Teacher tells 7 year-olds Santa's Fake.

I don't see any difference in children who believe in Santa Claus and Adults who believe in God. Same thing. The Children don't realize Santa is a made up legend, and the Adults don't realize that God is a made up legend.

You can prove Santa is not real, you cannot prove that God is not real. That's why religion is a matter of faith and not knowledge, and that is why neither you nor anyway else will be able to prove God's existence. You either believe it or you don't.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by Totakeke]

reply to post by SantaClaus


I think you are taking it just a bit too far. Just because someone doesn't want to lie to their children doesn't mean they have to go rushing to tell them all the horrors of life.

I have told the story of Santa Claus to my children.. I just don't tell my children they better be nice or else no presents from Santa Claus. I don't tell them he is ACTUALLY coming at midnight to leave them presents. I don't tell them he will eat cookies and milk if they leave it out. A story is a told as a story...... Santa Claus is a whole ritual of getting kids to believe something that is not true.

As far as MY beliefs, that is different. I do not tell them about Jesus in the santa claus way that is taught these days. I do occasionally tell them a story about Jesus (though I don't use the name really) AS a story.

I DO read them the Bible and my 7 year old reads it to me, but I do not tell them what to believe. That is between them and G-d. I put my trust in G-d because I have been given reason to. They put their trust in me because they have reason and in that sense, I am teaching them to trust G-d by being that parental figure to them in whom they can trust 100%.

In other words, I am leading them to G-d through my actions rather than my words. I plant those words of wisdom in their heads, but I don't tell them what to believe. As their parent, I am who they need to trust and believe in at this time and they can't do that if I am lying to them.



EDITED TO ADD: I also would never tell my kids they won't get a present/gift if they are not good. That teaches resentment and anger. A gift or a present should be given from the heart.

Disciplining a child SHOULD have certain chores and or deeds that have a reward system, but those rewards should be laid out to your child clearly that it is a reward. It is never a good idea to bribe or tempt your children with matters of the heart. Always lay out the reward system AHEAD of the good verses negative behaviour and be consistent.

The acceptance of the lying and the conditional gifts could play a large role in why so many adults today feel lost and don't believe in a benevolent G-d. Why should they when the examples of G-d's character have failed to SHOW G-d's character to their offspring?



[edit on 11-12-2008 by justamomma]

[edit on 11-12-2008 by justamomma]

reply to post by rjmelter


Ah, so then we are only suppose to believe in one thing that we can not see, right? Who are you or anyone else to say that these other things don`t exist? Do you know that for a fact? And when these kids grow up, and something bad happens in their life, they are not to hate anyone for making them believe in God? Because that has really happened before. A friend of mine who deeply believed in God had a bad accident that killed his wife. He was mad enough that he hated everyone that talked him into going to church. So let`s just say it works with every little story we are taught.

Good for her. I think it is atrocious that parents teach their kids to believe in this make believe crap in the first place. The first grip of Christianity on to a child is the lie of Santa Claus. The next is the lie of the Easter Bunny. And people wonder why most Americans cannot discern the truth from a lie. We are all groomed for that from a very young age.

But what did the teacher say about Jesus? Dun dun dun......

Originally posted by rjmelter
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

Your ignorance has just been revealed... The God of the diff religions doing this and say this or that is made up... yes. There was and is a creator though. the deeper you look into your cells the more eternity you will find, this wonderful creation is just proof of something.

HAHA!!

Ok buddy. No Santa Claus.. But There is a Creator!

Yes the deeper you look into your cells, the more eternity you will find. You can keep looking too, as I have, and you will never find a personalistic entity which is behind it.

The entire Universe is based on a few basic principles from which through emergence become an abundance of matter and other sub principles. It's beautiful... It's gorgeous even, but it's not objectively anthropomorphic. I admit, there is a beautiful ecstasy that one can experience as they contemplate the manifest Universe and experience it as a persona subjectively. Use your Illusion... that's something I'd encourage, but don't sit there and call one persons illusion a lie white at the same time defending your own illusion, no matter how real it may feel to you.





[edit on 11-12-2008 by HunkaHunka]

that's something I'd encourage, but don't sit there and call one persons illusion a lie white at the same time defending your own illusion.

I feel like I'm repeating myself. God cannot be proven, He cannot be disproven. Santa, however, is something about which there is no doubt humans created. God is a grey area. Everyone has their different beliefs, and that's fine, but when it comes down to it, God and Santa are in two extremely different groups.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by Totakeke]

reply to post by justamomma


I dunno justa... To be honest, I had a great time with it as a child, and my son enjoys it. Although I'm sure he knows its a ruse.

As I mentioned earlier, my Step Dad has been santa claus for 50+ years and does amazing work for children and disadvantaged families. It's kinda sacreligous to be anti-santa where I'm from.

I think this is correct - end the lies we give to children. We need to start teaching our children how to use weapons from early years. The revolution is coming - they will be unprepared when the black kids from Africa have been using AK's for years man..

Jees - we need to train up else we gonna die mother.

What Santa is not real?

I knew this at 6 years old because I found the presents hidden in my parent's attic. I played with them and put them back. For a year or so I viewed Mom and Dad to be major liars. There was never a revelation from me that I knew.

For the teacher, eh not major but, why bother when some children can't take this kind of news. But it is the truth. Santa is somewhat of the true religious figure for children. At least until they get way too nosy.

Originally posted by Totakeke

that's something I'd encourage, but don't sit there and call one persons illusion a lie white at the same time defending your own illusion.

I feel like I'm repeating myself. God cannot be proven, He cannot be disproven. Santa, however, is something about which there is no doubt humans created. God is a grey area. Everyone has their different beliefs, and that's fine, but when it comes down to it, God and Santa are in two extremely different groups.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by Totakeke]

Santa cannot be disproven. Simply because some folks wrote a story about him. The same is true of God. A buncha folks wrote stories about their subjective experiences and you want us to postulate that they might actually describe objective realities?

Belly of whales?

Parting of seas?

Giant pillars of Fire?

TALKING DONKEYS FOR CHRISTS SAKE!

Puhlease... Santa fits right in there with God as something men wrote about, many believe in, and which causes a range of emotions in the humans who become aware of it.

There is no gray area.



[edit on 11-12-2008 by HunkaHunka]

Santa cannot be disproven. Simply because some folks wrote a story about him. The same is true of God. A buncha folks wrote stories about their subjective experiences and you want us to postulate that they might actually describe objective realities?

Okay, I suggest trekking up to the North Pole and looking for Santa. Then try to find the elves and the reindeer and the workshop. You will find none. You cannot just walk somewhere to prove a religious being exists. You either believe in it or you don't.

My daughter is 11, and I let her believe in Santa until she was 6...mainly because it seemed like "the right thing to do". Once I became more inclined towards truth (in all respects) I thought it best to not make her believe in untruths...and like an earlier poster hinted to, it has made it easier for her to exercise her reasoning abilities more.

A lie is a lie is a lie. Santa, Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, Omnipotent SkyDaddy...why would you purposefully deceive your own children? It will affect them in later life...and they will develop trust and honesty issues in many cases. It is a form of child abuse...and it's hard for me to understand how any parent can't see that.

Besides, I like that my kid knows I'm the one giving her gifts...and that I'm the one she has to answer to regarding "naughty or nice". If it feels good for you to give (the spirit of the season) then why would you give credit for your giving to an imaginary fat man and his imaginary flying deer?

Just my $0.02

--J

Originally posted by Totakeke

Santa cannot be disproven. Simply because some folks wrote a story about him. The same is true of God. A buncha folks wrote stories about their subjective experiences and you want us to postulate that they might actually describe objective realities?

Okay, I suggest trekking up to the North Pole and looking for Santa. Then try to find the elves and the reindeer and the workshop. You will find none. You cannot just walk somewhere to prove a religious being exists. You either believe in it or you don't.

Not so... I might believe that Santa, as an Elf, is actually a multi-dimensional being, and that accounts for the lack of finding him at the North Pole.

Like wise, I might also believe Genesis when it says that there is a seraphim with a blade of fire which moves each direction a man can go and it protects anyone from actually finding the Garden of Eden.


I can't believe you actually want people to believe in Talking Donkeys and Magical Gods but not Santa Claus.... Sure... those things MIGHT be real..



[edit on 11-12-2008 by HunkaHunka]

I can't believe you actually want people to believe in Talking Donkeys and Magical Gods but not Santa Claus.... Sure... those things MIGHT be real..

Well, I believe what I want and you believe what you want. As for "talking donkeys" and "magical Gods," I suggest stepping down off the pedestal and maybe respecting people's beliefs a little bit more, because honestly, you're being rude. Everyone doesn't have to believe what you believe, right? We can all coexist peacefully and believe different things.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by Totakeke]

reply to post by justamomma


That I can back. While we may not agree on this particular subject 100%, I really respect that you raise your children like that.

I don't think I would have ever found true faith if my parents hadn't allowed me to find my own religion. They didn't force anything in terms of belief, so I grew to be a thoughtful, continually growing human being.

All I'm saying is that my belief in Santa didn't really affect how I grew to become this person!

Originally posted by HunkaHunka There is nothing wrong with a legend which brings joy, no matter how untruthful it might be.

There is nothing more ironic then hearing that on ats.

Ignorance- the lack of knowing
Knowing- The recognition of fact
untruthful- the hiding of facts.

your statement- Its ok to hide the facts, as long as it brings joy.

So I guess the theme here is apply a double standard for children, so that one day they can grow up to realize you were shielding them from the real world.

Now here is a Santa that knows how to ride into the sunset in style.
Although he would wake up the folks up as he rode through town.
Anyway, I hope ypu all have a Merry Xmas!

www.month2month.com...

Everything that we face our childern will face in the future...all the wars, hate, racism, death etc etc. I would want my childern to enjoy there childhood as much as they can because they will face hell in the future.....besides I don't think when they are 21 they will get mad because their parents lied about Santa.

This is what happened..

Teacher's statement paraphrased to how it was perceived by the parents: "Your parents are liars. They lie to you, Santa is one of these lies. Your parents can't be trusted, they have been lying to you for years. Your parents are liars. What else have those liars been lying to you about?"


- The poor kids will be sent home wondering if they can ever trust Mommy and Daddy again.... with the teachers assurances that they can't be trusted.

*SANTA = DEBUNKED *MOMMY and DADDY = LIARS