So, if withdrawl is what you consider total defeat, what is your idea of vicotry in this situation? Permanent occupation?

There is no win here for the u.s., period.

so its another Vietnam

bomb the crap out of the country for years then tuck your tail between your legs and run away

ok wait

is this true?? iraqs on its way to being over?
the usa is leaving iraq?

is this REALLY true??? and why isnt it all over the news?



on a side note remarking a previous posts comment on 2012


that really is interesting

i dont remember the details or where i read it but i believe somewhere in some thread on ats there was something about king solomons treasures or something like that being lost in the area of iraq/middle east somewhere and that there was this conspiracy with hitler and the germans in ww2 having something to do with king solomons treasure and all of that had something to do with 2012 or something

im not really sure and i dont remember the details but if that jogged anyones memory and you know what thread im talking about or have any info on that can you link it please? thanks

Give me a break.
Saddam is gone forever.
The country is now strong enough to decide to take things over.
the fighting is falling off and the US can now leave.
hmmmm..

Yeah complete Defeat alright!

seems like there is another thread like this so I will copy what I posted there.

Concede, lost?

This is like a no win situation with you guys as far as the US is concerned. If the language of this agreement had been total opposite of what it is, you still wouldn't say the US won or the US won major concessions. You guys would be bashing the US as Bullies, Imperialists, and any other similar words you can conjure up. So no matter what way this agreement was written up and agreed to, ya would still find fault with it.

I guess I am in the minority and see it as a good thing. Our troops are getting out of there by a certain date. And yes they're leaving with a victory. They have worked hard to secure the majority of that country and now it is up to Iraq to keep it that way. The rest of the stuff in that agreement is not important to me because I don't know what the US wanted out of this deal. All I know is the deal they agreed to. I know the article says Pentagon sources but it doesn't name them. These sources could be Pentagon janitors for all I know.

both of these wars are Obama's now.

if we lose he is going in the history books right along side Bush.

Obama is in a lot of trouble in Chicago right now.

I can't think of the last President who had a scandal during the transitional phase?

Pretty pathetic.

Does it matter if we call it defeat or whatever? The only thing that counts is that they get the hell out of there!

We won the war in about 2 weeks....

This is just ignorant. Us leaving and turning everything over to the Iraqis is how it was supposed to go all along......so I would consider this a victory considering we accomplished what we set out to do. We were never supposed to occupy them for forever..

Originally posted by ConservativeJack


Obama is in a lot of trouble in Chicago right now.

He is? What happened? I know you cant be talking about the Governor tryng to sell Obamas senate seat. You couldnt be because Obama had nothing to do with that and is in no trouble what so ever and has spoken out against the actions of the Illionois Governor.

It is up to the governor to appont the replacement for Obamas senate seat. Its not up to Obama in any way shape or form. The Governor is accused of trying to sell the seat. Obama isnt involved in that scandal at all.

That said you obviously cant be talking about the attempted selling of Obamas seat, So what trouble do you refer too?

[edit on 13-12-2008 by gimme_some_truth]

I just hope ths is true. We should have left a long tme ago. Its not possble to win an occupation. It turned into another vietnam the way we handled it. We have forced our will onto them long enough. Saddam is dead, Their old government is dismantled. Iraq had nothng to do wth 9/11. Why we have continued to stay I just dont know.Perhaps Bush doesnt want to be the one to withdraw the troops and show how little he actually did over their.

I dont know. Its just time to bring the troops home. Its been time.

I am happy that most of our troops will leave that sand pile!

But DEFEAT? Please son...

That is like saying we left Gemany & Japan in total defeat after WW2 as most of our troops came home with only a few bases left there.

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth

Originally posted by ConservativeJack


Obama is in a lot of trouble in Chicago right now.

He is? What happened? I know you cant be talking about the Governor tryng to sell Obamas senate seat. You couldnt be

[edit on 13-12-2008 by gimme_some_truth]

I am referring to that. The governor will bring as many people down with him as possible.

Let the story unfold, but Obama has his hands on everything in Chicago and to think otherwise would be denial.

Originally posted by ConservativeJack
I am referring to that. The governor will bring as many people down with him as possible.

Let the story unfold, but Obama has his hands on everything in Chicago and to think otherwise would be denial.

Denial of what? Obama had no say in who the Governor appoints. He had nothing to do with the governor attempting to sell the seat.

He is in now way shape or form involved in this scandal. He is accused of nothing, because he did nothing.

Trying to pin him to something he had nothing to do with and wasnt even aware was happening is sort of ridiculous. You might as well try to pin Charles mansons crimes on John Lennon because Charles Manson wanted to be a musician at one time.

Obama has nothing to do with what the Governor did. He wasnt aware it was happening. Obama is not accused of anything. He is not involved in any type of scandal.

Obama has even made a statement against what the Governor did and said the governor should resign.

The governor has not and will not attempt to bring down Obama with him. If he does nothing will come of it because, as Ive said, Obama wasnt involved in any way shape or form and has spoken out against the governors actions.

To be perfectly honest, you are the only one I have seen attempt to bring Obama into that scandal. If the Governor accuses him of being involved he might as well accuse him of traveling back in time and fighting for the south in the Civil war.

Obama was not involved in the governors scandal. Suggesting otherwise is just silly.

So yeah, as you say, let the story unfold...


[edit on 13-12-2008 by gimme_some_truth]