California Check Points with Military Happening

reply to post by antar

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I get my facts from the fact that I am still involved with the military. My age is of no consequence, but if you must know, I have grandchildren.

As far as bars around military bases, you're ignorant. Some don't have ANY physical barriers, and I'll leave it at that....but they'll know if you trespass. I've lived on one like this, so I do in FACT, know. Come to think of it, I have YET to see a Marine Base with bars all around it. You can't put hundreds of thousands of miles of bars around bases which are open to the sea. That's just stupid. Where do YOU get your facts? The military is not low-tech.

And instead of arguing with me about what MP's know or don't know, go learn something about it first. It appears you just enjoy making up your mind without wanting to be bothered by details.

Let it go already. If you want to lose sleep over checkpoints in our little city, go ahead. Spin it into whatever you want. You'll be more in danger of an alien abduction than the likes of us coming into your home. Give me a break. I thought the whole mantra of this forum was to "Deny Ignorance"? You aren't doing that, you're promoting it.

There are PLENTY of conspiracies to be had out there...underground bases, black projects, etc. THOSE are worthy of conversation, but not this. As I said before, I've personally driven through a few of these checkpoints, and there is nothing to worry about. Even with the fact that I had a base sticker, they didn't come over to my car. ONLY when they encountered a military person driving drunk did they get involved. Policing their own, that's it. Marines take care of their own, good or bad, but if you've never served in the Marine Corps, you wouldn't understand....you can't even come close to understanding. You underestimate the very people you loath....one day, they may just save your sorry *ss from a REAL threat. Then what? You'll probably hide behind your computer and complain about how they did it.

You are buying into media propaganda, perpetrated by the media. Why are you here if you are going to allow yourself to be spoon fed by those with political agendas? I can tell you what they are, but you probably won't care about that either.

Semper Fi

the specific incident is not big deal.. and perhaps it is for the greater good , that said military should not be involved in any way shape or form in providing civilian law enforcement assistance or doing any civilian law enforcment UNLESS there is a state of emergency... This is how it starts .. little by little the acclimation of the American public to having the military police us.. wake up to all those that think its no big deal. it is beacuse it violates the posiss comitatus act which prohibits it.. unless you are unpatriotic and are into breaking up the consititution and the bill of rights.. this should be a big deal.

I for one being Canadian would like to know more about what they can
and cant do? For example you say that if it is a military person under the influence then they come in? does that represent them taking action on US soil?

Not trying to be overly questioning just curious as times are a strange these days.

Would border patrol really be an issue as it is related to National defence?

"Just the facts" all else is hearsay.


reply to post by emeraldzeus

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I would just like to add just one more thing:

We need threads like this. We need MORE threads like this. Threads like this are the exact reason that the mainstream media is suddenly coming out with negative press about websites like this, such as "conspiracy theory websites contribute to mental illness." They are now trying to spread negative propaganda about websites like this, precisely because we are the ONLY ones out there talking about this kind of stuff. We're either becoming competition, or the government is putting pressure on the MSM to "de-bunk" us.

(And isn't it funny that the media doesn't start to de-bunk anything until the issue in question starts getting a lot of attention...)

Instead of making the "conspiracy theorists" the bad guys, we need to insetad be asking important questions that aren't being asked. Such as this: Why are they (the mainstream media) NOT talking about this issue? I heard about the checkpoint originally this morning NOT from MSM, but from a blog. Then I heard about this from here. And that's it.

I'm watching the CBS evening news and there's nothing about it. I checked in with CNN.com all day and... nothing. Why not? This is huge. Or, I should say, it SHOULD be huge. The fact that the mainstream media is NOT up in arms about marines even being INVOLVED in checkpoints on Californian soil is surely cause for alarm. Why is it not??

How can the MSM be upset about political sex scandals and Brittany Spear's lack of undergarments, but they are NOT concerned aobut blatant violations of the constitution.
We have to ask ourselves, what happened to the good investigative journalism? Why aren't there any jounalists investigating this? Why aren't we hearing reporters talking about blatant violations of the constitution when they happen? Our press used to be the watch dog of our government, but now it has become nothing more than a giant PR firm, doing no more than regurgitating press releases and fighting to be "the first" on the scene. Forget the first...what happened to the best?

Our "free press"....TV networks, radio networks, and newspapers, etc... are now almost all owned by giant corporations who are concerned primarily with profits. They also want to avoid reporting anything that could lead to a possible crash of society as we know it because that could lead to a crash of the stock market, and they are all publically traded on the stock market. Our "free press" is no longer concerned with reporting the real news. We don't have a free press anymore. They sold out long ago, and right now what we have is the corporate press.


I guess what I am saying is that we....our country....the world.... NEED to talk about these things on this website and other "underground news" websites such as these, precisely for the reason that no other news station or news outlet is. If this event is nothing more than checkpoint training, fine. Let's find out. It doesn't make it right, but let's find out. Let it be investigated completely.

But this has the HUGE potential to be much, much more than just DUI checkpoint training. Like other posters have said, this has the potential to be...the beginning of a whole new way of using the military. Which is prohibited by the constitution. So, knowing that, why should we accept at face value what some government PR person says, that it was only training maneuvers. Where is press interviewing the CHP and the Marines who were involved? Why are there not real reporters on the ground doing some investigative journalism interviewing the cars that went through the checkpoints?

Where have all the real reporters gone? Oh yeah....their jobs get threatened when they want to report real news....so they move on to....."conspiracy websites."


(edited by myself for off-topic rant! LOL!)

[edit on 19-12-2008 by nikiano]

Why would the military need to observe for DUI in the first place. That is not a military duty.

I agree with all you said having lived in Palm Springs for a few years.

However; if/when you're ordered to, say, arrest a civilian, will you just lay down your M-16 and walk away? I think not ... you'll follow orders, just like the cops will when they're told to confiscate all legal registered arms in their area.

hmm it just makes me think that the government know something that there not telling the public at the moment.. maybe another terrorist act.. or maybe something else. sounds kinda suspicious.. but its also the time of christmas and it does get quite busy about this time also.. a lot of people out and about.

reply to post by nikiano

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I agree but I don't believe that is all there is to it. Our military men and women for the most part believe they are doing the right thing for our country, but, I doubt they really know the constitution. No offense in this because I only recently became aware of crucial points. However, could part of this also be gradual conditioning for our troops. Guy and gals who would never think about going against their own people.

Just a thought.

Never should a uniformed soldier be caught on active duty ion the USA. It is an abomination. the OBVIOUS reason was to get us willing and used to accepting a heavy military presense at all times and places for the eventual suspension of rights and end of freedom as we know it. It can and will happen when the NWO bosses decide the time is right.The Neocon traitors that pulled 9-11 off have gotten away with muder X4000 plus and are now ready to take it to the next level..they don't care who is in office: if a complete loser like the scumbag Bush can exist and commit the crimes he and Cheney have and remain free and alive, surely there is nothing stopping the juggernaut of evil from enslaving the mases to the profit of the few.

Cheney is arguable the most evil and dangerous man alive; the true Godfathers like Kissinger and Chemney and a few others...as well as the entrenched deep NSA/CIA/ Natnl'.Recon. etc types that have the big picture down and know they cannot alter the path chosen for us all.

Hey, it is more than clear that DEW was used on 9-11....no doubt at all...the physical evidence can be explained in no other way..and that means it came from within. And that means we are in deep crap....and on it goes.

reply to post by nahsik

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Good thought, about a possible terror threat.

But if there was a safety threat serious enough to warrant putting the Marines on a civilian checkpoint, wouldn't it be in the government's best interest to inform us, the general public, to know to be on the lookout for a specific threat? 300 million American's can do more than a few Marines a checkpoint.

Think of Amber alerts, and how many children are found by getting the public getting involved when a child goes missing instead of relying only on the police.

If there was a terror threat serious enough to warrant the Marines doing civilian police work, then they would have a better chance at catching the perpetrators in question if they asked us to be on the lookout for suspicious activity.

I just thought of something else....who does a DUI checkpoint training on a Thursday night?? Most DUI checkpoints I've seen were on Fridays and Saturdays....when most of the drunks are actually out driving. I don't think I've ever seen a DUI checkpoint on a week night, and I used to live right by a corner that the cops were always using as a checkpoint.

How much DUI training can you get on a checkpoint on a Thursday night?

It's not adding up.

[edit on 19-12-2008 by nikiano]

[edit on 19-12-2008 by nikiano]

reply to post by liveandlearn

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About the lower ranking troops not knowing about the constitution....well, on one hand that's a good point. Most of them are probably not constitutional scholars.

However...the more I think about it, I think they MUST know, at least, about the posse comitatas act for several reasons:

1. First, I'm sure that the order (or the approval of the order) for the marines to do training maneuvers with the CHP came from a high ranking officer, not a low-ranking troop who doesn't know the Constitution.

2. I would assume that that those people who desire to serve their country (and potentially give their lives for their country) are generally pretty knowledgeable about the constitution itself. We were taught about the constitution in high school, so I would hope that most high school grads know about the basic concepts of the Constitution, and what is legal and what is not for the military.

3. I would think that this particular aspect of the constitution....the Posse Comitatas Act.... would have been drilled into their heads in bootcamp. Don't you think?

Think about it. Imagine a well-intentioned good-hearted soldier who just got out of bootcamp and is on leave for a week. This soldier might come upon a civilian cop needing help, and they might be tempted to help since they are, after all, a trained soldier. If they are not informed all about the Posse Comitatas Act in boot camp, and informed from the beginning about how illegal that would be, and how much trouble they would be in if they tried to do that, it would result in mayhem. I am sure the Army, has, in all their wisdom thought about this potential scenario, and informed all their troops that they cannot, under any circumstances, get involved in civilian police duties. Don't you think??

Or am I giving the army/military too much credit here? I don't think so.... I know there are a lot of very, very smart people in the military. I'm sure somebody must have thought about that scenario.

However, about the troops getting "conditioned" to dealing with American civilians....you may have a very good point there.

reply to post by eyewitness86

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Eyewitness 86,

Excuse my ignorance, but what is DEW? I have read and heard a lot about 9/11, but I have not read or heard about DEW.

Could you tell me where I can read more about this.

This has got to be the most paranoid thread I've ever read here.

I work for a large California L.E. agency adjacent to one of the larger military bases in California. The MP's from this base have constantly sought out our advice on various investigative issues including the proper way to conduct a DUI checkpoint. They have worked closely with our department and at no time have they or will they taken independent law enforcement action off base.

The laws for DUI enforcement subtly change every couple of years and even military police need to stay abreast of the current changes. What better way than to observe the CHP, who does more DUI arrests than any agency in California.

There's no conspiricy here, but me telling you that isn't going to change your mind. The MP's arn't going to suddenly appear on the streets and start arresting people. They are police, just like the rest of us learning a better way to do their job.

reply to post by pd417

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Well, while I respect your opinion, I disagree about your suggestion that we are paranoid. Yes, a lot of this thread is speculation of what this could all lead to, but it's not necessarily paranoia.

Paranoia is when someone is convinced that someone is going to come after them, personally. I don't think any of us are worried about that. Informed concern is someone looking at recent events and saying "Hey, this is a violation of the constitution. Why isn't anyone concerned with this, and what could it lead to?" Then there is ardent passion for preserving the principles upon which our country was founded.

Passion should never be confused with paranoia. Were early American revolutionaries paranoid about England's policies of "taxation without representation?" No. It was happening right in front of them. They could have ignored it and looked the other way and said "Well, it's not such a big deal. What's a simple tea tax? Don't get paranoid about it....it won't necessarily lead to anything else." But instead, they got angry because it was wrong. And the anger created the passion to defend their way of life and say "no more." Thus, the revolution began and America was born.

However, I may be missing the bigger picture. You say that this is nothing. Is this practice common at your unit....for MP's to train with civilian officers by observing? If so, then how often does this occur? And when was the last time? Is there a protocol and an official history for this type of military-civilian joint training in the past ? If so, I would really like to know if I am blowing this out of proportion.

If you can tell me of specific protocols and policies for joint military-civilian police training on U.S. soil, or if you can give specific dates and examples of this happening in the past, that would be evidence that this is indeed nothing. Seriously...I can admit when I'm wrong.

However, if there isn't a history for this type of "police training by observation", and if this is new..... it could be something important. It could be a sign of a story behind the headlines, or it could be a sign of something more to come.

I will tell you an example of something that happened at MY work, for example. I work in a hospital and back in 2006 we had a en entire medical unit come into the hospital to observe us for a day. In my 15 years as a medical professional, in many different hospitals in areas all around the country, it was the only time I EVER saw that happen, or heard of that happening in a hospital.

We all had lunch together and I asked the guys why they were there. Most of them said "just normal routine training" but one of the guys in the medical unit told me that they were observing us because there was word that "something big was coming down the line" and made a reference to recent actions by North Korea. Made sense to me at the time, because I had never seen that happen before. It wasn't illegal, just out of the ordinary.

(Also, just an FYI, the military guys came to our work to observe us dressed in regular scrubs, not in military scrubs or military uniforms. It was very low key. If the marines were just there to observe the CHP, why did they dress to stand out from the regular police?)

So, I guess my thinking is that if the marines are going into the civilian world to observe how the "real world" (police) works, on their turf, then maybe there is word, once again, that something big is coming down the line.

Either that, or maybe they are trying to establish a military presence...to get us used to seeing them at checkpoints....little by little.



[edit on 19-12-2008 by nikiano]

While I just wanted to chime in and say I don't agree with this at all, however, I did find it a bit amusing that Lt. Beck was the commanding officer. Jericho anyone?

I checked with my Dad, who was big in the military, and he and all his military friends hang out and chat about military stuff, etc. etc. He told me that it certainly "is possible" that they were "just training" - and that would not be a violation of the Constitution, but he said that MPs normally do not need training on this... and even if they did... they shouldn't be training on real US highways. He said the more logical thing would be to bring the California Highway Patrol guys to the military base, setup a check point on base, and then train the MPs right then and there - on their own soil... since it's the military bases where the MPs would really only have jurisdiction. So he thought this whole thing "didn't sound right at all." On the other note, he said in boot camp they learned explicity what they can and can't do on US soil vs. a military base. So there's no excuse of "oops, we didn't know we couldn't be on US soil to do things."