occultism is just another synonym for spirituality.

Originally posted by crmanager
Christians love you, you demean them.

Where does the hostility come from to demean them in the first place? You say Wiccans are self-righteous but I think you need to put yourself in any minority belief system for two seconds.

Maybe all the social pressure to conform to the standard religion in this country, the threats of eternal damnation, things like that? Ever thought about it? You guys are condescending as all when you talk about this stuff, and you honestly expect people to just change their ways and conform to what you believe is right. Now THAT is self-righteous, literally.

Maybe you don't emphasize those things to people, but that's what stands out about Christianity to non-Christians. I'll testify to that myself. Those are the conversion points, even if only implied. You must be "saved." Saved from what? Hell, of course! Fear mongering.

Christians may think they're loving but the selling points of their religion are ultimately just threats and fear, and that's not love. You have absolutely nothing going for you that is enlightening in any way whatsoever. You are herded around by your fear like sheep until you die, just as out of touch with the world as when you came into it. And again, I say this as someone who has gained an immense amount of insight from "occult" (ie outside of your box) philosophies.

[edit on 23-12-2008 by bsbray11]

Most problems between Christians and Occultist/New Agers stem from simple semantics.

Christ is about Love and Justice. There are things that should be taken literally in the Bible, and other things that are meant to be taken symbolically.

The Bible is a foundational teaching - but to hear the true voice of God one has to invite the Holy Spirit into their heart. That is what makes God "living" - it requires an ongoing relationship with God.

As a person who was born and raised Jewish, thoroughly entrenched in the New Age for most of my adult life, and now a Christian - I hope I can serve as a bridge between people.

No, Occultism may not actually be Satanism - but Occultism is the larger umbrella FOR Satanism, and therefore, Occultists are NOT protected because Satanism has its way of sneaking into the minds and hearts (even UNintended) of Occultists.

The problem with Occultism, no matter what form it takes - is that it leaves each person THE GOD OF THEIR OWN LIFE. This means, that even as you preach "love and light" and "no ego" as New Agers often do - you are still NOT surrendering to the Most High. Because you are too focused on the idol-worship practices that keep the focus AWAY from the Most High God.

You only THINK you are being spiritual, by engaging in divination, channeling, psychic readings, astrology readings, tarot, etc. It's like being a kid in a candy store. It feels real good eating that candy - BUT WOE TO THE KID WHO GETS A TUMMY ACHE LATER.

Well my tummy ache came over 10 years later after I started my New Age journey. I was a full believer, and you don't want to know the pure DECEPTION, PAIN AND ANGUISH I experienced as a result of being led by my own desires away from my Creator.

There is nothing wrong with our own desires, as God puts desires in us to do his Will through us. HOWEVER - without God running your own personal show - YOU ARE LOST, PERIOD. There is no getting around this.

You cannot be your own God or Goddess - that is essentially a Satanic belief. God gave you LIFE - God gave you BREATH. You can't get around this simple fact New Age occultists. You will NEVER be your own Creator! The best you can be is a Co-Creator - but you are not a Goddess running around doing what you want! If you believe you are - you are immersing yourself in an immature spirituality that is keeping you from your Creator. THIS IS DANGEROUS - AND AN INVITATION TO SATANIC AND DEMONIC INFLUENCE.

You enjoy "love and light" but you don't understand the concept of JUSTICE. Occultism is an unbalanced, immature spirituality. And very hurtful to those who follow it. You have no idea of the demonic forces you invite into your life when you engage angels, "ascended masters" - all forces for Satan to lead you astray and confuse you.
!
What Occultists get is many FALSE PROMISES that never come true - tons of dangling carrots left hanging in front of you.

I thank God today that I was delivered from the false New Age path that hurt me terribly.

Originally posted by crmanager
You were told you were going to hell? Maybe? It was implied? They gave you that feeling they might say it?

The SCOUNDRALS!

I know, right?

Not only does it not mean anything to me, since I already don't believe in the nonsense, but I take offense at the condescension and lack of respect for what I do happen to believe. I don't care if someone thinks I'm going to hell. I think they're ignorant, frankly, but I don't tell them that. So why can't I be shown the same respect?

The New age movement, the Occult, and all that is associated with it is absolutely based on a Luciferian theology. If it is not of Jesus Christ it is based on Lucifer/Satan......

This is the basis for the New World Order.............soon to come and just as quickly dispatched by God following..............to destruction.

I have discovered that the New Age uses Occult terms, symbols, and tenants. Google this and see for yourself. Don't take my word for it. There is massive deception going on even in the Catholic church, Charasmatic movement and other Christian practices today. They are leading Christians from truth to the New Age beliefs. Hitler was into the occult. He was a member of the Thule Society. Now, I have discovered without a doubt, Nazism and the New Age Movement is exactly the same thing. Google this comparsion. It surprised me as well. Tenant for tenant the New Age Movement has the exact same platforms as Nazism. It is the way that the World Order will surface, according to them.

No where can it be said that Jesus tried or did teach occult teachings. He was God in Human form come to earth to take on the sins of man and through this sacrifice we are all saved from our sins if we believe on him. Jesus was God in human form and basically took his own punishment so that we might live and be with him through eternity when the Great Tribulation is over and Jesus reigns. This is the real truth of this reality.

God of the Universe gave us a love letter called the Bible written by eyewitnesses from the Old testament to the new that witnessed Jesus's miracles and raising himself from the grave. There is but one God with two different covenants separated by the Old Testament with the world under judgment and the new with the sacrifice being made and we are finally able to join God in eternity if we take, among others, Romans 10:9, and repenting of our sins as established by God.

I also searched for truth and found a litmus test. All movements, religions, to include certain Christian leaders that teach or express that man is a God or exaults man is a false religion. This is the common distinction.

The time is short and there will be many Christians, to include Popes, ministers, pastors, etc...that won't make it to Heaven. Jesus is the only way........check it out.

Originally posted by tgambill
No where can it be said that Jesus tried or did teach occult teachings.
[...]
I also searched for truth and found a litmus test. All movements, religions, to include certain Christian leaders that teach or express that man is a God or exaults man is a false religion. This is the common distinction.

I just posted two quotes straight out of the King James Bible above where Jesus says that men are gods. The same passages also show that the Jews of his time considered him a blasphemer and were going to stone him to death for it.

Is the King James Bible also occult?

I noticed your symbol...its linked with the Nephilim.....

Originally posted by tgambill
You read only the one verse. We are Sons of God, if we take Jesus Christ as savior.

He didn't say "Sons of God," he said gods. He said, verbatim from the KJ Bible, "Ye are gods." Who's not reading it correctly?

That is exactly what you just said determines if something is legitimate or not. Apparently the King James Bible is not up to your standards, and Jesus is not up to your standards, or else the conclusion you came to was rash. If you want to change the words around to fit your theory, then there is no use in even trying to have a logical discussion about it.

Also, there is nothing about "rapture" in the Bible. Not that something has to be in the Bible to be true, of course (think of all the things we've learned WITHOUT the Bible, like SCIENCE -- another tool of Satan?), but for what it's worth.

He raised himself from death, proclaimed his right to the sit on the right hand of God, and over 500 eyewitnesses to his appearance after death.

I'm aware of the literal interpretations of the teachings, but I find them ridiculous. Why the right hand of God and not the left? Without going into mystical or occult symbolism, what is the significance? Do you ever stop to think about any of this stuff?

Muslims?? you are right they are....

I asked you a specific question about some Muslims and you failed to answer it.

I noticed your symbol...its linked with the Nephilim.....

It's actually an ancient Jewish symbol called the "Tree of Life." And it's very metaphorical and symbolic, because that's actually how a lot of these teachings are supposed to be taken. That's how they serve to be educational and enlightening. Not by literally believing things like men being turned into pillars of salt or any other literal nonsense, that doesn't make any difference in your life whatsoever except to take the place of legitimate teachings and knowledge of the world. Those interpretations are worse than lies, fed to you by crooks.

Remember that the same people who held so many meetings to officially "decide" what Jesus meant, etc., also killed hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people (Crusades, Inquisition, destroying whole civilizations of Native Americans), all while one of the 10 commandments is "thou shalt not kill." So try to realize, the original teachings have been horribly abused and corrupted over the years, and all but totally lost, by the Catholic Church and later passed on to protestant sects, which suffered them even more corruption. The real knowledge transcends the book itself, was known to the ancients, and is truly a living teaching. The "NWO" uses it to their advantage because there's truth to it, not because they are willingly condemning themselves to "hell" (another tool of the Catholic Church), just as they save anything of value for themselves and only offer you the trash.

[edit on 24-12-2008 by bsbray11]

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by liveandlearn
Has anyone considered that the God they worship could be the the bibllical "god of this world" aka Satan.

I think many believers had to 'check themselves' to be sure. For me it was a no-brainer. Having met the devil, I know what he looks like, his character was like, and his tactics. Then knowing God, is the most stark contrast one could ever come across.

[edit on 23-12-2008 by saint4God]

Interesting, please, the next time you see Satan, take a picture of him and post it so we all may see it. So what did he say to you?

occultism is a doorway to satanism
smoking pot isnt doing heroin
but for some people they start smoking pot and end
up doing heroin its a slippery slope