reply to post by TruthMagnet
So you consider this recent Decline of Western Civilization working well?
Surely this question is frantically off topic.
Who said anything about western civilization? I was talking about liberal democracy.
Even Jefferson felt that a Democracy was a crazed sort of Mob Rule - while Plato dismissed it as the lowest most unproductive form of
Jefferson, a member of the elite of his time, had a natural antipathy for the great unwashed; an antipathy, incidentally, that I share. However, he
was too intelligent and decent a man to stand against the progress of ethical thought and the currents of history.
As for Plato, whose Republic was greatly informed by the evil social practices of the Spartans he so admired, his political ideas were as cockeyed as
his philosophy. Sadly, they appeal to a certain kind of mind. Humanity has had to suffer the awful consequences of that ever since Plato first
invented - or, if his own claims are to be taken at face value, regurgitated - them.
I am a proud elitist and have always been. I am also a committed democrat. The positions are by no means incompatible.
As for this 'decline of Western Civilization' you're talking about, I fail to see any evidence for it. The consumer society is not western
civilization. The fact that no-one will let you buy toys on credit any more is not a prefigurement of Doomsday.
It is true that most people are ruled by their emotions - and that they tend to be petty and self destructive as a group.
All people are ruled by their emotions. The thoughts they have arise from their emotions. Studies have shown that information processing and
decision-making are autonomous brain functions that take place before
the conscious part of the brain is even aware of them. Free will is an
illusion. There is no such thing as rational decision-making. There is only post hoc
I propose that the intellectual, benevolent, ellite seize power and through new scientific advances lock the cycle in place - before the
unethical, self-serving, criminals suceed in doing the same.
How sad, and potentially tragic, that after millennia of bitter experience there are still suckers all over the world who fall for this line. You'd
have thought the successive, rapid and catastrophic failures of every social experiment based on it would have taught them better.
Right now, an 'intellectual, benevolent elite' has seized power in Thailand. Under its rule, the Thai Navy is towing illegal immigrants out to sea
and casting them adrift with (essentially) no food, water or communications equipment, to die by the dozen of drowning and thirst. That is where these
elite experiments of yours always end.
I intend to see this through to the end!
Good luck. Meanwhile, work on your spelling. We're big on spelling, we members of the "ellite", and we'll bust you back to Hoipolloi Third Class
if we find howlers like that in your membership application.
[edit on 4-2-2009 by Astyanax]