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Victims? Is it karma? Is this karma? Is this the will of God?

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posted on Dec, 8 2008 @ 09:42 AM

Originally posted by Sonya610
Metaphysically speaking love and hate are two sides of the same coin. They may seen like opposites, but in fact they both involve high emotion, obsession and attachment.

what a definition of love!? i think you make confusion with passion which can become egotistic and destructive indeed.

i mean saying love is obsession and attachment is terribly egotistic and i would almost feel sorry for the people you love if it is about that. i know very well, my mother is like that.

real/true love is not that selfish.

[edit on 8-12-2008 by ::.mika.::]

posted on Dec, 8 2008 @ 10:23 AM

Originally posted by ::.mika.::
what a definition of love!? i think you make confusion with passion which can become egotistic and destructive indeed.

Both are intense emotions that cause one to FIXATE on the other. To be attached to the other even if we don't want to be. The opposite of love is not hate, it is apathy.

If you can't see that, fine. I will not argue about it.

[edit on 8-12-2008 by Sonya610]

posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 07:41 PM

Originally posted by Sonya610
OP I think you are mixing up your religious philosophies here. You are referring to Buddhism but using the Hindu definition of Karma (i.e. paying for deeds in a past life).

Buddhism = can change his way of thinking in one lifetime if he chooses to do so

Thank you for explaining that
Dealing with one lifetime is easier rather than what Hindu's believe:

Hindu’s believe in the “wheel of karma” which dictates the path of multiple lifetimes.

Hindu beliefs does my head in... really, in trying to understand the experience within a Hindu concept, it perpetuates the 'responsible cycle' as HulaAnglers wrote:

Originally posted by HulaAnglers
In some circumstances karma explained, has been used on purpose to isolate and silence, to further the victim's torture

How can anyone try and deal with maybes? For my own sanity, I am now dealing with facts. What I know this lifetime and I have to reject the maybes that go with the possibility of a past life.

I think some of the beliefs that have influenced me are very damaging. The onus upon me to forgive is very hard.

My Sister would tell me, just forgive... she is a devout Christian BUT I honestly believe that was her way of not dealing with it.

The moment I started legal action, her attitude changed... like 'yeah, you do it'... but she still forgives. What that tells me is it is easier to forgive and she would rather I deal with it for her.

Originally posted by the siren
If you were punished with sexual abuse then I would say: no! You were most definitely not brought up in a Christian home.

It is very sad... I suppose this is how cults retain power over children and women... reciting scripture, twisting it to suit their agenda.

Whenever I read about individuals being abused within a Church org; I often wonder if scripture was used to support their terrible actions?

[edit on 9-12-2008 by Thurisaz]

posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 08:07 PM

Originally posted by woodwytch
The way I see it most people who suffer emmence life-trauma fit into one of two catagories ... 'sinkers' and 'swimmers' ! And whatever choice the individual chooses you need to know that every single person who has been in a position like yours (or mine), including those who have suffered more than us (and believe me there are many), all have the ability to become a 'swimmer'.

I am tredding water at the moment...but that is good! I am not sinking!!
Thank you for your inspirational words.

But let me tell you a little secret ... without my awful experiences and all the effort involved, I would not be this person I am now. I turned the negativity of all that had gone before into strength ... and you can too.

Yes, I was thinking about this last night, trying to get in touch with who I was before the experiences, well that is rather futile because I was a child at the time and then I felt angry because, at times I felt like my whole identity/personality revolves around these incidences.

It is hard to build a life and develop my personality. The only thing I can do is keep the positives and develop my character. It is so hard though, because at times, the default me... is reactive. Then at times I resent who I am now because of it... but again, I have to sift through it and retain the good...

If you want to chat or ask me anything send me a u2u. Woody

Thank you Woody!

Originally posted by juveous

- my only insight is that - when we cannot come to understanding why we were or are victims - we look for answers elsewhere, to the point of creating an excuse to blame ourselves.

Yes, I am starting to feel this makes it ten times worse but what else can we do?

I think it is a human condition to want to find answers, understand certain things. The WHY question can never be answered. So I just have to accept it.

Perhaps it is easier when the perpetrator becomes accountable for his actions then apologies, even provides a reason. But how often does anyone get that kind of closure?

[edit on 9-12-2008 by Thurisaz]

posted on Dec, 9 2008 @ 08:26 PM

Originally posted by teklordz
Part of the problem of people who get hurt in this life or suffer in any way or form comes from the astral entities (dead people) who crave on the energy we loose when we "think" or experience something.

When people will realize that that thoughts do not eminate from our brain, but from another dimension of ourselves, they'll start to understand the extent of the manipulation that is going on. Manipulation is everywhere...
From birth, school, jobs, friends, and finally, by the memory of the human race.

Wow thank you for your insight.

I had read previously that astral entities can interfere but had not considered that this kind of thing could be attributed to them.
There is a thread about astral energies somewhere on ATS so will search and read up, thanks!


Originally posted by Simplynoone
This is really hard for me ....

Thank you so much for sharing. Honestly, when I read what you wrote, I just shook my head. Even now as I respond I am shaking my head. Your experiences are so sad, so shocking... and I shed tears over what you shared.

That day I decided I would forgive myself ...but first I had to forgive those who wronged me

I think people are hardest on themselves. Forgiving myself has not been easy but I am working towards it. As for forgiving the person who did these things, I am no way near that point. A counsellor once told me forgiveness wasn't absolutely crucial. She said, there were three choices:

I could forgo, forget or forgive. I chose to forgo it. It seemed the only option at the time because I wasn't ready to forgive and could not forget it.

I have since found out that about 4 out of 5 of my friends have also been molested this is more common than many are even aware of ..(they are all about my age )

You are not alone in what you have been through ...I dont think that makes it any easier for you ...but I wanted you to know that it can be used for the good

The statistics are terrible. I wish it weren't so.
It does help to know, a problem shared is a problem halved? I am not sure of the exact saying but I feel there is truth to it.

[edit on 9-12-2008 by Thurisaz]

posted on Dec, 10 2008 @ 03:37 AM
reply to post by HulaAnglers

A star for your post; you are so, so right.

I live in a country where most people are either Buddhists or Hindus. Everybody believes in reincarnation and karma, and the results are unbelievable inequality, social stagnation and the further victimization of those who are already victims.

The concept of karma is used to justify the existence of the caste system; to condemn the sick, the poor and the handicapped to lives of rejection and misery, because, after all, if they are in such dire straits it must be their karma and therefore they must deserve it; and to allow corrupt officials, thuggish politicians and bloodsucking Brahmins and Buddhist monks to live lives of privilege and luxury.

Karma is filthy superstitious nonsense, another religious-conservative mind-control technique. Sure, the things we do have consequences, and the consequences can rebound on us in sometimes appropriate ways - but one look at the world is enough to tell us that it doesn't usually work like that. In any case, you can't believe in karma without believing in reincarnation.

I agree with another poster who said that this thread shows just how much misery religious belief can cause. OP, cure yourself of religious faith and your feelings of guilt and helplessness will vanish like snow in the desert.

posted on Dec, 10 2008 @ 10:45 AM

Originally posted by HugmyRek
Should you forgive them? No, never. Never forgive a rotten sob--what have they done to deserve it? It is not your duty to forgive, and you'll find it alot easier to move on and be helpful to others if you stop toiling over this one...

For me, forgiveness means letting go. Holding onto negative emotions is only bad for your own soul - it doesn't hurt the arsehole who perpetrated the crime.

Unforgiveness, bitterness and thoughts of revenge are like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die.

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