The saying "Do not judge another man until you've walked a mile in his shoes" really applys here.

Say we're hanging out, and I tell you something spectacular about myself. I am "The Son Of God", and you say "okay whatever", but you still hang out because the party is a flowing. You have your inner established "signs" events you expect to see. Just as Judas did. However when you fail to see these events, you start to doubt. As Judas did.

Judas was sorry, that was reflected by Paul's telling, he could have been forgiven.

When I was a kid , I read the writings of St. Paul and I can remember thinking that he seemed to be advocating and teaching things , diametrically opposed to the teachings and examples set down by Jesus. It took the rulings of Constantine and the ramblings of Augustine to complete the sabotage.

[edit on 9-12-2008 by aethernaut]

I dont know what to think just because its on a site doesn't means its true in the world. I still believe Judas as the betrayer of Jesus, and i do know that Judas felt ashamed his doing. And even through the money back. But Jesus still said that it was better for him not to have been born.


Second I do believe Paul as a righteous man. His beginning was not good. But he changed. But I do believe that there are scripture most in the new testament that are questioning at the least.

We were talking earlier of Sophia and I thought I would add this from The Gnostic Society Library in my own words (excuse it if I translated it incorrectly in any way!):

Once upon a time there was a land called Chaos but Chaos was not the first creation. It came out of the land of Shadow (darkness), and out of this came matter.

In this land were many divinities that would leave a legacy of characteristics that would be known as: Faith, Wisdom, Jealously etc. Some of these entities gave birth to others and they would form a big family of divinities.

Early on; Pistis made herself known and her mark would be Faith. She gave birth to Wisdom (Sophia) and the two would often work together. Sophia would become the veil that would separate the heavens from the earth, and mankind from the heavens.

Pistis lived in her realm of light. And she would make visits outside of her realm and check everything out. Well, she realized that Shadow was envious because there was something stronger than it. Matter came oozing out of Chaos and she decided to blow this matter everywhere!

Out of this would appear a ruler or a new prime parent: Yaltabaoth. He would use spirit to create a footstool that he would call earth. He then went on to create all the heavens with the earth. He then had sons and one of them was called: Astaphaios. He created heavens for each of his offspring so there came to be 7 heavens and 7 forces.

Now, each one of his offspring had a female name and a male name. Astaphaios had the female name of Sophia. All of them were androgynous including himself.

But not all was right in this heavenly kingdom. There was an enemy down below and this caused quite an uproar. Hence, Pistis cast this bad character down to Tataros. This led to the heavens and the earth being consolidated through Sophia - Yaldasbaoth daughter.

Yaldasbaoth, creator of this heavens and earth was an arrogant, entitled, and at times; foolish - ruler. This did not set well with Pistis. She scorned him and let him know that there was another being far greater than he.

The irony was his son Sabaoth would become the greater ruler and one that was more righteous. He would be called "Lord of the Forces." All the other divinities were jealous of him because of his light and power given to him by Pistis.

He created his own government or congress, with his own angels with special roles and names. He has a divinity named Jesus Christ sitting on his right side and on the left - his virgin spirit. He sits upon a throne of light within a great cloud that covers him. Sophia (the daughter of Pistis) is the only one with him in the cloud.

Yaldasbaoth the prime parent got really jealous and created death and this begot 7 bad forces who would in turn become a demon realm and its poisonous characteristics, being both female and male.

Sabaoth's team would go on to create female and male forces that would represent 7 good forces.

Hence, good and evil would be part of the Chaos and would divide into many renditions that would be manufactured by man, and would be incorporated in its many maxims of religion and philosophy.

we must always remember the roots of Christianity, and Gnosticism, which would be Zoroastrianism.

Zoroastrianism was the first religion to have a black&white worldview, whereas before, there were always shades of grey.

of course, there were always bad guys and good guys, but sometimes the bad guys did good things, and the good guys did bad things, and sometimes they did things that made no sense, and sometimes they were evolved and godly, and other times they were lecherous and mischevious.

Zoroastrianism eventually spread in the Persian Empire, and influenced the Old World religions, begetting religions like Mithraism, the precursor to Gnostic Christianity.

the key concepts of Zoroastrianism are thus:

1. there is a Supreme Being, aloof from the universe. he is called Ahura Mazda.
2. Ahura Mazda created Angra Mainyu and Spenta Mainyu, who interact with the world, and correspond to Light, Good, Spirit (Spenta) and Darkness, Evil, Matter (Angra). This is the origin of the modern version of the relationship between God and the Devil.
3. These two will build armies of angels and demons, and recruit as many human souls to fight on either side. this culminates in Judgement Day.
4. on Judgement Day, Ahura Mazda destroys the Army of Darkness and receives the Army of Light into the Kingdom of Heaven.

does all this sound Familiar? it should. remember that this came about long before christianity.

judaism of course was extant, but in a very different form, and was very influenced by the Monotheistic Revolution of Akhenaten, who was Pharoah during the slavery of the Jewish people, and 'Hebrew' is derived from the Egyptian 'Khibiru' for 'Slave'.

for the Hebrews, Satan was a minor figure, usually playing the role of one of the Sons of God, particularly one that happened to dislike humanity intensely, and was always trying to get God to wipe us out, or otherwise punish us.

Jews traditionally didn't beleive in the christian concept of hell. they beleived in Shaol, which was where ALL the dead went, and was generally an awful, boring place underground, but not specifically a punishment, just a fact of afterlife, as it were. no tortures or fire, just dusty, boring greyness. sounds like a bummer, huh?

Other sources for the rituals and ideas we have in Christianity:

Hinduism. yes, Hinduism! Bhakti practices for instance. let us take the example of Krishna: a deity that comes to earth to rid the world of demonic influence every 5-10,000 years or so, and is also a god whose worship consists of devotion and love, like Jesus.

Catholics and Baptists: Hindus have been using Rosaries and Baptising in their sacred rivers for many thousands of years before Christ.
a name of Krishna is Krista. notice the similarity between the word 'Christ' and 'Krista'.

it may surprise you to find out that many sects of Vaishnavism (the Hindus that worship Vishnu, the parent deity of Krishna) recognize Jesus as one of the 'Avaatra' or manifestations of Vishnu on earth. a reincarnation of Krishna!