Those behind the Obama Birth Cert conspiracy

Originally posted by mrwupy
This would go away instantly if he would simply produce his birth certificate, rather than a certificate of live birth.

The debacle is just as much his fault as it is those who raise the questions.

Why won't he produce his birth certificate?

Obama's grandmother testified she was present at his birth in a hospital in Kenya in 1961. Doesn't that settle it?

reply to post by aero56


You sure it wasn't the newspaper who added that in. Usually it goes something like this... The director of the Hawaii department of Health said.... and they quote what the person said or they paraphrase what the person said.

If you look at paragraph where they mention the director you will see what the director said.

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by Irish M1ck

 

Which state official said what you quoted? I see it in the source but it doesn't attribute that quote to anybody.

Six million dollars buys a lot of ccoperation.

Originally posted by Frank Lee

Originally posted by Irish M1ck
Why do you all ignore that the original birth

Sorry for double post, first day!

Irish Mick:
Do you really think your fellow man is so stupid that he would make this argument since June if it were that simple?

Obviously, you have started at the end of the thread and not read the real discussion.

For the nth time on this thread: He showed the "CertificaTION of Live Birth" not the "CertificaTE of Live Birth" which shows the name of the Dr. and Hospital (which is in dispute). The former only records a live birth, it does not satisfy either HI or US proof of citizenship

Please read the posts before posting your naive insults and stop wasting everyone's time and space
[edit on 17-11-2008 by Irish M1ck]

reply to post by aero56


Whoa....I am not conspiring about anything.

My problem is his reluctance and seeming unwillingness to show ONE piece of paper in light of numerous lawsuits that only want that. Instead of showing the piece of paper, he spends money on multiple lawyers to fight the cases.

THAT is my problem.

I would feel the same way about any other candidate that did the same thing, whether it be about a BC or any other disputed record(s) of any kind. Obama is my President-elect, and I will support him and respect him and his office. BUT, if he keeps digging in about this BC thing, then I will lose a bit of respect for Obama the MAN.

[edit on 11/17/2008 by skeptic1]

reply to post by maybereal11


For an in-depth history of all the things that the MSM missed, I suggest you visit colony14.net...

reply to post by Frank Lee


My interpretation of this article is that while he was in Indonesia the US was not allowed to afford him the rights and priveladges of a citizen because Indonesia did not accept dual citizenship. Therefore, if he was adopted (of which there is no proof), then for the time he was in Indonesia he was solely an Indonesian citizen.

However, once he left Indonesia, the US law became effective once again and he was reinstated his full rights. This does not mean his original citizenship was renounced while in Indonesia, it means that the US could not lawfully treat him as a citizen in Indonesia.

Commonly known as the "Master Nationality Rule", the practical effect of this Article is that where a person is a national of, for example, two States (A and B), and is in the territory of State A, then State B has no right to claim that person as its national or to intervene on that person's behalf. Such a person who goes into the territory of a third state may be treated as a national of either A or B - it does not normally matter which one, except, for example, where the courts of the third state have to adjudicate upon matters relating to that person's status and the relevant laws depend on the person's nationality. In such cases, it is necessary to choose an effective nationality (i.e. one of the two nationalities is selected as effective for the purposes of the third state).

Master Nationality Rule

reply to post by Avenginggecko



On Master Nationality Rule:

Thanks for your cogent interpretation. I've been wondering about this for about a week now.

This whole Obama birth certificate thing is for people who are dumb as rocks.

This is getting old.

And no, Obama should not go to any trouble to placate the tribe of morons who will then simply try to desperately find some other stupid trivial detail. He is the POTUS elect and has better things than answer silly questions that have already been answered.

He is a natural born citizen of the United States. Period.

reply to post by southern_Guardian


You are assuming that Obama is a "natural born" citizen, but there are a lot of questions that have never been answered. I do not trust anyone who could resolve this situation by producing the documentation required to verify his qualifications. For someone who says he wants to bring everyone together, he has a strange way of showing it. He has said and done too many things that leads me to believe he ihas a private and a public demeanor. We do not know who this man is. The American people have every right to get the answers to their questions. He has refused to release all of his college records, medical records, passport information, selective service registration, etc. WHY? What is he hiding?

Originally posted by interestedalways
What he produced isn't good enough.

There is much more to it. Other factors involved.

Do some research yourselves, obviously you haven't.

You said you wanted a birth certificate. You got one and now that is not good enough? There is much more to it? Such as....?

Originally posted by Stormdancer777

First a certification of live birth is not a birth certificate.

Guess which one you can use to get a passport and which one you can not use..
That's why it is important to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.

Originally posted by JEANNIEMAC

Originally posted by mrwupy
This would go away instantly if he would simply produce his birth certificate, rather than a certificate of live birth.

The debacle is just as much his fault as it is those who raise the questions.

Why won't he produce his birth certificate?

Obama's grandmother testified she was present at his birth in a hospital in Kenya in 1961. Doesn't that settle it?

This is just what Im talking about, taking one slanted blog or website for its word.

First off there is just an audio tape of some woman saying Obama is the son of the village, how the hell do you know whether it is his estranged grandmother?

Secondly, Obama is not very close to his family in kenya, apart from meeting them afew times in his life they had no influence over his childhood.

Thirdly, the talk of his grandmother saying she was present at his birth it pure BS, its what the website said, not his estranged grandmother for petes sakes.


[edit on 17-11-2008 by southern_Guardian]

reply to post by ClintK


ClintK:

The AP report you link to is ambiguous. The state officials state they have Obama’s original birth certificate, which is nothing new. It appears that the reporter concluded, “State officials say there's no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.” There’s no indication that the state officials made that declaration. Observers want to know the name of the Dr. and Hospital (which is in dispute). Besides they could say they have the “original birth certificate” even if Obama was born in Kenya and still be truthful. In order for the state to issue a “CertificaTION of Live Birth” the original foreign birth certificate must be supplied to the state.

There is no evidence to be found of an admission to any Honolulu hospital for Stanley Ann Dunham --Obama's mother-- or for the birth of Obama in any Honolulu hospital, but researchers have found a birth record for a son, named Barack Obama, Jr. born in a Mombassa, Kenya hospital around the date Obama was supposed to have been born, whose father is listed as one Barack Obama, Sr. and whose mother was an American citizen. And Sen. Obama's paternal grandmother, half-brother and half-sister have also claimed, that Stanley Ann Dunham gave birth to Barack in Kenya and subsequently flew to Hawaii to register the birth. Because of U.S. laws in force at the time of his birth, U.S. citizenship was not conferred on Obama through his mother because of her age.

ClintK: You assert: He is a natural born citizen of the United States. Period.
If you have some proof no else has, let’s see it, so we can all get on to something else!

angel of lightangelo
Your aversion to research is obvious. You should read a few posts before shooting from the hip. Then you would not appear to be just another Silly Old Boob.

Originally posted by southern_Guardian


This is just what Im talking about, taking one slanted blog or website for its word.

First off there is just an audio tape of some woman saying Obama is the son of the village, how the hell do you know whether it is his estranged grandmother?

Thirdly, the talk of his grandmother saying she was present at his birth it pure BS, its what the website said, not his estranged grandmother for petes sakes.


[edit on 17-11-2008 by southern_Guardian]

Exactly. In fact, I'm told that the most literal interpretation of what she said was that he was "of the village," which is what they said of my father when he visited the village in Germany my great grandfather was born in. "Of the village" meant that he was a descendant of the natives of that village, not that he was born there.

I just think it's hilarious to watch these hate-filled people grab at straws. It's a bottomless pit with them and Obama knows it. He provides his original birth certificate, that still wouldn't be enough. Then it would be a forgery. Even if a thousand document experts said it was genuine, all you'd have to have was one mediocre document expert say it was a forgery and they'd jump on that. It would never end. Once the birth certificate thing ran out of mileage, they'd find something else. Some other obscure, ridiculous thing.

I like the way Obama is just ignoring these pathetic dolts and focusing on the job at hand. These people seem to think Obama has to answer to them on everything they can come up with, regardless of how ridiculous. They'll always hate him, no matter what, so it's pointless to even acknowledge them.

Originally posted by skeptic1
My problem is his reluctance and seeming unwillingness to show ONE

Yes then he shows further proof of his birth on US soil and yet folks here demand another "one" because they refuse to believe it yet again.

There is no "one" anything when it comes to you fellas, its a matter of denial of what is the truth. People spend all their time here scoping out every little detail of the president elects history and jump out with one small print, only to be debunked, and the cycle continues.

There will be no "one" anything to you folks, his already satisfied to proper authorities and the majorty of America. It is but a minority who would never believe the man no matter howmuch evidence he gives yet readily willing to believe hearsay off a politically slanted website. That is whats so messed up here.

piece of paper in light of numerous lawsuits

And he has presented the appropriate piece of paper numerous times, you fellas just choose not to believe it. Damn straight he shouldnt accommodate a small population all sourgrapes over the election. A small minority that will always make up some issue about the man, for BS partisan reasons.

I would feel the same way about any other candidate that did the same thing

right, you folks have been very "objective" alright. This is what this thread touches on, that folks here only go to places that share their slanted views to get information. Theres virtually no objectivity left in you arguements, just more sour grape politics.

Deny ignorance.


[edit on 17-11-2008 by southern_Guardian]

reply to post by ClintK



what gets to me most Clint is that this is a minority on mostly the righthand end of the political spectrum demanding this and that of the president elect, refering these smears from obvious slanted sources, and crying foul while not been objective at all. Its the arrogance and the ignorance.

Originally posted by Frank Lee


ClintK: You assert: He is a natural born citizen of the United States. Period.
If you have some proof no else has, let’s see it, so we can all get on to something else!

angel of lightangelo
Your aversion to research is obvious. You should read a few posts before shooting from the hip. Then you would not appear to be just another Silly Old Boob.

Here

Go ahead. Click on the document in thar article. Read what it says at the bottom. "This copy serves as prima facie evidence of the fact of birth in any court proceeding." You know what that means? If someone wants to dispute this they need to come up with substantial evidence that it is false. That means anyone wanting to challenge his natural born citizenship would have to come up with something. If you can't come up with any substantial evidence that the document is false, game over. Period. And nobody here has come up with anything. Anything!

And, sorry, but Obama should never waste his time with silly distractions like this; from people who hate his guts and always will. You should read a little about the law before shooting from the hip. Otherwise, you're just a silly boob.

[edit on 17-11-2008 by ClintK]

reply to post by southern_Guardian

And he has presented the appropriate piece of paper numerous times, you fellas just choose not to believe it

He has not presented the "appropriate piece of paper". If he had, there would not be any law suits asking for it.

Seriously this topic is dead. Those who are demanding the real "appropriate piece of paper". Will not accept anything less.

And those who think he has done enough already. Will never believe anything the other side says other than they are just disgruntled nut jobs, or morons, republicans etc.

This argument keeps going on and on and on..........


I will say it again.....


1. Place of birth
2. Hospital of record
3. Delivering doctors' sig

These are the 3 things requested

This has not been provided in any way shape or form, nor have these things been verified by anyone including the HI government. Until this happens, this will never end.

reply to post by ClintK


Right! It's a statement of fact of birth, nothing more, just like I stated! It is not a statment of U.S. or HI citizenship.

Hawaiian Birth Ceriticate Definitions

"In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."

For a report of a converstation wtih the Director of Records in HawaiiI suggest you refer to
www.newswithviews.com...