Originally posted by CameronFox
My opinion in regards to the NIST investigation violating the National Fore Code? They did not gain jurisdiction to the crime scene until a major part of the clean up had been completed.

I agree with this 100%. It was not NIST. It was Guilliani's office that decided to "scoop and dump" I believe.

Like I said, I can't blame NIST for their lacking. I have to write reports on buildings I haven't physically been on sometimes. Going from just a person's notes and pictures. It's difficult. Now, imagine NIST with hardly any evidence.

Originally posted by CameronFox
Angel. Have you asked Griff his opinion on the physics involved in the collapses? I think Griff who is one of the smarter members in the 911 forum, will disagree with what you witnessed.

No. I could care less what anyone else "thinks." We are all entitled to think whatever we want. Truthers cannot disagree with each other? What does griff truly know about physics? I have no idea so what would his opinion mean to me about it?

Unless General was there, you can not ask him what he witnessed.

That is the point, silly. He was not there. He did not witness this. He should not discuss as if it were a fact that he had first hand knowledge of. Don't tell people all about what was "really" going on when you are no more credible about that they are.

However, if you read the NIST report, there were many reports of people smelling jet fuel, and firefighters seeing pools of jet fuel in many areas of the towers. Evacuees: (NIST NCSTAR 1-7A p. 17)

Yeah yeah yeah. I believe people smelled jet fuel. Everyone knows what jet fuel smells like right? The NIST report was a joke! You cannot use that toilet paper to back up a point to me. Sorry.

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo
No. I could care less what anyone else "thinks." We are all entitled to think whatever we want. Truthers cannot disagree with each other? What does griff truly know about physics? I have no idea so what would his opinion mean to me about it?

Good answer. I like people who think for themselves.

Not that I'm saying Cameron doesn't.

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo


No. I could care less what anyone else "thinks." ...... Truthers cannot disagree with each other? .......

Well, I agree with you to a point. Perhaps I should have reworded my statement. Griff, is a qualified person when it comes to structural engineering and the physics that go along with it. His expertise lead him to believe that laws of physics were not broken during the collapses of at least Towers 1 & 2. In addition to Griff, I don't believe there has been one person that has shown any laws to be broken. (I could be mistaken)

Personally, since my education did not lead me down the S.E. path, I have to rely on the numerous professionals of that field. The same way I would find the appropriate doctor if I were to become ill. If serious enough, I would seek 2nd and third opinions from professionals in that area. (cardiac, pulmonary, etc.) This is what I did with the WTC collapses.

Truthers do not typically agree...only that it was an "Inside Job"

That is the point, silly. He was not there. He did not witness this. He should not discuss as if it were a fact that he had first hand knowledge of. Don't tell people all about what was "really" going on when you are no more credible about that they are.

When you have 73% of the evacuees (North Tower) stating they smelled jet fuel, kerosene, etc... That should giver you a pretty good idea as to what was going on. If you want to ignore the NIST report and the people that were interviewed, that of course is your prerogative. You can't however just hand wave the countless statements made by first responders that smelled jet fuel and saw it at the base of elevator pits and in the elevators themselves.



[edit on 20-12-2008 by CameronFox]

Originally posted by CameronFox
Oh, good ol' Richard "boxman" Gage. He is clueless and has even admitted to being in over his head. He is not a fan of mine. U2U me if you'd like and I will tell you what happened.

It is not that easy. That website was not about the guy who made it but the many many statements from engineers that contributed. Just saying, as long as you put one up, ok here are a couple more. See how it works. So griff was complimented by someone you respect. What if someone I respect calls griff an idiot and Gage a genius? See what I am saying? The person that I respect the most on this subject would be me. I guess we will just have to call me wrong because I am not providing personal info to anyone at some website just to gain the respect of strangers.

Originally posted by angel of lightangelo

It is not that easy. That website was not about the guy who made it but the many many statements from engineers that contributed. Just saying, as long as you put one up, ok here are a couple more. See how it works. So griff was complimented by someone you respect. What if someone I respect calls griff an idiot and Gage a genius? See what I am saying? The person that I respect the most on this subject would be me. I guess we will just have to call me wrong because I am not providing personal info to anyone at some website just to gain the respect of strangers.

Richard Gage is the founder of this group. He travels the world going to speaking engagments representing A&E For 911 Truth. Does he represent everyone there? I wouldn't think so, yet I would have to assume the vast majority of them agree with him. Griff is a member there as well and has stated his displeasure with the group.

To date, there is only one member there who has contributed anything to the collapses on 911. All the rest of his group have done nothing. No papers have been submitted for review, heck I don't they have listed anything original.

If someone calls another a genius or a schmuck on the internet, they have to prove it either way. The substance of their claims are what is important. You can be a structural engineer light... or you can be a dish washer at McDonalds. The proof is in the pudding.