we want, i`m not sure about the planet, just being with the creator is enough, thanks anyway.

"This is essentially what you are saying. Who would want to be a christian when we can own a planet right?"

No, that`s what your reading into what I`m saying. Not once did I say inherit a planet, did I? Stop adding words that I didn`t say.

"*****You really want that planet or reincarnation?"

Again with the planet thing. Is there a reason you keep saying that? Are you stuck in that thought or something?

"Or, will he understand your own version and honor it?"

Now what kind of God WOULDN`T understand?

"*****We didn't come from God."

Oh? You, and those who think like you may not have, but the rest of us sure did.

'We came from Adam who sinned.'

Now, are you saying Adam created our souls? If you are, you are very out of touch with reality in a big way.

"We are human but God is sprit but became flesh in Jesus"

Just as Jesus was God incarnate, so are we. It was one of the many things Jesus taught.

"He is within us if we accept his son Jesus"

God is within us no matter what.

"******The book came from God and his love for us that we would know what he is all about. God is the word, and the word became flesh."

The book was written by men, just as all books have been from the start.












[edit on 10-1-2009 by FiatLux]

"He exists as long as we allow him to do so."

*****He existed before the universe was created for a purpose that God hand in mind. We cannot override the creator and we have no say so as to whether he exists or not. However, we are more powerful to resist any inspiration from Satan when we take Jesus as savior. Otherwise he wins in one of three ways as I mentioned before. Satan cannot do anything that God does not allow. He has to get permission to act. There is coming a time that God will take those written in the book of life and then Satan will have full rein.

"Back to the mind...it is more powerful then what most know."

*****Then tell me....after thousands of years, man hasn't accomplished anything beyond material creations? Satan/Lucifer shows supernatural tricks, the astrology, mind reading, parlor tricks to give man the facade that man is powerful. he is not.

"Our thoughts themselves are eternal."

****No, our souls are eternal and from the moment of birth we are an eternal entity. Our decisions will determine where we will spend our eternity based on Jesus christ...........

"If you dont give Satan credit, he has no strength. Men need to own up to their wrongs and stop blaming Satan for them."

*****Right, this is what free will is all about. He tempts us and we resist in accordance with Gods' Holy Word.

The narrow road is not easy, but worth the toil.

******Matthew 7:13,14 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."

Man becomes wrapped up in a world of pleasures, and it is not now a convenient time to attend to his soul’s salvation.
Another is occupied with his business or with the cares of life; hopes of gaining or advancing himself with his career or profession, and convinces himself it is not now a convenient time for him to attend to his religious needs.

There are many on the wide road or going through the wide gate but in the end there will only be an existence without God in a place the Bible calls Hell. Few find themselves on the narrow road or going by way of the narrow gate. Luke 13:27 says Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. The Bible tells us to 'strive' that is how important it is for our eternal life the find and receive Jesus so that when we leave here we will spend eternity with Him in Heaven.

There really is no other option, Heaven or Hell, which road are you on, which gate are you passing through. Hebrews 9:27 says And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

"If you have this much energy to talk spiritual things, you should be helping raise the vibrations of this world. Talk peace, unity, forgiving...."

****No, many will not be saved until we talk of the saving grace of Jesus christ. there is no other way. God told us this since even through the Old Testament.

reply to post by tgambill


"Our thoughts themselves are eternal."

"****No, our souls are eternal and from the moment of birth we are an eternal entity. Our decisions will determine where we will spend our eternity based on Jesus christ..........."

Now wait one minute tgambill, you are now changing your story. For our souls to be eternal, that would mean our souls came from God. When did you change your thought on that? Oh and by the way, yes both our thoughts and souls are eternal.

"If you dont give Satan credit, he has no strength. Men need to own up to their wrongs and stop blaming Satan for them."

"*****Right, this is what free will is all about. He tempts us and we resist in accordance with Gods' Holy Word'

So your saying it`s mans free will not to own up to their wrongs? I just want to get this straight.

"If you have this much energy to talk spiritual things, you should be helping raise the vibrations of this world. Talk peace, unity, forgiving...."

'****No, many will not be saved until we talk of the saving grace of Jesus christ. there is no other way. God told us this since even through the Old Testament.'

Wow, you can`t even pass on good thoughts on peace or unity and even forgiving? That`s pretty self centered of you. Your only out for yourself then. It`s all about you, isn`t it, to heck with others or even the world, right?

I can see that even if I give you the words of Jesus himself, you will not listen. Most of what you attributed to the teaching of Jesus is incorrect and with evidence from the Bible. Now you don't trust the bible but you trust what? ourselves? Now that is going well you think?

I'll leave you with your beliefs and let the Holy Spirit do the rest.........I've given you truth from the only book that is Gods Holy word. It free will to chose not to worship how we want.

"Now wait one minute tgambill, you are now changing your story. For our souls to be eternal, that would mean our souls came from God. When did you change your thought on that? Oh and by the way, yes both our thoughts and souls are eternal. "

****I'm not changing a story, our soul does come from God and our bodies that encases our soul comes from Adam. The body rules the soul as Satan entices our pain and pleasure sensese to tempt. A soul does not have this problem and our bodies puts us into our fourth dimensional existence. In essence, Jesus existed before creation and during the OT, existed and knew that one day he would have to enter our world to become sin because of man's rebellious nature. He stepped down from his heavenly existence in the time due, to become man and exist in our fourth dimensional existence. Death or the judgement day will release our souls to judgement. It is too late then to say, Oppps, I heard of Jesus, does that count? He will say:

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity (Matthew 7:22-23).

That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness (2Thes. 2:12)."

"Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin (James 4:17)."

"So your saying it`s mans free will not to own up to their wrongs? I just want to get this straight."

******its man's free will to accept Jesus as savior and repent of his sins to reconcile.

"Wow, you can`t even pass on good thoughts on peace or unity and even forgiving? That`s pretty self centered of you. Your only out for yourself then. It`s all about you, isn`t it, to heck with others or even the world, right?"

*****Don't kill the messenger, I'm just passing on the truth as God calls it in the Bible. His son, Jesus didn't die for nothing and then be raised from the dead to become our savior.

"Wow, you can`t even pass on good thoughts on peace or unity and even forgiving? That`s pretty self centered of you. Your only out for yourself then. It`s all about you, isn`t it, to heck with others or even the world, right?"

******Forgiveness comes from all of us for each other since Jesus forgives our sins so we should not be judgmental. I'm not judging, I'm passing on what the Bible says. Christians that judge others are wrong as only God knows the heart and he knows throught Jesus. God gets our words from Jesus as he is sitting on the right hand of God. When we accept him as our savior by our hearts and not words, he writes our names in the book of life. We repent, wholeheartely and he hears. There will be Popes, Priest, Pastors, Preachers and evangelist that won't be going to heaven. There will be murderers, adulturers, rapist, and prostitutes that will be going to Heaven because they accepted Jesus as savior, and he forgave them, never to sin again.........Its Jesus that is the ticket. Not good works or kind words, a scammer can do that just to make a show....politicians do it all the time............giving millions to the church won't get them a seat in Heaven but it will get them a first seat in Hell if they didn't accept Jesus as savior and repented of their sins. he gives us hope and confidence that he is in charge and all will work out for the glory of God.

reply to post by tgambill


"****I'm not changing a story, our soul does come from God and our bodies that encases our soul comes from Adam. The body rules the soul as Satan entices our pain and pleasure sensese to tempt. A soul does not have this problem and our bodies puts us into our fourth dimensional existence. In essence, Jesus existed before creation and during the OT, existed and knew that one day he would have to enter our world to become sin because of man's rebellious nature. He stepped down from his heavenly existence in the time due, to become man and exist in our fourth dimensional existence. Death or the judgement day will release our souls to judgement. It is too late then to say, Oppps, I heard of Jesus, does that count? He will say:"

Ok, the living essence that is our souls, does come from God then. You see, that`s the catch phrase right there. The living essence that is of God. That puts God within us, our souls, they are sparks of God. Sparks of life. Sparks of his being. Sparks of his energy, his life force.


"Wow, you can`t even pass on good thoughts on peace or unity and even forgiving? That`s pretty self centered of you. Your only out for yourself then. It`s all about you, isn`t it, to heck with others or even the world, right?"

"*****Don't kill the messenger, I'm just passing on the truth as God calls it in the Bible. His son, Jesus didn't die for nothing and then be raised from the dead to become our savior.'

No, no one is going to kill the messenger. But if that is how your God thinks, he`s all yours, you can keep him. Not many would desire to worship that kind of God. That sounds like a controlling God to me. "****No, many will not be saved until we talk of the saving grace of Jesus christ. there is no other way. God told us this since even through the Old Testament.' No, I don`t see God as being that hateful towards those he created, that only shows a lack of love on his part, and I don`t buy it, God is love.

"Ok, the living essence that is our souls, does come from God then. You see, that`s the catch phrase right there. The living essence that is of God. That puts God within us, our souls, they are sparks of God. Sparks of life. Sparks of his being. Sparks of his energy, his life force."

****We are separated from God because of our sinful and rebellious nature. In the OT, sacrifices were acceptable for his chosen. Once Jesus was brought into the world he became the lamb of God, and took all the sins of the world on his death and resurrection. Since he was sinless he is the advocator for us to God. That is why we pray to God in the Name of Jesus. Its not just my belief it is the way God set it up. I'm trying to tell you that we don't set the criteria. There is no other way to pray to God no matter what we would like to make up and recreate God. It won't happen. He didn't die on the cross for nothing.


"No, no one is going to kill the messenger. But if that is how your God thinks, he`s all yours, you can keep him. Not many would desire to worship that kind of God. That sounds like a controlling God to me. "

*****Not at all. He is just, loving and wants all to be saved. However, he has set up commandments and unless we would want another Earth he has something else set up. We as humans haven't been doing too well even knowing the truth. He knows the heart and he has commandments that we have to go by. Thats it.

"No, I don`t see God as being that hateful towards those he created, that only shows a lack of love on his part, and I don`t buy it, God is love."

*****It not hate it love and justice. He is not an enabler he also can become angry, jealous, but not in the way we look at jealous, and wrathful to those that disobey his commandments. God is love but love also means discipline and order.

reply to post by tgambill



"****We are separated from God because of our sinful and rebellious nature. In the OT, sacrifices were acceptable for his chosen. Once Jesus was brought into the world he became the lamb of God, and took all the sins of the world on his death and resurrection. Since he was sinless he is the advocator for us to God. That is why we pray to God in the Name of Jesus. Its not just my belief it is the way God set it up. I'm trying to tell you that we don't set the criteria. There is no other way to pray to God no matter what we would like to make up and recreate God. It won't happen. He didn't die on the cross for nothing."

We seperated ourselves from God only because we wanted to experience individuality in this reality.

Oh, and by the way, I don`t mind debating someone about religion, but you can cut the sermons, there not needed or called for.

"*****Not at all. He is just, loving and wants all to be saved. However, he has set up commandments and unless we would want another Earth he has something else set up. We as humans haven't been doing too well even knowing the truth. He knows the heart and he has commandments that we have to go by. Thats it."

No, I still don`t buy it. He`s still a controlling God, no matter how you slice it. Your belief in the Bible is just way to literal for me to accept.

"*****It not hate it love and justice. He is not an enabler he also can become angry, jealous, but not in the way we look at jealous, and wrathful to those that disobey his commandments. God is love but love also means discipline and order."

I think we as humans are the jealous, wrathful and angry ones, not God.

"We seperated ourselves from God only because we wanted to experience individuality in this reality."

****God won't understand and take excuses. Don't matter why, we did and it is separation no matter how you call it. "only because" is what will say to God on Judgement and he will say he never knew you. this comes form him not me.

"Oh, and by the way, I don`t mind debating someone about religion, but you can cut the sermons, there not needed or called for."

*****The so called "sermons" is my debate. Sorry, this is the way I have to respond and its not sermons because you call it. It is debating and my method will continue in this manner to get my point across.

"No, I still don`t buy it. He`s still a controlling God, no matter how you slice it. Your belief in the Bible is just way to literal for me to accept."

*****All I can say, its your eternity not mine, I'm just the messenger. Just because we don't accept his ways doesn't mean God the Creator will change for you or me.


"I think we as humans are the jealous, wrathful and angry ones, not God. "

*****Different jealous for God, and by his own words he tells us.

I'm an "occultist" in so far as I worship what christians would call "pagan" gods. And one of the several gods I worship is Satan. But I am deffinately not a "Satanist". As a Satanist would be a member of the "Church of Satan" and said church does not worship Satan they worship man.

I tend to believe YHVH fooled the christians and jews. I tend to believe that YHVH of the Old Testament is an evil entity.

What was it Satan did for us?

Oh yeah, he enlightened us. Helped us throw off our ignorance and know good and evil. Would you rather be ignorant? If so why are you here at this web site?

Satan is the ally of man. YHVH is our enemy.

I don't know about Christ. I tend to think he wasn't sent by either but was just another prohet of the "gods" like Budha or Mohommed(sp?).

For the record I worship the following gods in more or less this order: Eris, Hecate, Thoth, Dionysus, and Satan. He is actually last on the list but I priase his glorious name none the less.

Vas

"I tend to believe YHVH fooled the christians and jews. I tend to believe that YHVH of the Old Testament is an evil entity."

*****I can believe that I can fly and jump off of a 10 story building, but the reality is that my believe is cancelled out due to the reality.....and crash, splat.

"What was it Satan did for us?"

****Bring death, destruction and separation from God. That was a simple question.

"Oh yeah, he enlightened us. Helped us throw off our ignorance and know good and evil. Would you rather be ignorant? If so why are you here at this web site?"

****No, he enticed a disobience with God's commandments. The ignorance was disobeying a commandment from God. Now that is ignorant. Why am i here? to tell the truth....any questions.

"Satan is the ally of man. YHVH is our enemy."

here is their plan in a short while to look forward to. This is Satans ally. Satan/Lucifer is evil, and weak. He will be defeated in the end. Here is another Satan worshipper but his worship was for Lucifer, as Lucifer comes to man in three major ways. he is a liar, deceiver and evil.

August 15, 1871 - Now, can any thinking person doubt that the intrigue now going on in the near Middle and far East is designed to accomplish that satanic objective? Albert Pike himself foretold all this in a statement he made to Mazzini. Pike stated that after World War III is ended; those who will aspire to undisputed world domination will provoke the greatest social cataclysm the world has ever known. Quoting his [Albert Pike] own words taken from the letter he wrote to Mazzini and which letter is now catalogued in the British Museum in London, England; he said:

"We shall unleash the nihilists and the atheists and we shall provoke a great social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to all nations the effect of absolute atheism; the origins of savagery and of most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the people will be forced to defend themselves against the world minority of the world revolutionaries and will exterminate those destroyers of civilization and the multitudes disillusioned with Christianity whose spirits will be from that moment without direction and leadership and anxious for an ideal, but without knowledge where to send its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer brought finally out into public view. A manifestation which will result from a general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and Atheism; both ! conquered and exterminated at the same time."

"I don't know about Christ. I tend to think he wasn't sent by either but was just another prohet of the "gods" like Budha or Mohommed(sp?)."

******Jesus, was the only begotten son of God. The human manifestation of God in human form. He is the savior of mankind and was with God even before creation. He is God veiled in human flesh.

"For the record I worship the following gods in more or less this order: Eris, Hecate, Thoth, Dionysus, and Satan. He is actually last on the list but I priase his glorious name none the less."

ERIS was the goddess or spirit (daimona) of strife, discord, contention and rivalry. She was often represented specifically as the daimon of the strife of war, who haunted the battlefield and delighted in human bloodshed.

HEKATE (or Hecate) was the goddess of magic, witchcraft, the night, moon, ghosts and necromancy. She was the only child of the Titanes Perses and Asteria from whom she received her power over heaven, earth, and sea.

Thoth is an unusual god. Though some stories place him as a son of Ra, others say that Thoth created himself through the power of language. He is the creator of magic, the inventor of writing, teacher of man, the messenger of the gods (and thus identified by the Greeks with Hermes) and the divine record-keeper and mediator.

Dionysus was the god of fertility and wine, later considered a patron of the arts. He invented wine and spread the art of tending grapes. He has a dual nature. On the one hand bringing joy and devine ecstasy. On the other brutal, unthinking, rage. Thus, reflecting both sides of wines nature. If he choses Dionysus can drive a man mad. No normal fetters can hold him or his followers. Dionysus is the son of Zeus and Semele. He is the only god to have a mortal parent.

Satan is a synonym for the Devil. For most Christians, he is believed to be an angel who rebelled against God— and also the one who spoke through the serpent and seduced Eve into disobeying God's command. His ultimate goal is to lead people away from the love of God — to lead them to fallacies which God opposes. Satan is also identified as the accuser of Job, the tempter in the Gospels, the secret power of lawlessness in 2 Thessalonians 2:7, and the dragon in the Book of Revelation. Before his alleged insurrection, Satan was among the highest of all angels and the "brightest in the sky." His pride is considered a reason why he would not bow to God as all other angels did, but sought to rule heaven himself. The popularly held beliefs that Satan was once a prideful angel who eventually rebels against God, however, are barely portrayed explicitly in the Bible and are mostly based on inference. Moreover, in mainstream Christianity he is called "the ruler of the demons" (Matt. 12:24), "the ruler of the world" and even "the god of this world." (2 Cor. 4:4). The Book of Revelation describes how Satan will be cast out of Heaven, down to the earth, having "great anger" and waging war against "those who obey God's commandments and hold to the testimony of Jesus". Ultimately, Satan is thrown into the "lake of fire" (Revelation 20:10), not as ruler, but as one among many, being tormented day and night for all eternity.

Here are who the real gods and goddesses.......

Genesis 6, Sons of God, fallen angels. and their offspring the nephilim, They are the demons. they are also the ILLUMINATI, ORIGINAL.