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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:25 PM by ZindoDoone
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
McCain was a completly differant judgement. His father being a navel officer, there was already precedent set in our imigration law that military
personels family where grandfathered in as citizens. He was also born in a US military installation. Its like being born on the premisis of one of our
Embassys which is soverign soil. None of those criteria pertains to Obama!
Zindo
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:25 PM by skeptic1
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reply to post by Bunch
The vault copy BC hasn't been analyzed to some's satisfaction. The Certificate of Live Birth has been available, but some aren't satisfied with
it.
If people get to see the actual vault copy BC with the place of birth, the time of birth, the doctor's name, etc., etc., then maybe the questions can
be answered one way or the other.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:27 PM by HunkaHunka
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Originally posted by skeptic1
reply to post by Bunch
The vault copy BC hasn't been analyzed to some's satisfaction. The Certificate of Live Birth has been available, but some aren't satisfied with
it.
If people get to see the actual vault copy BC with the place of birth, the time of birth, the doctor's name, etc., etc., then maybe the questions can
be answered one way or the other.
Can ANYONE tell me if the vault copy was requested for McCain as well? Any other candidates?
As far as I'm concerned, if it wasn't then this is baseless.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:27 PM by Bunch
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
I was talking to one of my buddys in the Air Force who well educated in security clereance, he was telling me that 78% of the regular folk would not
qualify straight up to get a Top Secret.
For that reason alone I think your idea about an ammendment would never be implemented or should be.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:29 PM by Benevolent Heretic
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Originally posted by Jenna
No one has actually analyzed his vault birth certificate that I am aware of.
The Health Department in Hawaii has verified that they hold his original birth certificate.
State officials say there’s no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.
Health Department Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino says she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health
department holds Obama’s original birth certificate.
Fukino says that no state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama’s certificate be handled differently from any
other.
Source
So, they hold his original BC, but don't divulge the name of the hospital or attending physician, which would be proof he was born there. You see,
Hawaii has a law that if your child is born out of state, you can return to Hawaii and apply for a Hawaiian BC. That's the loophole critics are
trying to close. If his Hawaiian BC gives the name of a Kenyan hospital and doctor, that would prove he was born in Kenya.  Critics say that's why
he chose to publish his CoLB instead of his BC.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:30 PM by ZindoDoone
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
Please read my post above. Its quite clear that there are differances in the two cases. One is a child of our military the other is not..
Zindo
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:31 PM by skeptic1
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
The thing with McCain is that Congress passed a resolution declaring him
"natural born" and I think that's what ended it as far as his status.
Yes, he was born in Panama, but both of his parents were citizens and met the "length of time" citizenship criteria that had to be met before McCain
was born in order to transfer the "natural born" status to him.
Source
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:33 PM by MikeboydUS
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reply to post by Bunch
So if I understand correctly you would rather have a Commander in Chief who is a national security threat or liability than have a national security
amendment to the qualifications to be President?
Personally I think if that disqualifies 78% of the population so be it. Those same 78% will never ever be brass at the Pentagon so why allow someone
to be Commander in Chief who couldn't even get a clearance to be a commissioned officer?
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:34 PM by Alexander_Supertramp
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Is there a law anywhere which allots for this type of situation? If the Supreme Court ruled Obama was not natural-born, does anyone have an inkling of
an idea as to what would happen, or is it all speculation?
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:38 PM by AmericanDaughter
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
Thanks for your answer Benevolent Heretic but what I was asking and I understand now, is would the judges go over each person and decide indavidualy
on them or say as example only that mccain is a proven a citizen then they all are; something like that.
Like I said I'm new to this and see so much corruption everywhere that I don't have much trust left although I do still have some for our Supreme
Court and pray they will be diligent in finding the truth whatever that may be.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:42 PM by skeptic1
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reply to post by AmericanDaughter
I think, that since Obama's "status" is the one in question, they would only decide on him, individually.
Of course, due to this, I would hope that this would cause some independent government group to be formed to vet Presidential candidates before the
election (for future elections). Right now, it is up to the parties to check and verify their candidate's qualifications, not a government agency.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:44 PM by grover
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:47 PM by Benevolent Heretic
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Originally posted by skeptic1
The thing with McCain is that Congress passed a resolution declaring him
"natural born" and I think that's what ended it as far as his status.
But the resolution has no legal effect. (snopes) Believe me, folks, McCain is still up in the air, but as long as no one challenges it, he would have
become the president. And IF he had been elected, this same thing would be happening with him.
Yes, his vault BC was posted on the Internet and everyone was happy.
The difference is that EVERYONE KNEW he was born in Panama. He wasn't hiding anything. If Obama was born in Kenya, he's either unaware of it himself
or he's been lying. THAT'S the difference in these cases.
Yes, he was born in Panama, but both of his parents were citizens and met the "length of time" citizenship criteria that had to be met before McCain
was born in order to transfer the "natural born" status to him.
Source
I don't see that in the snopes article. In fact, I read just the opposite.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:47 PM by Bunch
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
The office of the POTUS is a civilian position and you should never forget that, people have the chance to not vote on a candidate if they deem the
candidate is a threat, that what elections are for, a background investigation might involved 5 to ten people to get involved in a election 130
million people get involved.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:49 PM by Benevolent Heretic
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Originally posted by AmericanDaughter
would the judges go over each person and decide indavidualy on them or say as example only that mccain is a proven a citizen then they all are;
something like that.
No, it would be individual. I think the state of New Jersey is the petitioner and they want to know about several candidates, so their votes will be
legit. I think.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:54 PM by skeptic1
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
The "source" was for the Congressional resolution....I just put it at the end of the post.
However, looking at the law that was in place at the time of McCain's birth:
In 1934, Congress passed a law allowing US citizen parents, regardless of their gender, to pass citizenship to their children born abroad. If both
parents were citizens, only one was required to have resided in the US, and as with the previous law, there was no required length of time that the
parent must have resided in the US.
However, if one parent was a US citizen and the other a foreign national, the child would lose their citizenship if they did not either reside in the
US for the five years immediately prior to their eighteenth birthday or, within six months of turning 21, take an oath of allegiance to the US. These
requirements were gradually relaxed between 1934 and 1940.
Illegitimate children born aboard between 1934 and 1941 became citizens under the general provision, and because the child was considered to have only
one parent, no requirements were imposed that could result in the loss of citizenship.
Source
He is a "natural born" citizen. Unless, someone interprets this some other way than I am seeing it....
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:55 PM by MikeboydUS
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reply to post by Bunch
Even the civilian department members have to get clearances, DOD, State Department, etc.
People are easily swayed by charisma and a lemming/bandwagon effect. That could be clearly seen in this election.
If the founding fathers didn't trust the masses with the ultimate say in the presidential election, I don't see what would be wrong with an actual
background check and security clearance. Heck to throw some fuel on the fire, lets add a psychological evalution too. 
Regardless I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this issue.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:57 PM by centurion1211
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So, if obama is legitimate, why put everyone through all this? Why did obama even appear to play the hush-up game? He is truly a fool if he did not
think this would lead to conspiracy theories as it has done.
Unless obama truly has something to hide ...
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:58 PM by Benevolent Heretic
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Originally posted by skeptic1
In 1934, Congress passed a law allowing US citizen parents, regardless of their gender, to pass citizenship to their children born abroad.
CITIZENSHIP. Not "natural-born" citizenship. This is what people are missing. McCain became a citizen of the US at just under one year old. But
nothing has ever made him a natural-born citizen. (except the SCOTUS ruling, which is non-binding.)
I don't think we should be making this about McCain, though.
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reply posted on 20-11-2008 @ 12:58 PM by grover
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SIGH!!!
One more thing... do you really think that the NSA, CIA and dept. of Homeland security would be giving him briefings now if there really was a
question about the legitimacy of his birth place?
You know good and well both he and McCain were vetted by them well before the election.
I will not get involved in another Obama birth certificate thread... I will not get involved in another Obama birth certificate thread... I will not
get involved in another Obama birth certificate thread...
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