ok and what the hell is up with all of you on this board


seriously look and think about what you're saying im still on the 1st page and astounded at what im reading

people are even discussing the fact this kid might have deserved 1000 "punishments" (i say "punishments" because we dont know what really happened and im not jumping to conclusions like so many are hypocratically doing)


this kid is freaking 8 years old if he DOES deserve or DID deserve to be hit that many times, THAN AGAIN ITS THE PARENTS FAULT

this kid was that bad that 1000 punishments were deserved, yet this child had no history of mental health problems or check ups or anything like that of the sort

jesus people think about what you're saying and you'll realize it makes no sense

these same people talking about social services

if this kids 8 and has that many problems why arent the parents getting the kid help

if the kids still a screw up after 500 beatings dont you think a normal parents would try something different? try a doctor? try social services themselves?? something? anything?

but theres people on here sitting here calling this kid names??

what the hell is wrong that you people dont see the hypocrisy in each statement

maybe the kid was wrong
maybe the dad was wrong

but like everyones preaching, wait for the facts to come out before you start calling 8 year olds names

i mean seriously arent we grown adults??

yet we're online calling kids names?

this thread really has me disapointed in several of those in the ats community

Originally posted by RogerT

By the way, your avatar is a 'fighter' jet and your byline is thread-'killer', so yes, my best guess is that violence is in there somewhere.

Well, to be fair - since it's a game you seem quite happy to play - you have a dog in your avatar. Shall I start googling-up some stories about chavs in Britain menacing or attacking people with dogs. Are you a chav? Is there 'violence in there somewhere' too?

I'm not particularly keen on avatars with guns, soldiers, weapons &c in them but ultimately, they don't really mean that much, or rather, they don't always have to mean that much. What's the quote? "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar"? I mean, what do you think I stand around in a pond all day?

Let's stop all this personal sniping and stick to the story at hand.

i dont think ive ever seen a thread derailed to this extent before, i pray no new ats members ever view this thread as this is not the light i would like ats to be shown in

i am truly disapointed in all but a select few in this thread, and honestly some of the only people on this thread that posted anything on subject or even reasonable are some people whos views i completely disagreed with in other threads

it is absolutely atrocious that it took 4-5 pages for this thread to be told to get back on topic


the majority of these posts seem to be trolling at the definition of the word


the topic at hand here is murder

a 8 year old murdering 2 adults

the circumstances leading up to this event

the subject of this thread isnt whether spankings are right or wrong
its not about how to discipline or not

whats its about is what made a 8 year old kill 2 men?

now please lets get on track here and stop the trolling back to back nonsense

im not a mod but i feel like im in a room with nothing but 8 year olds with all the hypocrisy in this single thread

the few of you who were on topic and mature with your posts, thank you, the rest of you, please lets better ats

Originally posted by Merriman Weir
Are you a chav? Is there 'violence in there somewhere' too?

Of course there is, but I'm not pretending there isn't and at the same time justifying violence to children

The posts may appear to be personal snipes, but the intention is to highlight the pervasiveness of a particularly nasty side of our nature, which is to use violence to get what we want.

I am suggesting that slapping, however justified it seems in the moment, helps to reinforce and perpetuate the cultural acceptance of bullying/manipulation by force.

Given that this child did exactly that, (use violence to achieve an aim) and claims the father did the same, makes the posts right on topic and totally relevant, albeit a little thinking/reflection may be required.

The avatar comments were an afterthought which I admit I should probably have omitted. Yes I was stretching. Shame this has now become the focus, but then arguing over some inanity is one way to avoid confronting one's shadow.

[edit on 1/12/08 by RogerT]

i was smacked as a child because i was a little # at times lol
but i had fair pearents if i was good i got treats if not got a smack.
any way i never had any incline what so ever to right down how many times they smacked me or when theses smackings occorud now for some 1 of 8 years old to right that down surely they had to be more than a smack on da ass or a clip round the ear hole
still the kid shouldnt have killed people but the police wouldnt have paid him any attention any way

sorry about spelling and gramer im dislesic

peace batch

As far as legalities, the boy will not be convitcted of anything. He cannot contract with the court, as his age is proof he cannot understand or accept a contract. You see, our so called 'Government' is nothing but a business, a corporation, and everbody knows you cannot contract with a minor.

Mark my words, there will be no conviction in this case and any plea deal would be unlawful.

Originally posted by Canadianduder
That kid was just doing what any man would do.

It's a shame what abuse does to children, and I am glad this child was able to end his.

This kid should be treated as a victim, nothing else.

He even documented the abuse as best he could until he couldn't take it anymore - then he excercised his 2nd amendment right and he took up arms against his attackers, whom he slew in self-defense. God bless him. If this was England, or another disarmed country - he never would have had a chance.

[edit on 30-11-2008 by Canadianduder]

I guess first I will address the hypocrisy of this statement. You justify one amendment and yet condone the loss of another. Sorry pal it's a package deal. Second what did the other guy do to deserve death? And probably most importantly is that obviously 1000 accumulated slaps was not near enough to teach this child discipline. You know the media version of what happened and you base your slander of the constitutional right to bear arms upon that premise. Oh God I am glad the whole nation is not so gullible otherwise we would all be shackled and chained already. You are the exact reason the government uses the media, because it actually does work on some individuals. I'd bet my last dollar if this kid smashed out your car windows you would sure as hell condone him being slapped. As far as his abuse goes, he hasn't seen anything yet, I imagine he will not remain anal retentive until adulthood now. Maybe the father should have used a switch instead like my parents did. I certainly did not want to shoot them for it and I was a pretty bad kid and got punished often for my behavior. But then again maybe I should have documented every time I got punished, and used that as justification for killing someone without offering a reason as to why I got punished, not to mention that even if I did, who could challenge that, the only other person who has information was murdered. I want to pose a question to you; can you look back through a short period of history and locate when the children of this world became out of control? If you said right after the government took the parents right away to discipline their children, you are smarter than I gave you credit for. I remember when my daughter was 16, and I NEVER USED PHYSICAL DISCIPLINE with my children, was punished by not being allowed to use the car she threatened to call the police and say I beat her. My response to her was, go ahead, then you can be placed in a home where you are not loved, so please save me some money and call your friends at the police office, and don't forget the car you think is yours is in fact mine and it stays here. Needless to say that her spoiled behind made the right decision.

Even though it is distasteful for some to admit we all are just the "Human Animal" The younger we are the more instinctual we are and unfortunatly for us all the majority believe we are better off throwing that instinct out the window and relying on what society teaches us to do or the so called civil reactions we should have to certain circumstances.

An 8 year old boy will only know right from wrong if he has been taught right from wrong. If an 8 year old is taught right from wrong will he understand the consequences of his wrongful actions?

This child may have an opportunity to have a normal life with some counceling and a loving family. Anyone who is smacked so often that they begin to count the smacks is near the breaking point. Temporary insanity.

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
I get so sick when I hear people say "Well your child doesn't have to like you... you are their parent not their friend". These same people wonder why peers have more influence than the parents. That's because yes your children do have to like you if you expect them to want to be like you.

Wisdom in that paragraph, especially the last sentence which I felt the need to repost and highlight so no-one would miss it.

Thank you. I feel better now

It takes a wise parent to know that every child is different and responds to things differently. Some can be spoken to and they respond to that, others can be denied something, or even be spanked on occasion if so required. Of course 1000 smacks would seem to indicate it was daily which is unacceptable.

I know I'm fond of telling stories about people I know but, this applies.

I have a cousin named Chad that was raised in the "do anything you want home". His parents tried to raise him in the deny something and talk to him routine. If they denied the television he would put a hammer through it. If they denied a bicycle he would steal their car. If they grounded him he would wait till they were at work and sell their things or leave home anyway. When they tried to speak with him and explain things he would curse at them and break things, aka kick doors off hinges, throw food at his mother, set fire to furniture.

He came to stay with my parents for a month or so and tried to pull off the same stuff and yes my parents swatted him one time and to this day he is respectful towards them and even asked if he could move with them permanently (his mom wouldn't allow it). He has been in trouble with the police multiple times and even has told my parents that he wishes he could've stayed with them and his life would be better now because he needed someone that wouldn't put up with his crap.


My cousin Angie is very different, her mother would sit down with her and explain things and she would burst out crying. That was her only punishment as that worked.

I got swatted a very few times and that was because as I recall I threw rocks through all the windows in the house, cars. I cost my parents thousands in repairs that day. I think I kinda deserved it. The other thing I recall was pushing my brother from a tree and breaking his arm. Most of the time they sat me down to talk etc and that worked.

Nobody really knows the real upbringing of this 8 year old child. 1000 smacks seems excessive. If one is having to spank every day they are either 1. a bad parent or 2. there is something wrong with the child and he should have been given help. All the way around it is tragic and no parents shouldn't have guns just lying around which makes me suspect bad parenting.