Obama: 'Millions of jobs' in danger next year, page 3

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reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 05:19 AM by Nineteen

Stimulus plans are good as at least the money paid to workers gets spent and therefore flushes back out into the general economy unlike the recent massive bailouts of banks who have broken their promises and continue to hoard the billions or spend it buying failed banks. When will their greed stop.

On the other point in regard to deflation, I do not believe that will last as the dollar will collapse in the near future as the country is hugely debt laden and the dollar is not backed by gold or anything with intrinsic value. Its' reserve status is almost over. NWO would no doubt prefer a single currency at a later date, but I suspect we will have a basket of currencies to begin the process or maybe a system which uses gold itself as the reserve currency. The latter would be fairer to other countries as it would not be tied to an individual nation.

When the dollar does collapse imported goods will become very, very expensive and then people will see the value of economies which aim for self sufficiency which is what used to exist. Interdependence between different countries based on goods may be good for those who wish to control and own this planet, but it has very poor outcomes for the ordinary people and the environment. These multinational corporations are a blight to mankind, not a boon as they would paint.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 05:33 AM by Simon_Boudreaux

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
That's why gas is low. Because people aren't buying it.

I don't know where you live BH, but, where I live people are buying the hell out of it.The gas stations in my town are always busy. Of course there are only four of them but they are all busy. I don't go to town anymore unless I just have to. When gas was high I was in and out of everywhere I went. Now that gas is low people are out like mad.

People here are still spending like normal. Wal-mart is still thriving with tons of cars in the lot when I pass it( I don't shop there). My business depends on people's ability to spend money and I've seen no slow down.

Either our poor town is doing good or I'm just not seeing a spending slow down.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 08:48 AM by eldard

I don't understand the "deflation" explanation. The Feds flooded the system with over a trillion dollars, perhaps more. Is it the same like having my fridge stuffed and go hungry? Never happened to me.

reply to post by stander

Think of it this way: Prices are falling because no one's buying. No one's buying = less income for companies = less jobs = more falling prices = ...

you get the drift.

Bottomline, prepare to live and have incomes like third worlders.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:02 AM by marg6043

reply to post by stander

Slander I think that you are getting a great inside of what is going on with the Economy here in ATS.

To tell you the truth Obama "can" set up the wheels to an improvement on the economy, but that would not happen in his presidential times but long after, remember it took a long time for the economy slowly but surely downfall to this point but one thing is for sure, thanks to our government been run by corporate America we are in the situation that we are now.

Obama will try to fix the economy but, he can face a big wall when it comes to the true powers behind his presidency.

Bush suck up to this powers because he belong to a long line of people like them, Obama is just the new kid in the block and to tell you the truth he doesn't belong in their circle but he will be manipulated to follow what other presidents has followed before him.

We are in a recession (read how the great depression happened in the 1930s) that will give you an idea of how even with the bankers taking over the economy still another depression can not be stop as we are having the same symptoms that pushed the last in place.

2 trillion dollars of tax payer money that actually is to pay for interest on the money we have to borrow abroad from other countries that are buying America one piece at the time is not what we had back during the first great depression.

We pulled out because America became a world leader of industrial production, plus we got wars to keep the minds and harts from the economical problem.

Now we are nothing but consumers living beyond means on credit, now the living is been taking away with lost of jobs and the credit is frozen, so what is left of consumers to buy is plenty, but we are losing the means to afford it even when prices are going down in order for retailers to survive, that means more lost of jobs and more businesses going on bankruptcy.

When you see people in stores with plenty of goods to buy but no money to afford it, we will be in full blown depression.

[edit on 23-11-2008 by marg6043]

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:09 AM by marg6043

reply to post by Simon_Boudreaux

What she means is that demand abroad (including other countries has slow down) countries stop buying as much oil so the markets were flooded with oil but the demand was no there.

Now that prices are down the markets are flooded with and increase in buying power that is why people are buying "like crazy".

So what the ones losing here are to do to stop the leaching of their profits?.

They are going to slow production and create a shortage, speculators will come in and start the game of predicting how much oil will be needed to supply the world with with less production, so OPEC and other big oil countries will reduce production.

They already did last month and they are to do it again next week (watch the news on the issue), it takes a while for the rest of the world to catch up on the reduction of oil and the increase of prices.

So the speculators are looking at a hike of gas prices right when the winter is as its peak in the US.

Enjoy lower prices until it last.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:15 AM by REXIMUS

reply to post by ZindoDoone

Outstanding! I wonder if they even thought of this. Four billion is not that much to ask for when you consider how much they just hashed out to the corrupt CEOs of all those banks. NICE...

[edit on 11/23/2008 by REXIMUS]

[edit on 11/23/2008 by REXIMUS]

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:24 AM by jsobecky

reply to post by stander

Deflation is defined as "a decline in general price levels".

The question you are asking, I think, is why are we experiencing deflation.

Deflation can be cause by several things:

Gov't and/or people decide to stop buying things because of belt-tightening measures

Businesses/people decide to stop buying because there is no money

Then supply and demand kick in: less demand leads to more supply, which leads to lower prices.

If lower prices do not spur more buying/spending, employers start laying off workers.

Unemployed workers do not have the money to spend on the now cheaper products.

The spiral begins...

This is the jam that auto makers and others find themselves in.

Now, the current situation is that there is less money in the system.

The bailouts were supposed to correct this problem, by giving the banks more money to lend to their customers.

The banks got the money, but didn't "spread the wealth". They used it to fund their own operations, meet their payrolls, etc.

This is my understanding, in a nutshell.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:29 AM by marg6043

reply to post by jsobecky

And Js you got it right,

I hope slander understand the game of economics all we can do is open the door with our simple explanations for him to put one and one together.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:47 AM by Benevolent Heretic

Thank you, marg.

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux
I don't know where you live BH, but, where I live people are buying the hell out of it. ... I don't go to town anymore unless I just have to.

You don't go to town anymore unless you just HAVE to, but you're still buying the same amount of gas? What are you doing with it???

Just teasing you. But the fact is, many people ARE still being miserly about gas. Not traveling so much. Holiday travel is down this year. MANY prices and consumption are down this year. This is the problem of confidence. People are saving their money for rough times ahead. Which ARE coming!

Holiday Travel Another Casualty of Economy

jsobecky, just because you and I are still buying gas and living normally, MANY other Americans are not. Many are losing their jobs and homes. A lot more are holding on to their money because of fears of future economic troubles.

Originally posted by stander
Retail prices are the same except for gas prices that took a tumble.

You clearly haven't been keeping up on the economy. Read projectvxn's posts.

Or just try to make this economic recession all Obama's fault, even though we've been talking about it here on ATS since before he was even running for president.

Oh, and don't pay too much attention to the pictures in the article. That was taken the day before and really doesn't have anything to do with the story. It's not like he was saying the words while they were taking that picture...

Car Dealer Offer - Buy one, get one for $1

Economy Drives Electronics Prices Down

Sale prices on consumer electronics gear should be 35 percent or more under 2007 levels, according to industry projections.
...
Now there are plenty of big screens in the pipeline, and potentially not enough buyers.

Tough Economy Takes Toll on Home Depot

Short of giving products away, retailers are finding it hard to get consumers into their stores.

WalMart is doing great, though. The have cheap stuff. Made in China.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:47 AM by jsobecky

Another point is stimulus packages. Everybody likes to get a free check.

An example of a "good" stimulus package is Alaska. They are flush with cash because of revenues from the oilcos that drill there.

They have the extra money to spend, and give back to their citizens.

The Federal Gov't, on the other hand, does not have extra cash. We owe everyone.

But expect the gov't to cut you another check next spring. And while nobody will turn it down, just realize that it won't solve anything.

It's like pouring a shot of gas into the carburetor of an engine that is out of gas. The engine will sputter, and maybe run for a few seconds, but will ultimately stall out again.

Obama has a plan to create new jobs by spending money to rebuild bridges and roads.

But he has no money to pay the workers; he will need to print more fake money.

Wealth is not created. It is produced.

That's why it is so ironic that Obama is dead-set against the things that would produce wealth for us. I'm talking about investing in energy.

Open up offshore drilling, ANWR, and in the Rockies. Let the oilcos build new refineries. Invest in clean coal research and technology. Allow nuclear plants to be built.

These measures will all produce wealth and create immediate jobs. And the added benefit is that we can sell excess energy to the rest of the world, making a profit.

But Obama strongly objects to any of this. He promised to bankrupt the coal industry.

And he will slap a "carbon tax" on every one of us.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:50 AM by -zeropoint-

Originally posted by stander

Obama seems to be concerned about "falling prices." How did the President-elect figure that prices are spiralling down?

Just look at the photo to the right of the article. Here he is: Mr Obama went shopping and became horrified by the food prices that, after taking off with the price of gas last year, are too low for our leader designated.

Surely, Mr Obama means well. It's all just a case of junk Internet juornalism to link him with falling prices and add a photo of him buying a sausage.

But>>>>> What if Mr Obama had on his mind the falling prices of oil?

Aaah, not a good start, Barack.

Can anyone figure out what he meant by that "spiral of falling prices" and how bad this is for the American consumer?

www.msnbc.msn.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

What do you mean not a good start? Who said it would be easy, five terms can't immediately clean-up Bush's mess, how do you expect the yet-inaugurated President-Elect to do it "now"? Pleeeeaase. He's being honest about the issue and giving realistic expectations, but/so don't try to make him the fault of it all, are you serious? I imagine alot of necons will try to pull this off in the future.

[edit on 23-11-2008 by -zeropoint-]

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 09:56 AM by RFBurns

Price of gal of gas here....1.43.

Price of gal of milk here....1.89.

Price of loaf of bread here.....$.78

Price of lb of beef here.....1.95

I dont know about the rest of you but these falling prices are GOOD, meaning that people can now AFFORD more, which means they can BUY more, which means MORE money into the economy, which means MORE jobs will be created, MORE money going around.

I think your parts of the nation need to..."catch up" with the times. Or you need to find out why your being priced-gouged.

Cheers!!!!

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 10:03 AM by kozmo

Of course millions of jobs will be at risk next year... we just elected a Marxist into the White House!

Sure, we're gonna see change all right... either in the form of pocket change (as that's all you'll make) or a shift of the Republic into Socialism. Either way, I'm wondering how long it will take the obamabots to realize what a horrible mistake they made?

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 01:01 PM by kettlebellysmith

What we are going to see is a Neo-Roosevelt New Deal. He hasn't called it that yet, but what he described is what was done in the '30's with the alphabet soup agencies he came up with. I went to school in a WPA built school.
We've all gripped about the infrastructure, the roads and bridges. What about a Manhattan Project to work toward energy independence? There are a tremendous number of possiblities. I didn't vote for him, and the more I read his first book, the more convinced I am that he is as much a racisit as any red-neck clan member, but I'm willing to give him a chance. If he don't follow through with what he's supposed to do, we can always vote him out!

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 04:03 PM by Psyclon9

reply to post by kettlebellysmith

Are you sure we will be able to vote him out? whos to say that he just wont dig the damn hole so deep by 2012 there will be no way in hell of getting out this century? I truely will be amazed if we are still here in 4 years and not just another 3rd world country. Obama promised change and damnit we will se change even if it kills every last one of us. I hope his supporters are pleased with themselves.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 04:17 PM by kettlebellysmith

reply to post by Psyclon9

I have faith in the True American People, not the sheeple that blindly do what they are told. If it comes to that, I am sure we will be following the advice in your sig.
My biggest fear is the damage that can be done in the first two years. I figure in the next round of elections, a lot of the dems will be voted out, and we'll have some checks and balances. I just hope congress will get off their A$$ and do something.
Nancy Pelosi came in, promising all this change, and what have they accomplished, except to have a lower approval rating than Bush?
We need to light a fire under their butts, friends and neighbors, a big fire, and tell them "when you get to work, we'll show you where the water is."

[edit on 23-11-2008 by kettlebellysmith]

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 04:23 PM by projectvxn

Originally posted by RFBurns
Price of gal of gas here....1.43.

Price of gal of milk here....1.89.

Price of loaf of bread here.....$.78

Price of lb of beef here.....1.95

I dont know about the rest of you but these falling prices are GOOD, meaning that people can now AFFORD more, which means they can BUY more, which means MORE money into the economy, which means MORE jobs will be created, MORE money going around.

I think your parts of the nation need to..."catch up" with the times. Or you need to find out why your being priced-gouged.

Cheers!!!!

This is incorrect and has been covered in this thread extensively. It's called deflation. And the problem isn't in the obvious so much as in the obscured filing cabinets of corporations all over America....It's called the business model. Which is all about cutting costs.

Low Demand = Prices lower they make LESS MONEY, they have to cut costs, the lay off a few people, and because of that demand gets lower as people begin to pinch their pennies until they find another job, price drops because of this even further, company has to cut costs again to stay out of the red, more jobs are lost, less demand, further devalued products more cost cutting, more job loss, and then bankruptcy due to having lost money on devalued products, business starts to close down...Demand goes down more rippling in other sectors...It's a vicious cycle..

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 04:45 PM by projectvxn

reply to post by jsobecky

I agree. The first round of stimulus checks did nothing to stimulate the economy...It all went to China. This round of stimulous checks will be so people can bulk up on food before the economy totally tanks...If you people have any sense of self preservation I would recommend you buy food and blankets, and all the stuff you'll need to make it as a homeless person.

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 05:19 PM by stander

reply to post by jsobecky

That's what you expect to find in any primer on economy. But since economy is supported by financial system, not all expectancy is met, because the financial system of these days doesn't work as expected.

Just read my last post to see what the real issue was. In a nutshell, the article didn't explained what type of prices Obama meant. The photo that accompanies the article shows Obama inside a retail store. Does this picture clues what Obama meant? If so, then Obama was lying, because retail prices always rise on a yearly basis -- slower, faster but they do. For example, the Consumer Price Index rose 3.7 % in October 2008 when compared with October 2007, but decreased by 1% as compared to September.
www.bls.gov...

Now compare the price of oil the same way, and you know what Obama meant when he mentioned the ominous "falling prices." Now remember that the CPI in October was affected by the price of gas going down like never before. The price of gas going down so fast wasn't caused by consumer demand; it was dictated by the price of oil. As a speculator in futures you can't buy and sell higher later when economy doesn't move forward in a desirable and unrealistic pace. The hotshot speculators left and the price of oil plummeted.

Obama is now fearmongering to get things going, so his rich Exxon friends who paid for his ride to the White House got their $4.50 per gallon back as soon as possible.

[edit on 11/23/2008 by stander]

reply posted on 23-11-2008 @ 05:37 PM by marg6043

reply to post by stander

I don't think that Obama is going to be more generous that the leaving oil man we got in the white house right now.

Research how much oil was before Bush and how high it went during his administration.

In 2000 oil prices were just above 20 dollars a barrel by 2007 it was over 100 dollars.

Now what does that means? you figure that one.

Bush Administration Drives Oil Prices

dividendmoney.com...

Oil and the Bush Administration
by Mark J. Palmer
Earth Island Journal, Autumn 2002

www.thirdworldtraveler.com...

You know what all this tells right? that we have a nation that is run by a corporate ridden government catering to whatever the biggest donor base is buying them out at the moment

[edit on 23-11-2008 by marg6043]

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