Stevens ousted; Dems eye power of 60

Stevens ousted; Dems eye power of 60

www.politico.com

he Democratic pursuit of 60 Senate seats received new life Tuesday night after Alaska Democrat Mark Begich was declared the winner against Ted Stevens, the longest-serving Republican in the Senate.

Begich defeated the Senate giant by a 3,724-vote margin after absentee and early votes were counted, a stunning end to a 40-year Senate career marred by Stevens’ conviction on corruption charges a week before the election.

Begich’s victory gives Democrats their 58th Senate seat, with the party still awaiting a pending recount in the too-close-to-call Minnesota Senate race and the Georgia Senate runoff next month. If Democrats win those two seats, they will reach a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate.

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Personally I don't give a rat's arse about the Ted Stevens saga... its the filibuster proof majority that concerns me and I am extremely ambivalent about it.

So much needs to be done or undone after the past 8 years that we really don't need the Republicans taking an obstructionist stance and getting away with it... serious work needs to be done period and trying to block a Democratic congress and president from doing anything from a purely partisan stance will do this nation no good... no good at all.

At the same time 6 out of the past 8 years the Republicans had such a choke hold on congress that they were able to shove laws down the Democrats throats with impunity and went so far as to lock Democrats out of committee meetings and drafted laws without their input at all...

... that is equally wrong and I don't want to see the Democrats walk down the same arrogant path.

So what do ya do?

www.politico.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

reply to post by grover

God help us if they get 60 seats.

Unchecked power is never a good thing for anybody.

Originally posted by nyk537
God help us if they get 60 seats.

Unchecked power is never a good thing for anybody.

It cant get worse than the last 8 years. I really believe the democrats will fix the damage from the Bush admin. TBH, they need the 60 seats to do it properly.

There are no excuses, the gloves are off now, it's time to see whether or not change will occur and what shape it assume.

Despite my backing a democratic base, I'm concerned at what this might entail assuming our perception of "the agenda" has been purposefully mislead. After all, it's happened all too often.

I agree with nyk537 in his concern. But I'm optimistic at this point. But there's that cloud inside of me that whispers that the assumption that things cannot get worse is a bad one.

Given the state of international affairs and the economy today, it can get a lot worse.

[edit on 19-11-2008 by Oscitate]

Let them have their supermajority.

That way in four years time when the country is in the doldrums, there will be nobody to blame but the so called agents of change and party of hope.

Repubs need to slink away and revitalise the core of the party on free market principles, non-interventionism and real capitalism once again. They havent done that since Reagan. Maybe a total and utter drubbing (which includes the supermajority) is what is needed for this introspection to occur.

You might be right.

But it's scary as hell.

reply to post by Waldy

Originally posted by nyk537
God help us if they get 60 seats.

Unchecked power is never a good thing for anybody.

Ok a little education here.

The Senate Demorats don't necessarily agree with BHO on many things.

I want the fillibuster proof majority in the congress for a specific reason.

BHO is going to want things that are anti-thetical to the pork-barrel politics which is played out in the senate. With the Republicans marginalized to the sidelines, it will be very clear who in the Dems are dragging their feet because of pork and who isn't. No one will be able to blame the republicans and it strikes me as a great way for the democratic party to iron out it's differences without the republicans getting in the way.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


On the other side of my point though, at the end of these next 4 years, the Democrats will have nobody to point to the finger at this time.

The blame for the disaster they will create will be entirely their own. I just can't decide if it's worth it for the harm it will cause the country.

Originally posted by nyk537
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

On the other side of my point though, at the end of these next 4 years, the Democrats will have nobody to point to the finger at this time.

The blame for the disaster they will create will be entirely their own. I just can't decide if it's worth it for the harm it will cause the country.

I agree wholeheartedly. It was the reason I voted for Nader in 2000. The Dems were not representing the majority of their base, they were being much to centrist and almost right leaning.

I figured... hey.. if 4 or 8 years of W doesn't wake them up, nothing will. And well, they woke up.

All in all I think it's a good thing.

Originally posted by nyk537
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

On the other side of my point though, at the end of these next 4 years, the Democrats will have nobody to point to the finger at this time.

It didn't stop the Republicans from blaming the Clinton's and Democrats for years after they

won

in 2000.

[edit on 19-11-2008 by grover]

I disagree that it's a good thing.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love nothing more than to see a super majority of Democrats have to take the full blame for terrorizing this country. To see them have to look American in the eyes and admit their ideas were wrong.

I just can't stomach the sacrifices the country would have to make to reach that point.

Originally posted by nyk537
I disagree that it's a good thing.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love nothing more than to see a super majority of Democrats have to take the full blame for terrorizing this country. To see them have to look American in the eyes and admit their ideas were wrong.

I just can't stomach the sacrifices the country would have to make to reach that point.

They can't be worse than what we've had to stomach with the stranglehold Republicans have had.

I mean really now we encourage torture, secret prisons, etc.


Can you think of something worse?

reply to post by seagull


Exactly. We have heard all of the tell tale BS passed about pointing fingers here and there and there and even over there a bit. Now, especially if this happens, it will have to point soley at THEMSELVES. I do not like the idea of such power in one side of the house but hey, let's see what happens over the next couple years. If they turn things around and actually save this country from the damage the current administration has done then I may actually consider becoming a registered democrat!

Checks and balances, that's the key. We've seen what a dominated gov't can do. Personally I hope the Dem's don't get their 60. Not good for the country imo.

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
Can you think of something worse?

I can think of things equally disgusting to me.

Censorship through the "fairness" doctrine, higher taxes, more government bureaucracy, a bigger welfare state, weak defense, etc..

Yeah, I can think of plenty of things the Dem's are drooling over that make my stomach churn.

People like Stevens have to go. No ifs, thens, or buts.

If the Democrats get 60 it is no big deal. Most of what Congress passes are minor issues or good will bills. On the tougher issues Obama and the democrats will still have to sell the deal to the American people. If Congress tried to pull a fast one on the American people, it would cast Obama in a bad light and I don't think obama wants that. Furthermore, the Democrats have to be careful about the legislation they have because it could hurt them in the mid term elections. In a way, there are some safety nets in place.

Originally posted by nyk537
I disagree that it's a good thing.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love nothing more than to see a super majority of Democrats have to take the full blame for terrorizing this country. To see them have to look American in the eyes and admit their ideas were wrong.

I just can't stomach the sacrifices the country would have to make to reach that point.

Wow, when you said this you HAD to know you were going to get some replies (not necessarily good ones either).

Okay, this is where I stand. I like to think of myself as mostly conservative. I used to think of myself as republican but I no longer believe that party represents a truly conservative view.

Now, with that in mind, you are saying what you said with the intent of saying that the dems have been responsible for all that has happened over the past decade? I beg to differ. There is a REASON I am no longer a republican. It is because of the actions of the current republican administration.

They have steered this country into an unending war purely for profit. Profit for themselves and their friends. Period. If you have oil ties, you have become filthy rich because of this administration. If you work in the defense (Military Industrial Complex) you have become filthy rich because of this administration.

They have doctored intelligence reports so that they would have reason's to attack soveirgn nations and they have reinstated torture as a good way to obtain information. Even though it is WELL documented that information obtained from torture is about as worthless as used toilet paper. Yet, they insist that it is okay while still threatening anyone who dares to torture our troops or agents that may be caught in their own countries.

Such hypocrisy is what has made me sway from the republican party. This administration is packed full of criminals. People that would be tried for war crimes in any international court if the threat of the big bully America wasn't behind them. They have flaunted their enormous egos and have pushed allies into supporting illegal wars.

And yet you are blaming this on the democrats? Hmmm, I'm not a democrat but I don't quite see where you are gleaning that information from.

Please enlighten us.