The problem is people are not providing an alternative to extraterrestrials. Also, some could be extradimensional beings as well.

I don't see any other logical conclusion.

We know that evolution occurs and we are starting to find out that life finds a way.

Again, there's no logical explanation for eyewitness accounts from military, police, high ranking government officials, astronauts and more. Abduction cases, trace evidence, pictures, videos, cave paintings, paintings and ancient manuscripts.

There's no other explanation outside of the eyewitness accounts.

You can either deny the eyewitness accounts and look for a "natural explanation" that fits your belief.

It comes down to reason and logic.

I can look into parallel universes, the holographic principle and quantum loop gravity and come to a conclusion based on reason and logic.

I can also look at eyewitness accounts, abduction cases, pictures, videos and more and do the same thing.

If you look at a list of possibilities, the eyewitness accounts and my own eyes identify what these sightings are and many people just don't accept the explanation and they look for a "natural explanation" that fits their belief.

Leto,

You mention that UFO's have been "clocked" at 20,000MPH since the 40's.

Surely that 20K MPH is a guess-timate it's not like a pilot can get a speed gun out (did they have speed guns in the 40's?).

How can you tell how fast something is travelling if you are far away and maybe travelling at quite a speed in a completly different direction?

Originally posted by oinkment
How can you tell how fast something is travelling if you are far away and maybe travelling at quite a speed in a completly different direction?

We call it RADAR and yes they had RADAR in WWII You simply watch a blip on a screen... that way you know where it is, what direction its coming from and how fast it is going

It was what helped win the war... THEY didn't have RADAR

Originally posted by jritzmann
If it's a manifestation, it has no need of aerodynamics, nor care of "speed", distance, and so on. It simply doesn't matter.

Yup agreed IF it's one of my 'critters' speed and direction changes are irrelevant just like a lightning bolt doesn't care...

But then details is for Part TWO and its only Wed.

Hey I can follow instructions

Lets not forget that early radar was classically plagued by temperature inversion issues giving false readings, and WW2 UFO radar sightings were extremely rare, but not unheard of. I have never personally heard of the speed specifically mentioned by another poster.

But in the end, just as with photographs, radar doesn't tell us what it was, who it was, nor where it came from.

The bottom line here is that even after all the sightings, alleged crashes, contact experiences...does the ETH crowd not get that after all this time (hell even just starting from the modern age of UFOlogy), that there is curiously no physical evidence whatsoever?

I find that very telling as to the phenomenon's nature.

[edit on 12/3/2008 by Badge01]

Originally posted by Dodecahedral
The problem is people are not providing an alternative to extraterrestrials.

That is the purpose of this thread!

Again, there's no logical explanation for eyewitness accounts from military, police, high ranking government officials, astronauts and more. Abduction cases, trace evidence, pictures, videos, cave paintings, paintings and ancient manuscripts.

So, we all agree that these manifestations have occurred since recorded time and have "tailored" its self to fit the mind set of the people of that time. Here are some examples:






While each example is of different times and different countries, there does seem to be and underlying theme or blueprint as far as the "craft go", but it is not a constant and the "craft" vary as much as the occupants.

The Japanese depiction on top occurred in 1803. The "craft" was said to have washed ashore, and the "occupant" was a woman with red hair... she held tightly a golden rectangular shaped box that she would not be parted from... interesting story and I will go into in detail in PART TWO.

The point is, each encounter or "manifestation" seems to be tailored specifically to that time frame and or people. The occupant of this "Japanese UFO" was not a Grey. It was a strange female, but the ship bore strange runes which the Japanese meticulously copied down (we'll discuss those later) which I believe is another clue to this mystery.

The last image in that series comes from a womans encounter in Italy. She was accosted by, what she perceived as strange "little people" as depicted in the artists re-creation.

If you look at a list of possibilities, the eyewitness accounts and my own eyes identify what these sightings are and many people just don't accept the explanation and they look for a "natural explanation" that fits their belief.

That is called rationality. Just because your eyes interpret data to your brain does not make that interpretation valid. In other words that "interpretation" forms beliefs and truths for YOU, specifically. You are important to "your perception of this thing we call life" and the stimulus your brain receives from "life" interprets YOUR reality.

The hand is quicker than the eye...

I think that relates to this phenomenon... there is some kind of slight at hand at work here, some kind of "trickery".. designed to fool our senses.. something that takes place just on the edge of our perception.. in that shady gray area just between consciousness and sub-consciousness. When you you cannot trust your eyes or your senses... you have to rely on rationality.

Unfortunately for us, this mystery seems to defy every rational thought and process, so we must collaborate as a group, a collective consciousness if you will, and rely on the group for checks and balances and use it to our advantage as a filter to better discern the facts.




[edit on 3-12-2008 by Alter-Ego]

Originally posted by Badge01
Any action between two physical entities leaves trace.

Absolutely. So it seems the ETH crowd has some explaining to do. Yet no one seems to see that.

Originally posted by Alter-Ego
I totally agree... It makes me wonder if in fact People like Hynek and Vallee' or other researchers who are not "listed" anywhere or worked for the GOV...actually came to a conclusion or truth, that the population in general could not or WOULD not accept.

I don't think from my standpoint it's a could or would issue. If, these beings have only as much ability to enter our reality as we give them - as based on my previous posts - belief and focus on the UFO enigma may manifest it, etc...then the conclusion would be that if it were officially admitted that these things exist, and not only exist, but manifest based on our "opening the door", and everyone knew this as fact...you're going to tell that to the public if you're a governing body?

Can you see the implications there?

Mind you I don't think the PTB know exactly what this is all about either. I don't think their knowledge is much beyond ours, although they probably have much better data.

Originally posted by jritzmann

Do any of you know, what is reported by "experiencers" as occurring to them in addition to "abductions"? In other words, what else they experience - barring nosebleeds, marks and such. I'm talking about other experiences. Anyone know? Because it's highly telling. I won't be shocked if no one knows, because it's been buried by most mainstream "researchers" for years.

Since no one has responded to this I'll spill it.

The commonality you won't often hear from the mainstream is that other "paranormal" events do often occur in the lives of lifelong experiencers. It can run from ghosts to other more bizarre events.

Interesting no?