One thing to remember is a good chunk of the few million in our prison/jails see that as just part of their normal life cycle. Life behind bars is not bad enough to make it a deterrent to change that cycle of some years in and some years out, repeating.

I remember when Joe down in AZ first put prisoners in tents and there was a big uproar over it. Once many realized those tents were the same tents our military used in desert storm that uproar kind of dwindled.

Whether the reason those people in jail is just or not it doesn't change that fact they are in jail for a reason, and if they were not in jail they would be force to pay for their food. We all pay for our food outside of jail...why should it be any different inside?


[edit on 18-12-2008 by Xtrozero]

Originally posted by HunkaHunka

Originally posted by wheresthetruth
GO JOE!

His policies and steadfast resolve of treating criminals like criminals is an inspiration. People shouldnt think of jail as a free vacation resort, it should be harsh and give them a reason not to commit major crimes again.

But where is the carrot to become reformed?

If we only use a stick, we make the criminal more of a criminal and feel justified. I agree we need a stick, but we also need a carrot.

Carrot for reform? We are talking about ADULTS who should take responsibility for their own actions and stop blaming EVERYONE ELSE.

Reform? Want reform? Then make these convicts WORK 8hrs a day while incarcerated and pay for their rent, food, etc etc to force them to be responsible for themselves and their actions.

As a criminal justice major....I for one believe the entire system needs an overhaul....but to appease to people who CHOOSE to break the law is 100% ridiculous. Dont hang around thugs that will put you in the wrong place at the wrong time. Dont break the law and stay out of jail. GROW UP and take responsiblity for your actions! While in jail or prison, dont be a screw up and get in more trouble *you = generally speaking.

DOUBLE POST

[edit on 12/18/2008 by greeneyedleo]

Originally posted by Djdoubt03
destroyed and the inmate is punished.
[edit on 12/18/08 by Djdoubt03]

So what punishment is applied in this case.... You are very quick to add that last part…

With millions of mail going into a jail all of it is looked at, and destroyed if need be without the inmate really knowing at all.

What punishment is there in our jails other than maybe isolation for behavioral issues?

A few things. First off the gov't(jail) is obligated by law to provide the necessities of life. Food, bed, air(not exercise, that's up to the inmate). Withholding any of these will get you a visit from the Ombudsman. Secondly, many inmates DO work. In the laundry, kitchen(s), we have 2. Running meals. Cleaning. In fact sentenced inmates that refuse to work are shipped out to institutions that are not as inmate friendly. "Sit in your cell and do your time." Most would rather work than that.

Originally posted by intrepid
A few things. First off the gov't(jail) is obligated by law to provide the necessities of life. Food, bed, air(not exercise, that's up to the inmate). Withholding any of these will get you a visit from the Ombudsman. Secondly, many inmates DO work. In the laundry, kitchen(s), we have 2. Running meals. Cleaning. In fact sentenced inmates that refuse to work are shipped out to institutions that are not as inmate friendly. "Sit in your cell and do your time." Most would rather work than that.

Yes, but is it also obligated by law to be free of cost for the necessities? Work as in taking care of your own house is work to a point, but it is not profit based work. My wife works to care for our house and family, and this work in the prison is basically the same in it is a resonsibility on the inmates part to up hold the proper living condition which is something once again we all need to do inside or outside of jail/prison.

[edit on 18-12-2008 by Xtrozero]

Just as you can teach a person with good morals bad habits, also you can teach a person with low morals a better way to be. Most americans are raised now with no wisdom and with no care for their social brothers and sisters, and they often forget that "there but for the grace of god go I" thinking themselves better than these others that they know nothing about.

One large reason that many americans can point to these criminals and talk of them lacking personal responsibility is they have no knowledge of the history of their own country, are unfamiliar with the policies set into effect that have limited the lower classes opportunities and rights, and since the 70's increased the prison population from 200k to over 2 million, the highest population in the world, while at the same time allowing our country to have one of the highest rates of violent crime in the world.

Common to american processes, they pick a method and stick with it, regardless of the fact that over almost 40 years it has failed massively and only made our streets and lives much more criminalized....and forget the fact that other nations have much more successful justice systems than ours with much lower recurrance rates, as that must just be a fluke...after all... WE are AMERICANS and we know best, despite what the statistics and results say.....nature must just have it backwards.

Originally posted by Xtrozero

Yes, but is it also obligated by law to be free of cost for the necessities? Work as in taking care of your own house is work to a point, but it is not profit based work. My wife works to care for our house and family, and this work in the prison is basically the same in it is a resonsibility on the inmates part to up hold the proper living condition which is something once again we all need to do inside or outside of jail/prison.

Sorry for not being clearer. I take a lot of this for granted. The inmates do that in their "Houses", read that cells. Most inmates are quite clean, they have to be or they will have to deal with the rest of the range. Remember, these guys are locked up together, they don't want someone else's stink on them. Then there's the "bugs". Filthy people, usually quite sick in the head. They are separated.

I'm referring to the "institutional" work. Lots of laundry, food to be prepared and distributed. Free of charge? To a degree yes. That's the law. You must provide the necessities of life. Perks can be removed though. Visits, TV, yard, etc. You're too off the cuff and you'll end up in seg. Which is all well and good for a short time but segregation for a prolonged time isn't fun even for a lifer.

yes but it must be effective. Honestly most americans in general have serious emotional issues, and i can tell you true that most americans fail to find fulfillment wisdom and satisfaction even late in life because honestly....there is not even much guidance and treatment for regular americans, much less prisoners. Rehabilitation must incorporate not only the ability to learn a trade, but also massive amounts of psychotherapeutic processing to help these people understand what led them to those actions in the first place.. I can tell you that even the healthy americans i know have very little true insight into their motivations or addictions.

America has the highest prison population in the world. Yet also the abso-
lute biggest crux on earth in American government extort the whole west-
ern world (via Federal Reserve & banks)bringing it to their knees and make everyone suffer to the brink of death. The rule of law was never
anywhere. Stop trying to find it. There is no righteous, as long money rules
the world. The one who has the gold, rules. But the funniest of all is, that
these gold diggers are just tools for satan, the reptilians, Anunnaki remnants of evil, who actually rule the elite, who is so stupid & will never
figuer it out. Humans are simply food for the reptilians. Humans are not
smart enough to respect each other, unite and simply starve out those
evil underground cancer.
Wars and prisons are the delivery systems to these lazy glottenous insane
evil, satanic bastards deep inside the earth. Stop, trying to go to Mars or
Moon, explore what is right under your noses first & actually see, what
fools we all are made out to be, grazing cows we are.

so what happens when someone can't pay and is left to literally rot in prison or does everyone not want to hold onto the last shred of the ban on cruel & unusual punishment? Like the point was made earlier even by the OP, many people in jail don't even deserve it, now you want to make them pay money that they can't earn back to be in there too? Yes, sounds like great idea America...let's just keep turning back the evolutionary chart on ourselves and get rid of compassion all together! Let's bring back stoning and cutting off hands while we're at it too since everyone seems to be so starved for imposing suffering on others...

Originally posted by Marked One
And in some instances; the war on drugs is a joke.

It always has been my friend. And unfortunately, it always will be. We all know this though. It's pathetic.

[edit on 18-12-2008 by The Scarecrow]