Can NASA Really Send A Radio Or TV Signal From The Moon ?

Explain this to me, if the moon rover is remote controlled from the earth and they use a LOS (line of sight) signal of some type. How do they control the rover when the base station on the earth is not facing the Moon ?

[Edited on 4-4-2004 by Lastday Prophet]

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
How do they control the rover when the base station on the earth is not facing the Moon ?[Edited on 4-4-2004 by Lastday Prophet]

UH?

Sorry but this is fairly simple to explain LDP. The Moon rotates around the Earth. Agreed? So some part of the Earth always "sees" the Moon - when it has set on *your* horizon, it has risen on someone elses. Understood? The Moon also has a "captured" rotation so always presents the "same" side (more or less) of it's surface towards the Earth ie it rotates on it's axis in the same time as it does to revolve around the Earth.

Now NASA "rented" space on various radio telescopes around the world, such as Jodrell Bank in the UK, so that an object on the Moon could *always* be seen or, rather, communicated with by radio.

OK LDP?

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
Explain this to me, if the moon rover is remote controlled from the earth and they use a LOS (line of sight) signal of some type. How do they control the rover when the base station on the earth is not facing the Moon ?

[Edited on 4-4-2004 by Lastday Prophet]

Relayed signals from Satellites.

Lastday Prophet,

Voyager 1 Now Most Distant Human-Made Object in Space, Voyager 1, launched more than two decades ago, will cruise beyond the Pioneer 10 spacecraft and become the most distant human-created object in space, at 6.5 billion miles (10.4 billion kilometers) from Earth.

We are still receiving signals and scientific data from this satellite. The dish on the satellite hasn�t grown according to its distance from the Earth. It has remained the same size and yet still works. If your theory was correct the satellite would no longer be able to get its message to earth because of its increased distance from Earth.

"UH" wrong Genya, the earth does not always face the moon, that is why you have day and night. The satellites rotate with the earth and thus is why the need to transmit the signals via satellite. My point from the beginning has been that you cannot transmit satellite signals from the moon without a uplink on the moon, also the moon and the earth are not in the same orbit so therefore you cannot receive the same signals for the satellites are in a totally different orbit, which does not allow the reception or sending of any signal from the moon, they cannot receive the same signal because you can not align the uplink or downlink. Again, the satellites rotate with the earth , not the moon so you cannot align the uplink or downlink with the dish.

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet Prove me wrong,

We have. You ignored it. A very vexing situation. Your "technician" creditials pal in comparison to the experienced people of higher education on this site.

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
"UH" wrong Genya, the earth does not always face the moon, that is why you have day and night....

I stand corrected my friend - of course, I see now that you are right and I have been misinformed.

Thank you so much for imparting your knowledge LDP.


ps. Just a thought: isn't "day and night" determined by the Earth's daily rotation, and it's rotation around the Sun?? I didn't know the Moon was part of this

Please enlighten me more Sir.

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet "UH" wrong Genya, the earth does not always face the moon,

You need some very basic education before you continue this. Satellite communications have rarely been used to communicate with moon-centric explorations. 99% of the time, the communications has been through direct line-of-sight to the moon and or space capsule involved. A very basic review of the Apollo missions will reveal this exceptionally simple attribute of history.

Originally posted by Genya
ps. Just a thought: isn't "day and night" determined by the Earth's daily rotation, and it's rotation around the Sun?? I didn't know the Moon was part of this

Please enlighten me more Sir.

Genya just owned. And apparently paid attention in middle school science class, too.

Hasn't this whole mess of misinformation been "proved wrong" by now?

-B.

Originally posted by kinglizard

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
I challenge anyone in the WORLD to prove they can send a Television signal from Russia to the United States without the use of satellites or land lines, simply sending a signal through the air.

The Earth is round therefore sending a signal from Russia to the United States would be impossible. Don�t you need line of sight to receive a signal? I thought that was the point of having satellites so that they could receive a signal from earth send it down the line of satellites to the other side of the planet. But If you were on the moon sending a signal you would have line of sight on half the planet.

Lastday, you are right. It is impossible to send a signal from the US to Russia. The only way to do that would to have some some massive repeters sitting in the middle of the ocean or to use satellites. KingLizard has explained the reason quite well above. But I must say that you are wrong about almost everything else. The basic fundementals of Radio Transmitting have been explained over and over again. Exapmles have been given about EME (Moonbounce) transmitting. I used to sit at a friends house when I was a kid and watch his father do some of the most amazing things like talking to people in India just on his amature radio including moonbouncing and he would explain it to me. I have no expierance in any type of amature radio but I belive that many people here do. I think that you have some information crossed somewhere. So if you do have all of the credentials you say you have, then maybe it's time to study some more recent books on the subject or take what everyone here is telling you and do a little reasearch. Just out of curosity, who are your credentals by. It it an accredited instution? Just out of curosity.

[Edited on 4-4-2004 by muzz]

I am done with this, you can remove the post if you like. I am the expert here concerning satellite. I have posted information that anyone having an in depth understanding of satellite would be able to verify. Talking about misinformation, many of the responses to my post have been just that. What don't you guys understand ? First point, if you say the signals are sent LOS (line of sight) this theory holds no water, for the transmitter on the earth will not always face the moon and therefore cannot transmit a constant signal, this is why these signals are relayed via satellite. Second, Satellites do not have a range of 250,000 miles so this rules out the use of satellites. Third, the satellites that orbit around the earth are not in the same orbit as the that of the moon which means you cannot transmit to or from the moon, there is no way to relay the signal to the moon for the satellites rotate with the earth not the moon and there is no way to align the two. Forth, satellite signals are sent down to the earth from the satellites, not up to the moon. " Oh Ye Faithless Generation, How long must I suffer thee"

-sigh- A movie was made about the need to switch antennas during the Apollo missions to maintain communications. Your information is flawed. Your method is counter-productive. Your approach embraces ignorance and refutes knowledge. goodbye

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
Your information is flawed.
Your method is counter-productive.
Your approach embraces ignorance and refutes knowledge.

goodbye

All of what you said is true Skeptic, and I understand the frustration you must be feeling - but you cannot believe the amusement this thread has brought me...

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
Forth, satellite signals are sent down to the earth from the satellites, not up to the moon.

Your theory is flawed. If what you say is true than sending signals around the earth via satellites wouldn�t work. To send a signal around the earth you send the information to a satellite that�s in line of sight, that satellite relays that signal to another satellite that is in line of sight and closer to the final destination, and so on until the last satellite is in line of sight of the receiver on earth in the area you want to transmit. Satellites don�t always just send their signal back to earth. It depends on the direction the satellite wants to send the signal. If you pointed the relayed signal from a satellite into deep space the signal would go into deep space.

You still have failed to answer my question. Where did you go to school for all this advanced training in this? And was it accredited? Surely if you are trained in all of this work then you can answer these two questions. I am still having problem beliving that you are the leading expert in sattelites. I don't know any of the terms that you are using so put it layman's terms. Until you can prove that you are really qualified in the subject, then most everybody here including myself is going to have a hard time beliving that you know what you are talking about.

Like I said, I am a satellite television pioneer. When I started in satellite their were no schools, it was on the job training. Here are some facts that can be verified, they aren't in any book and only those that were in satellite technology from the beginning would know these facts. The first and most used polarotor was made by a company called chaparral, it was called the 1E. then came the dual C-Band feedhorn, then the C/Ku dual band feed. Then it was the C/Ku dual band with a dielectric insert that allowed for circular polarization which allowed reception of international signals if you happened to have a 30 foot scientific atlanta antenna. The First dishs used for homes were ECI 12 footers, which along with a 120 degree kelvin California Amp LNA (low noise amplifier as opposed to LNB Low noise blockdownconverter that are used nowadays), connected to a drake downconverter allowed home users to recieve free satellite television for the first time. Then came scientific atlanta, the Jeniel Darkstar, then came winegard, paraclipse, orbitron, kaultronics(now known as KTI), channel master and finally the 18 in. dishs. there is no one that can refute the above info, all it takes is a little research and you will find that all is accurate. Their are not many of the early pioneers still around, I am one of what was a very elite group. There is your info, I challenge anyone to find that it is not accurate in any sense. I am what I said I am and can back it up with info you will not find in books,(but can be verified) proof that only those that were pioneers from the beginning would know.

Originally posted by Lastday Prophet
Like I said, I am a satellite television pioneer. When I started in satellite their were no schools, it was on the job training.

Dude.
You tried to tell us that "the earth does not always face the moon" is the reason for night and day. I learned about the earth's rotation around the sun when I was 7 or 8.
I can't speak for anyone else here, but I don't believe a word you say.

-B.

GOD I LOVE THIS THREAD


Before yall chase this kid off I really, really, really, want to hear him explain this......."

UH" wrong Genya, the earth does not always face the moon, that is why you have day and night. "

I would have swore it had something to do with the sun

I think he was talking about the rotation of the earth and moon. If you had a dish on the surface of the moon it wouldn't have line of sight with the earth all of the time. Im not sure of my interpretation of the things he wrote because it's not very clear, but that's my take. I wish he would respond to the questions and statements of the members, and not concentrate so much on his professional career. All he seems to say is that we should blindly believe him because of his background.

[Edited on 4-4-2004 by kinglizard]

Originally posted by kinglizard
I think he was talking about the rotation of the earth and moon.

If you had a dish on the surface of the moon it wouldn't have line of sight with the earth all of the time. Im not sure of my interpretation of the things he wrote because it's not very clear, but that's my take. I wish he would respond to the questions and statements of the members, and not concentrate so much on his professional career.

But if the dish was on the "Earth" side you would ALWAYS have a line of sight with some part of earth.