Why is evolution the counter to Jesus?

*laughs*

too funny...

is that 2 lines....

LV

reply to post by funky monk

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Thanks for your answer but this thread is not about proof of god, or even about people making sense. It was about the point being made by Christians in another thread. I asked for proof of their christian god and they asked me to prove evolution.

I do not see what evolution has to do with proving or disproving god other than to distract from the inability to answer the question that I had posed.

I wanted to talk about god, scientifically. I did not mention creation theory or the origin of life, just the concept of god. Why did Christian people feel the need to counter my question by asking me to prove evolution to them?

Instead of clutter that thread arguing with them about it, I started this one so they could come here and explain how disproving evolution will prove their god to me but I guess they are either cowards or lack the conviction of their words.

Christians proof for God is faith. That's all they can really tell you.

Evolution does not disprove God. It disproves creationism. That is not off topic you just can't connect the dots yourself.

You are responding to an explanation of the discussion in another thread. You really are having trouble with the topic here. Please go to that thread to discuss that topic.

reply to post by angel of lightangelo

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mmmmm, the way I see it is that there is a lack of defination in terms of creation and evolution. When people say evolution do they mean that theory where everything evolved from bacteria or whatever. Or do they mean the theory where everything is always adapting and evolving based on its surroundings? - the last one I have almost no problems with. But the first I cant come to grips with because it doesnt really explain how everything came into existance. But with the second you can fit that idea into the bible nicely.
So to try and answer a little better. Im assuming that some of the christians on the board automaticaly keep going on about evolution because either:
they dont understand it
they didnt read your question right
they are just looking for a good argument or
its one of the topics brought up by most atheists so that has just become the default responce

reply to post by funky monk

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Yep, but dont you think either way, asking me to prove it as a response to asking about god is kinda silly?

I think Fundamentalist Christians are afraid of evolution, as it represents tangible evidence against the authenticity of their holy book. There is scientific evidence that they're incorrect in how they believe the life on earth was formed and hence they feel threatened and have the desire to repress, ridicule and attempt to suppress it.

Speaking as an Atheist with Agnostic leanings i find this somewhat amusing, i mean the majority of Christians see the bible as more of a poem, a metaphor for creation (at least here in England) and fully embrace science.

Well, either:
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."
or God is not our Creator and our rights come from God or they exist at the whim of politicians.

Evolution diminishes our Rights, because it means they do not come from God. What God gives, only God can take away. What the politicians give, they can take away, and will when they feel they need to.

I suppose you don't read your own Bible then... If you pray in God's name and ask anything, he will give it to you. There are multiple scriptures which say exactly that...
All I ask is all that would be if the God of the Bible did exist.

What would you need to consider Zeus existence? The lightning would be proof to many of his existence, so why would you dare deny their proof? What would you need? I'm sure you would need a sign or miracle or at least a logical reason to believe. Not only are there no signs and miracles where God is concerned, but there is a serious lack of logical reasons to believe, and many logical reasons not to believe.

Yep.
And when they say "Satan" they actually mean "God". And when they say "God" they actually mean "pink ponies".



So how does the whole - Adam coming before Eve thing work out? Adam can't reproduce on his own, so if he didn't get a female counterpart until after he evolved into a human, then he wouldn't exist .
Something tells me that might put a small dent in your theory - unless of course you continue to do more of what you're good at - assuming.

reply to post by angel of lightangelo

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" Unfortunately, this thread is for those couple that contend the opposite to be true. "

Well,

alrighty then.

I hope it goes as you hoped for. :-)

Nope. Your still missing the point. Don't feel bad sometimes it takes a few times for all of us. This is not off topic, you just still aren't connecting the dots.

The title of your little thread is, "Why is evolution the counter to Jesus?".

Well, evolution disproves creationism. It does not disprove the existence of Jesus Christ or a God. Evolution disproves the theory of creationism (God created us as we are today). If this is off topic I think everyone else in this thread is having trouble following your ill logic.

lol... A majority of scientists are atheists/agnostic...
Many scientists throughout history were creationists because many people throughout history were creationists...



Wow... I just threw up a little in my mouth. How is it that people continue to fall for this?
No, Einstein was NOT a creationist. At most he was a Deist. He, as many scientists, used the word "God" as a word for the universe and the laws it encompasses. Some of his quotes were examples of him being polite towards creationists and were taken out of context...
I believe he was an atheist, though he may have been a Deist.



But what about the leading scientists?
Most are atheists either way...



Sounds familiar .

Maybe it's still going because you keep poping your head in here after saying you won't, and maybe it keeps going because you say something that is completely false - thus tempting those more knowledgeable to correct you.
Take your pick.



Oh yes... I've had morals all my life, but if God exists, then I'll have to follow the faith. I'll have to kill others for not believing as I believe. I'll have to kill gays for disobeying God. I'll have to make sure that children who disobey their parents are properly slaughtered.
You're absolutely right - I don't want to 'change my life'. I guess I'm just not the killing machine that your God is...

reply to post by angel of lightangelo

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I don't know what Christians attack people for asking questions. I am a firm believer in God. I have no doubts in my mind whatsoever that God exsist. I don't think that Christian people should attack others. Jesus didn't attack people, he simply gave them answers to their questions. Besides, how can we know if we don't ask. I like Romans 1:20.. " For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse. Also, John 20:29 ...blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
It's not that we can only believe because we can see, Faith is believing without seeing. Just knowing that God is real and to give Him praise, for His name is holy and worthy to be praised. I don't wind and I don't see air, yet I know they exsist because I can feel them, Just as I feel God with me. Believing in a God that holds the power of death, hell, and the gave in his hands seems like the right thing to believe to me. God is Almighty and He has 100% control of all that he created because he created everything and everything is under him. I don't know how to say anyone can prove there is a God. We cannot enter into heaven and bring him down and show him to people. But he is there and he is real. God is alive and he sees all, he knows all.I know this because I believe and God has revealed himself to me through grace, through the holy spirit that can be felt. If the facts are that God isn't real because he can't be seen, then that would make wind and air not real. They can be felt ( just as God ) but not seen.
I mean, Jesus Christ suffered and died for us, out of love, how can anyone reject that kind of love ? It is a free gift, all we have to do is receive it in faith. I don't know any more to say then that. Knowing that God exsist is all I need to know and I do know !!!

reply to post by angel of lightangelo

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It would be hard for a 'non-believer' to know about God or even have the slightest idea of his exsistence. One has to believe and know that God is real through faith NOT PROOF. God doesn't owe us anything ~ God has the power to prove himself and in due time all non-believers will see him and they will know that He is real after all. People can't mock God and get away with it. I am a firm believer in God ~ I am a firm believer that Christ Jesus is King of kings and Lord of lords. I believe that Jesus died for our sins, I believe he was dead and lives again. I believe that Jesus is seated at the right hand of God the Father right now, waiting for his time to return to this world and put all this wickedness to an end once and for all. I don'tknow why people can't just believe without proof. We have never seen air but we believe it's real ~ we can feel it just as we can feel God if we would just allow him to touch us when he reaches out to touch us. God touches people and God helps people and God DOES answer prayers. People can't see him and so they think it's impossible for him to be real. That's why we should read his word and know that Romans 1:20 is very important to believers and could be to those that don't believe.

reply to post by angel of lightangelo

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But I didnt ask you to prove anything. lol.

Evolution is certainly not a counter to faith in god.

I actual don't understand how intelligent people who have a understanding of the laws that govern our lives (and i mean scientific ones) could even consider that there was not some grand creative force with a plan of sorts.

Now I don't think Evolution is the ultimate answer to life, but even with my faith in an intelligent design of sorts I couldn't even begin to understand how people could buy the creationist stance.

The scriptures where never supposed to be taken literally, I have studied some of the esoteric meaning behind the old testament and the jewish faith and whilst i do not agree with the tenets of rabbinical jewdiasm either I cannot for the life of me comprehend how the modern christian churches managed to pervert or lose so much of the knowledge that they had to the point that they present such crap to the masses.

Better I think to ask why the christian church felt it necessary to side with creationism as a way to protect itself from questions it didn't want to answer.

There is nothing wrong with you guys having a belief in god, or even putting stock in the teachings of yeshua, but that doesn't mean you have to be ignorant about it, if your faith is worth protecting it will stand the light of day.

Erm what ? Believing in God = obeying the laws of a power hungry human institution, nooooooo thats not quite right sorry.

We as a species where put here, or raised up from the common animals. for a reason, why don't you intelligently help figure out what that is, and perhaps go about doing it, your role may well be different from my role, your path is your own you certainly don't have to do what any church tells you to do, you can find a teacher of spiritual practises that resonates with you or go your own way, by the words of the religions of the book, god is unknowable by that definition they cant claim any "rights" over knowing the divine will.

People need to get over the idea that God is an angry old man sitting on a throne in heaven making up rules on how we should live our lives.

These are dark times and as we know most people are sheep, the seek the protection of the group, they want someone to lead them and tell them how to act and what to do, but the people who tend to end up leading are the conmen of this world, society is so messed up, you don't have to have faith to be a moral person, I don't believe that when I did I will go to heaven or hell,
though I believe they exist on one level, on another they don't.

They are tools used to lead the herd.