Indian boy thrown under train for writing love letter

Indian boy thrown under train for writing love letter

uk.news.yahoo.com

Fifteen-year-old Manish Kumar was kidnapped by members of the rival caste on his way to school, had his head shaved and was thrown under a train as his mother begged for mercy, police in the impoverished eastern state of Bihar said.

(visit the link for the full news article)

More backwards behavior from a seemingly backwards society. How can a group of people, no matter the culture, not be morally objected to something this disturbing? Sometimes I think that these cultures are so set in their horrible practices that no matter how much "democracy" we try to spread it will never suffice to change a region so dependent on hatred.

I feel bad for the children growing up, not understanding exactly why things are, but having to accept them because their parents except it, even if they know in their hearts how wrong it is.

Any group of people who would do this deserve to be thrown under a train themselves. As a believe in the law of karma, I really hope it comes back to these disgusting creatures.

uk.news.yahoo.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Originally posted by deadline527
More backwards behavior from a seemingly backwards society. How can a group of people, no matter the culture, not be morally objected to something this disturbing? Sometimes I think that these cultures are so set in their horrible practices that no matter how much "democracy" we try to spread it will never suffice to change a region so dependent on hatred.

What fairy tale planet did you say you were from? The same acts occur all over Planet Weasel. There is no such beast as a "righteous democracy"...... ANYWHERE. I live in the USA. Here you may not be "thrown under a train"..... but you will be destroyed one way or another for crossing a societal caste line. You are so wrong to point at India as being somehow "different" than any nation on this planet. Maybe the Indian society is more honest than other nations/societies. The "bad people" are not over there...... they are right behind you................... BOO!

reply to post by KOGDOG


A little wound up aren't we?



The OP isn't wrong for pointing anything out. These practices "are" different than most places in the world. Just as all countries are different, they practice different things.

You attacking the OP for his opinions is no more out of line than what you consider to be his out of line comments.

Take it easy.

Ya here in Canada, we stone our women to death, Here in Canada we cut off limbs of thieves feeding themselves,
We kill the rape victims
we have mutliple wives and never expect one wife to look at another man or we'll shoot her in her back


They are ass backwards and Canada is at least way more civilized then India and China, and many middle eastern civlizations.

reply to post by GodshipForAll


could you explain to me
what you have just posted has anything to do with this topic?

i am kind of confused.

Originally posted by nyk537
reply to post by KOGDOG

 

CUT...
The OP isn't wrong for pointing anything out. These practices "are" different than most places in the world. Just as all countries are different, they practice different things.
You attacking the OP for his opinions is no more out of line than what you consider to be his out of line comments.
Take it easy.

Casting stones at another nation/society/etc. is what leads to wars and all the other fun times that we humans direct at those whom we consider to be less righteous than "us". This is a serious offense to both the people of India and those who currently live with this outrage in the so-called more "righteous/enlightened/democratic" nations. I did not take offense at the OP's article. I will and did voice my firm opinion that all nations and people are equally ignorant/sinful and that no one has the right to characterize one nation better or worse than another. Or... are you currently enjoying your "righteous" war against the people of the Mideast?

So hate-motivated mob killings are a little bit harder to find in the US than they are in the Middle East or India. Not to worry! There are thousands of other kinds of evil to choose from, and the US has most of them in abundance.

The relative colors of pots and kettles is not the point. The point is not that America is really awesome because something bad happened somewhere else but not here. And the point is not that somewhere else isn't so bad because America sucks too.

The point is that really evil disgusting stuff that needs to be stopped is happening, period. Not "is happening IN ______". Who cares where its happening. It shouldn't be happening anywhere.

So why is this story really in the news? To make Americans and Canadians feel better about themselves, or to inform people about a problem?

No more racism on ATS, please. Racism is ignorance, therefore it does not belong here.

Originally posted by KOGDOG

Casting stones at another nation/society/etc. is what leads to wars and all the other fun times that we humans direct at those whom we consider to be less righteous than "us". This is a serious offense to both the people of India and those who currently live with this outrage in the so-called more "righteous/enlightened/democratic" nations. I did not take offense at the OP's article. I will and did voice my firm opinion that all nations and people are equally ignorant/sinful and that no one has the right to characterize one nation better or worse than another. Or... are you currently enjoying your "righteous" war against the people of the Mideast?

Rediulous and ludicrous ... People just shoot people here in the U.S. and mot of the times that is because of bad drug deals .. Or you looked at my girl wrong... If you are smart most of the time here in the U.S. you can avoid these problems just because people don't liek to deal with certain situations .. Such as your mother there begging for your life. NOTHING HAS HAPPEND WITH SUCH VICIOUSNESS here in the U.S.

You need to quit knowing every thing .. Of course there is a few people here on ATS not to Learn or to put in thier OPINION. There are those here that are here for a few things and none of them lead to anything POSITIVE.

Back to LIFE IN OUTER SPACE NOW... HAHAHAH ... Not trying to be funny .. But yeah . Glaciers on Mars . Watch out ...

Originally posted by Deus_Brandon NOTHING HAS HAPPEND WITH SUCH VICIOUSNESS here in the U.S.

Suggest you look up gang shootings...

Here in the US we KNOW who the gang members are but do we round them up? No we let them 'play' on the streets and have gang wars where they will drive by the other gangs house and shoot at random, more often than not killing innocent bystanders.

I don't see that any different than a caste war... lets leave the race out of it and go for the cause

reply to post by deadline527


damn.. you sound like an enlightened being from another world!!
You know.. the kinds that have abolished all forms of known defects in social behavior and society.

This is planet Earth. Open your eyes to few things:

1)Things like this (and much much worse) happen every single day.
2)Institutions are in place to prevent the same and it is not a quick fix. It takes time.. years.. decades even.
3)Ironically, Democracy as a form of government may NOT be better suited to rooting out such practices that may be prevalent in the majority of masses in various regions. In either case, form of government here is quite irrelevant.
4)Read up a little more about countries you pass generic judgment on. If a culture is to be defined by the nature of the crimes it commits, then look homeward before you point fingers elsewhere..

Having said that, this is most disturbing, and in a country like India where capital punishment is allowed by law, the perpetrators should suffer the same fate they forced on this boy. Life sentence at least.

btw.. to all of you who suffer from a fallacious westernized/cultural superiority complex.. travel a little.. understand your species better.. stop living in freakin' glass houses

Thank you KOGDOG for your comments. Thank you OP for your bulletin.. just wish you had conveyed the same a little more humanely..

reply to post by GodshipForAll


god help you sir.. I honestly believe that you need help..

First, just wanted to say I respect even opinions that differ from my own, and that is the whole reason for ATS.

As for my stance on this issue, I know America isnt the most polite, civilized, peace-knit country.. but we hardly commit such atrocious acts such as this. When we do, yes, it gets put in the news, and I would have said the exact same thing about anyone who feels the need to kill an innocent child for a difference in ideals that the parents believe in.

The problem to me is that it happens much too often in certain countries. Not only does it happen, but a whole crowd of people participates in such shameful acts. If something like this was to happen in this USA, I am quite positive it would be an isolated act with a single perpetrator, not half the town parading a child down the street with the intention of killing him.

Why does the world look the other way at these crimes? As someone said in an earlier post, they tried to relate it to gang violence and the fact that we look the other way on that. The difference to me is that with gang violence, yes it happens, yes we know where they are, but we do not know for sure which gang members were associated with particular crimes. In instances such as this in India, they know exactly who participated. Every member of that mob should be tried the same as the person who laid the last hand on that child.

Also, not one participant spoke out for the child. Why? because they would face the same fate, if not worse, for supporting a rival caste. The atmosphere of fear created due to such atrocious crimes is evident when even the own populace is afraid of what may become if you anger people with such a mindset.

How do we change such actions that have been part of a culture for thousands of years?

I totally support punishment, but this boy was innocent. He committed no crime, but only crossed cultural bounds which brought "shame" to his family. This is something that needs to be addressed, and to me is akin to racism in the USA. When one group of people thinks they are better then another, and persecutes them for coexisting with them, is no better then the lynchings of african americans decades ago.

This type of behavior needs to be abolished. They need to learn how to accept differences, overcome their hatred, and realize that by creating such an atmosphere of violence, fear, and extremism - they are only conditioning their children to be raised the same way.

Anyway, that's a small bit of how I feel about the situation.

reply to post by GodshipForAll


You DO Know HOW MANY Indo-Canadian women have been set on fire/dismembered/drowned by there husbands or fathers in the last 5yrs alone right?...

Originally posted by deadline527
First, just wanted to say I respect even opinions that differ from my own, and that is the whole reason for ATS.

Appreciated.

As for my stance on this issue, I know America isnt the most polite, civilized, peace-knit country.. but we hardly commit such atrocious acts such as this. When we do, yes, it gets put in the news, and I would have said the exact same thing about anyone who feels the need to kill an innocent child for a difference in ideals that the parents believe in.

And it doesn't get put in the news in India?
www.expressindia.com...
ibnlive.in.com...
also note that the article you linked would have taken the info of one of these local sources.

And yes, this does enrage the vast majority of people in India; in case there were doubts around public opinion on this.

The problem to me is that it happens much too often in certain countries. Not only does it happen, but a whole crowd of people participates in such shameful acts. If something like this was to happen in this USA, I am quite positive it would be an isolated act with a single perpetrator, not half the town parading a child down the street with the intention of killing him.

It does in certain rural parts of northern India, as the article states. Yes those parts are quite backward and most Indians (not from there) thus prefer to stay out. Again this is the vast majority. When a community itself does not oppose (and thus condones?) such acts, it is extremely difficult and time consuming job to educate and gradually eradicate such customs. Sati, the burning of a wife on the pyre with her deceased husband, was a Indian custom that has taken decades to be eradicated.

Why does the world look the other way at these crimes? As someone said in an earlier post, they tried to relate it to gang violence and the fact that we look the other way on that. The difference to me is that with gang violence, yes it happens, yes we know where they are, but we do not know for sure which gang members were associated with particular crimes. In instances such as this in India, they know exactly who participated. Every member of that mob should be tried the same as the person who laid the last hand on that child.

Yea, well if no one is willing to testify then there is a problem right? And you cannot put the entire village behind bars. Yes, awarding capital punishment to the guy who through him in, and life sentences to those who accompanied the key accused would be fair and would set a strong example.
And what difference will some country on the other side of the globe make here? Put more pressure on India to prevent this from happening?
Sure.. but is India doing enough already? Who knows?

Also, not one participant spoke out for the child. Why? because they would face the same fate, if not worse, for supporting a rival caste. The atmosphere of fear created due to such atrocious crimes is evident when even the own populace is afraid of what may become if you anger people with such a mindset.

How do we change such actions that have been part of a culture for thousands of years?

Now you understand the Indian government's complex dilemma.

I totally support punishment, but this boy was innocent. He committed no crime, but only crossed cultural bounds which brought "shame" to his family. This is something that needs to be addressed, and to me is akin to racism in the USA. When one group of people thinks they are better then another, and persecutes them for coexisting with them, is no better then the lynchings of african americans decades ago.

Agreed. No doubt this is horrendously wrong. Who is debating that? There should no no punishment infact. The Indian constitution is completely secular and caste-free. If the law of the land allows it, then anyone enforcing their own laws over those laid out by the judiciary should be held accountable.

This type of behavior needs to be abolished. They need to learn how to accept differences, overcome their hatred, and realize that by creating such an atmosphere of violence, fear, and extremism - they are only conditioning their children to be raised the same way.

So how do you propose one deals with this? And how do you know that this is not already happening?

Originally posted by KOGDOG
I will and did voice my firm opinion that all nations and people are equally ignorant/sinful and that no one has the right to characterize one nation better or worse than another.

Couldn't agree more. So many people are conditioned to believe that their country is the best, or they are the "good guys".

This is not a "backwards nation". Anyone who thinks so should look as their own country and genuinely ask themselves if they believe it is going "forwards".

Head shaved and thrown under a train in one country, beaten, gang raped and killed in another...

reply to post by NuclearPaul

Perhaps we need to expand our definition of a "caste system". The USA enforces a vicious and totalitarian "caste systems" upon this entire planet. If any "3rd world nation" attempts to move out of their position in the US dominated "planetary caste system" we will "throw under a train" your moms, pops, Grandmas, Grandpas, the kids, cats & dogs your culture along with everything your "lower caste" nation ever had or hoped to obtain. No nuclear power plants for you! No WMDs for you! YOU WILL DO AS THE USA TELLS YOU TO DO! I hear the train a comin' It's rollin' 'round the bend.... CHOO! CHOO! CHOO! You hear that all you third world lower caste nations????? Yeah....... you know that sound. How do you like your position in the USA's planetary caste system?

Might be a good time to tell OP just what you think of the USA's planetary caste system if you live in fear of being "thrown under the US of A's train".

Hmmm... I'm all for a country moving out of the darkness and forging ahead with nuclear power plants. But are you really such an apologist that you'd grant them the right to have WMD's as well? Sorry for how things are. I didn't make the rules. But no way in hell do I want to sit back and allow another country with WMD's or to develop them. It's bad enough that too many other countries have them. The US included.

Originally posted by KOGDOG
reply to post by NuclearPaul

 

Perhaps we need to expand our definition of a "caste system". The USA enforces a vicious and totalitarian "caste systems" upon this entire planet. If any "3rd world nation" attempts to move out of their position in the US dominated "planetary caste system" we will "throw under a train" your moms, pops, Grandmas, Grandpas, the kids, cats & dogs your culture along with everything your "lower caste" nation ever had or hoped to obtain. No nuclear power plants for you! No WMDs for you! YOU WILL DO AS THE USA TELLS YOU TO DO! I hear the train a comin' It's rollin' 'round the bend.... CHOO! CHOO! CHOO! You hear that all you third world lower caste nations????? Yeah....... you know that sound. How do you like your position in the USA's planetary caste system?

Might be a good time to tell OP just what you think of the USA's planetary caste system if you live in fear of being "thrown under the US of A's train".

reply to post by sabrinaleena

Hmmm... I'm all for a country moving out of the darkness and forging ahead with nuclear power plants. But are you really such an apologist that you'd grant them the right to have WMD's as well? Sorry for how things are. I didn't make the rules. But no way in hell do I want to sit back and allow another country with WMD's or to develop them. It's bad enough that too many other countries have them. The US included.

Nations currently living at the lower echelons of the "planetary caste system" that do not have the means to defend themselves from the outta' control homicidal upper caste team USA loco-motive will always be thrown under the "train" until they can fight back. What you have expressed is a fear that lower caste nations will be able to do onto you as you have done onto them. Pay back is a bitch. Imperialism and colonialism eventually reaps the whirlwind. Dems' da' rules...

Preemptive wars are the desperate acts of bullies who have read the writing on the wall...