Originally posted by moocowman
To be honest, I use PC more for effect (in relation to the religious argument) than my personal opinion, it appears to be 2 edged sword unfortunately.

A worker (in the UK) has to protect him/her, laws relating to sexuality, colour , race, disability, religion etc.

However when religious people are given the right to practice their religion without predjudice, the enivitable will occur but not always.

I will use christianity as an example, a mixed bunch of people in an office each have their rights, however the christian will claim that part of his religion is to recruit (for want of a better word) other people.
Unfortunately the other people ar gay or lesbian and have every right to be offended by any allegations of immorality or condemnations such as "abomination" for the way they choose to live.

Respect and things go both ways. Not only should the christian respect the will of the gay person, but also the gay person needs to respect the right of the christian for his views. It is wrong for the religious person to make it politically correct to condemn them, and at the same time it is wrong for the gay person to condemn the christian for their beliefs.

But by definition those are not actually Christians. These are the pharisees of today. Anyone who condemns another for any reason is not following what Jesus said and taught.

Anyone being offended by things it's their own problem. You have every right to be offended, no right to do anything about it(in public anyway). That is the price of freedom.

PC It would seem, will attempt to shut the christian up (and rightly so) he should keep his condemnations to himself. But there seems to be this conflict between religious freedom and respecting other peoples diversity in life choices.

On a personal level i wouldn't even entertain the thought of employing a christian, there are more gays, lesbians and bisexuals in the UK than fundamentalist christians, and who needs lawsuits in the workplace ?

Unfortuantely there seems to be many homosexual christians wo what the hell arre you supposed to do ?

Perhaps the golden rule should be -

"Thou shalt not take offence" ?
then leave everything else to slander and libel laws.

So it's not right for them to shut you up, but it should be ok for you to shut them up? Hypocrisy is all that is.

You wouldn't employ a christian, but you would be upset if someone didn't employ someone because they are gay? More hypocrisy.

If you can not give these things to another, why do you expect them in return?

I definatly DO NOT hate Jesus. I agree with all of his principles and illistrations 100%.

I just don't like the mess man made religion has made of the world.

Jesus wasn't religious, he just PRACTCED what he PREACHED, instead of going around making people feel bad, he taught them NOT to be judging each other.

When asked, "how will we know they are your deciples?" he said "If you have LOVE amongst yourselves."......not if you go to the church of so-and-so or such and such......he didn't even say, "you will have THIS label, or THAT label"......it was SIMPLE......"if you have LOVE amongst you"....... THAT'S the MARK of distinction..... LOVE.

People seem to forget one thing...

Christ came over 2000 years ago

The wisdom of Christ was well beyond and before his time. One cannot read the parables without seeing the absolute wisdom in them.

That what was spoken 2000 years ago is still applicable today.

Do I believe in Christ? Absolutely!

I feel very sad to even consider hatred being directed at someone who was innocent and suffered to help others.

Generally, people hate those who speak the truth, why? Because people don't want the truth.



I had a meditation about my own death. And I spoke with Death and

Death said, confess your sins. I was surprised to see that I had to speak

to Death in order for me to live again or the conditions of my next life. I

thought for a long time and wasnt sure

what I should say. I then said, well I have none because Christ died for

me, I was washed clean in the blood of the Lamb. It is with regret I have

none because someone had to die in order for me to be free of my guilt,

and my shame. I then saw Death turn into Christ and he looked relieved

that I didn't have any sins to confess. He didn't have to suffer for me

ever again.

Originally posted by moocowman
Here's the problem dude, how can any individual respect another person that believes a book which is fraught with contradiction and error, authors unkown. That tells the individual that the lifestyle of such and such is an abomination and illegal in their mind, punishiable by eternal torture or stoning to death, depending on how the reader interprets it ?

And they will say - how can any individual respect another person who lays down with someone of the same sex. And the answer is because you do not have the right to decide for anyone other than yourself. You do not have the right to control another beings will. If you can respect that, then you can be peaceful. If you refuse to do so, then you will not be given peace.

While you can use their actions as a way of justifying yourself, if you are honest and intelligent, then you will realize that in response your actions have become the mirror to that. At which point, you have become the very evil you were so upset about in the first place.

Seems to me, the better man would realize this, understand how it felt and stand up and say so. You want to blow their minds - stick up for their will when they would not stick up for yours. Show them you are the better man, and not the hypocrite they are. That is how you make a difference. That is how you change the status quo.

I personally find women with tatooes quite repulsive and I enjoy the fredom to say and think so. However I do not in any way shape or form have any right to try to prevent women having tatooes. What is totally repulsive is that, if my opinion was based on someone elses' belief and I was commanded to think this way and would not only go out of my way to condemn these women but endevour to create laws to prevent them from having tatooes.

Having an opinion be it negative or positive on the way someone chooses to live is a far cry from trying to force mythalogical morals upon him.

I really don't believe xtians in general realise how repulsive their delusion is.

You are free to think they are ignorant. I actually agree with you. But you cross the line and step into hypocrisy when you refuse to allow them to live as they see fit, just as they are free to think you are sick, but they cross the line into hypocrisy when they refuse you to allow as you to live as you see fit.

Not stepping into the hypocrisy and doing the right thing when others won't is the true price of freedom. When you try to take away anothers freedom, you lose the right to it yourself. Case in point - USA.

The world surely does not need another hypocrite running around. Break the cycle of ignorance and rise above it. That is what you do. Any good reason to give into your anger and become like them in the wrongful actions?

And you could always read and understand the words of Jesus and take constellation they don't even actually understand what they preach, much less follow it. I don't see page after page of Jesus ranting on about how bad and evil homosexuals are, but I do see page after page of Jesus calling out and taking issue with people who keep strict interpretation of the bible and are hypocrites.

I'd be willing to bet you know this already, perhaps you just need a bit of a reminder.



[edit on 25-11-2008 by badmedia]

Originally posted by moocowman
I fail to see how i'm being hypocrytical, I don't in anyway refuse an xtian to live as they see fit.

Because they wish to tell you what to do, and if you do not allow them their opinons, then you are doing the same exact thing by telling them what to do. That is hypocritical.

However I would given the oportunity, take a measured response to their insistance on imposing their delusion upon myself or that of my children.

Perhaps, (in relation to homosexuality) the question should be asked of christians - If the oportunity arose, to make homosexuality illegal would they agree and have it that way?
Perhaps this question could warrant a thread of its' own but I feel there are enough of on the subject.

So there you go I'll throw it out there, if your a Christian and had the oportunity would you make homosexuality illegal ?

It is none of my business what you do. No, I would never support such a thing. I live in northern cali, and I was down right disappointed prop 8 passed, and kind of in disbelief that it happened. I am not gay, but I respect your right to be so.

Not to mention, you aren't even breaking a commandment, just some tradition of Moses.

The only time I will ever say something about what someone is doing is if they are infringing on another persons free will. Aside from that, what you do is between you and god, and I nor anyone else has any right to judge you.

These are the real things Jesus teaches.

Originally posted by Thurisaz
People seem to forget one thing...

Christ came over 2000 years ago



The wisdom of Christ was well beyond and before his time. One cannot read the parables without seeing the absolute wisdom in them.

That what was spoken 2000 years ago is still applicable today.

Do I believe in Christ? Absolutely!

I feel very sad to even consider hatred being directed at someone who was innocent and suffered to help others.

Generally, people hate those who speak the truth, why? Because people don't want the truth.

I had a meditation about my own death. And I spoke with Death and

Death said, confess your sins. I was surprised to see that I had to speak

to Death in order for me to live again or the conditions of my next life. I

thought for a long time and wasnt sure

what I should say. I then said, well I have none because Christ died for

me, I was washed clean in the blood of the Lamb. It is with regret I have

none because someone had to die in order for me to be free of my guilt,

and my shame. I then saw Death turn into Christ and he looked relieved

that I didn't have any sins to confess. He didn't have to suffer for me

ever again.

see this is why we dont like religion/some religious people. its not jesus, its extremist claims and speculations. unfortunately i doubt you have any proof of this what so ever other then "you miraculously changed" or what have you, and thats why atheists have a hard time believing in not only the "word of god" but the people who spread them.

it has nothing to do with jesus at all, it has everything to do with the people who follow so blindly and faithfully without any proof of anything to back up your claims.

after reading an article on "the Christian post" in washington DC there will be buses with signs on them, "no God" .
To me thats like taking Christmas away from all of the people, and
then I ask myself again why do so many hate Jesus? That was Jesus
birthday and some people want to take it away!

Originally posted by crazyjames65
after reading an article on "the Christian post" in washington DC there will be buses with signs on them, "no God" .
To me thats like taking Christmas away from all of the people, and
then I ask myself again why do so many hate Jesus? That was Jesus
birthday and some people want to take it away!

Ahum, sorry to interupt yor delusion, but christams was a pagan festival incorperated in to chrisianity ie hghjacked. Kina liek if you can't beat them join them.

Wake up Flanders nobody hates jesus ! Some people hate christians or christianity, Christianity departed from jesus 2000 years ago.

The thing with the buses was organised by Richard Dawkins by all accounts and has nothing to do with hating anything.

it is aparent to me that this is a atheist site and I will remove myself because I do not belong here. When ever I figure out how to delete my
account.

Originally posted by crazyjames65
it is aparent to me that this is a atheist site and I will remove myself because I do not belong here. When ever I figure out how to delete my
account.

you cant be serious?

we have an entire religious conspiracies forum so both religion and non can prove points and give information.

If anything there are more people who believe in a higher power here than none at all.

Just cause you may have been proved wrong at one point in any of your posts doesnt meen we all cant stand you what so ever. It means that we notice that someone is not seeing the picture entirely, so we yet again give information.

It is not a personal attack when someone responds to your post giving evidence and factual information.

[edit on 27/11/08 by Ghost147]

I have prayed on this question and came up with the athiest have there belief and I have my own way of looking at the world and I can still see the hate and non-beleif. Where does it start? I am not trying to push those who don't have faith in Jesus but there is something going on. No God! on buses, here is another seperation of church and state going on. Or there is some kind of movement happening right now.

i dont hate jesus. its like saying you hate santa. you cant hate them. not because they are so kind but because they dont exist .

Originally posted by crazyjames65
after reading an article on "the Christian post" in washington DC there will be buses with signs on them, "no God" .
To me thats like taking Christmas away from all of the people, and
then I ask myself again why do so many hate Jesus? That was Jesus
birthday and some people want to take it away!

give me proof jesus was born on the 25th of december. the bible isnt proof.

I guess I can't prove anything but when you hear the Holy Spirit talk to
one self then I listen.
I can not even prove that George Washington or any other person in history taught in school was here because there is no video of their existance either. Please don't think that I am gunning on history but there are certain things we just can't prove.