Must See! Video:38 levels above Top Secret!

There multiple levels of clearance...I work with people right now withclearence of various degrees. They all agree with me that the line of what is secret/top secret ect. has been blurred over the years. Which indicates to me we have a very paranoid Military and/or Government.

When a government agency or group shares information between an agency or group of other country’s government they will generally employ a special classification scheme which both parties have previously agreed to honour. For example, sensitive information shared amongst NATO allies has five levels of security classification; from most to least classified, COSMIC TOP SECRET (CTS), FOCAL TOP SECRET (FTS), NATO SECRET (NS), NATO CONFIDENTIAL (NC), and NATO RESTRICTED (NR). A special case exists with regard to NATO UNCLASSIFIED (NU) information. This is NATO property and must not be made public without NATO permission.

en.wikipedia.org...

People in the Military (all of them) are on a need to know basis. There are Military people with Nuclear arms secrets that are in the Air Force because they fly them to their destination. Same with Navy (Subs carry nukes). The Marines protect the Nukes at any base they are located at. I doubt the Navy knows or is allowed to know anything about the Air Force. (Just making a point here)

They will tell certain people what they need to know. Very few know anything about UFOs. Phillip Schneider didn't know anything about Aliens till he ran into them and got his hand blown off. (if you believe him) Bill Cooper saw a UFO come out of the ocean and then was TOLD that he didn't see anything by a commanding officer. Both were killed so their stories get some credibility.

I agree that probably 25 guys know everything. Maybe 250 know that Aliens/UFOs exist. Maybe 2500 have seen an incredible unexplained site by accident up close and were told they didn't. A smart intelligent person knows when to quit asking questions if any at all. They appreciate what they know and let it go. I doubt they hang around ATS.

There are probably 38 levels of Top Secret maybe more. If you work for Office of Naval Intelligence you may know 5 and the guy next to you may know a different five.

Never heard of that one.



It's like someone said, the compartments are "flavors" of information sources. The actual black "UFO projects" are likely contained within unacknowledged special access programs. Although some may fall under the domain of SCI, SAPs are an additional, tighter level of "need to know" requirement beyond SCI compartments.

A SAP's security apparatus is structured like a cone. With peons on the bottom knowing little outside of their immediate job responsibilities, and as you go up the chain, gradually workers have wider perspective or "tickets". And the tricky part is there maybe SAPs contained within other SAPs. Project Moondust for example, likely had other layers inside of it. That's where shadow govt type descriptions sound realistic.

As I understand it, the administrator of a SAP is accountable for security and is the only entity with the "big picture", for that specific program. They are the SOLE authority on who is briefed and into what aspects of the project. As weird as it seems, I think many SAPs reside within private, not govt channels.

The deepest black SAPs must all require polygraphs and intrusive monitoring. I can't imagine scientists actually handling bona fide alien craft not being closely sequestered and watched.



Assuming the ongoing work there is as vast as commonly believed, it's virtually guaranteed the highest ranking officer at A-51 doesn't have access to everything going on there. In the context of my last pargraph, A-51 must have multiple SAPs on site.

Arthur Exon, a former Commanding Officer of Wright Patterson spoke of the "unholy thirteen" UFO research group on the base. His friend Senator Goldwater asked for access to the "blue room" and General Exon flew off the handle. You can bet if Exon showed up announced to this restricted area, without having clearance, he would not be allowed inside, no matter his rank or privilege.

Yes you have a right over a higher ranking officer that wants to "take a peak"! That would be a serious breach of security and get reported.

When you gain that high of clearance, you're inducted into a culture, that would prevent such a scenario from ever happening. It's outlandish to think someone above you would attempt blackmail to gain access to information they're not cleared to have.



There is nothing to buy into. Nobody said it was efficient. Compartmentalization is simply a fact in intelligence operations. Read James Bamford's excellent books about the National Security Agency for some insight.

The most highly classified spending is done off the books. There are exemptions for national security. Last time I checked, officially the government is spending around 40-50 billion a year on black ops. The reality is likely several times that amount.

Sec of Defense Rumsfeld admitted the Pentagon could not account for TRILLIONS of dollars over the last decade. One of the big problems they face, is making sure their efforts aren't duplicated within other compartments and agencies. There is a controlling SCI authority within the DoD to monitor for these trends, but they don't get briefed on all the most sensitive (unacknowledged) stuff.

This article is worth reading too.

On Black Special Access Programs
www.ufoskeptic.org...

reply to post by EarthCitizen07

---

ctually there are many things the President can't have access to. Executive Orders issued by pressure from persuasive sources lead to secret Executive Orders which say as much. In addition, unless he's a mind reader he can't compel some individual/entity to reveal what has been scrupulously hidden from others in the first place. even in specialized areas and compartments there are secrets within secrets and secrets not released to superiors, etc for personal gain or whatever reason. I mean if one doesn't have access to certain levels of sensitivity even lowly subordinates may take action. look at nuke guards. a private may shoot anyone- even a general who crosses an invisible line between the guard and the nuke he's guarding if they don't have prpoer clearance. What makes you think that without Q clearance (which a President does not have) the President could get into, say, Areas 51 through 54

Are you saying that the highest ranking officer in Area 51 is actually prevented from entering into a certain area by privates guarding the door ? What of the lower ranking officers within the compartment ? Do they have any right over a higher ranking official who decides he wants to take a peek?
What if they do have a right to prevent the higher officer, would it not be easy for him to blackmail them by threatening them with a court marshall ? Afterall - who will they believe more ? some lower rank officer or the highest ranking and most respected officer at the facility ?

In response: Officers are constantly restricted from passing certain access points without proper clearance, depending upon the level of sensitivity for the area they may be reported, detained, jailed, court- martialed themselves, injured or be met with the authorized use of deadly force for such violations. As for threatening with a Court Martial such threat is a threat and would instantly be met with the appropriate degree of action (assuming the guard does not simply ignore the officer). At a Court Martial evidence is a high priority, hearsay and opinion is not enough. The Officer would have to have proof of his/ her accusations. A guard is referred to as an officer even if they are a lowly enlistee. Simply because they are acting with the power and authority of an officer while on duty. An officer would have met his/ her match if they inappropriately challenged the guards authority- even a General, Admiral, Joint Chief, or the President.

Thanks for the vid!

Certainly is interesting, like another poster said; its beyond me to understand that the Potus wouldnt have clearance and access even to the highest level of any government/private project. Makes you wonder though, i wouldnt be surprised if there are private projects going on which are restricted to the people who run it.

As a USN Special Forces Undersea Warfare Technician and Operator for the Weopons Department ACIENT Intelligence division of the Pentagon I held/ hold both Q and Ultra Top Secret clearance for life. Not Top Secret Ultra, but Ultra Top Secret. I can not divulge the nature of the Work, but I assure you I earned it by scoring top 98% on my ASVAB ( a 29-32 composite score) among other things. I tried to post this once, however I don't believe it went through, so I joined ATS as a member. I'm tired of people saying things they don't know- say I believe or am of the opinion, or just admit you don't know. It would make educating oneself and others more expedient. But to imply or declare that people such as I don't have the levels of sensitivity we enjoy is an indignity to us who protect your freedoms and liberty. There are vast reasons we keep things secret and they don't all involve trying to exploit you for personal gain. Most of us believe in defending America from all enemies both Foreign and DOMESTIC. It contradicts that stance to knowingly support those who would abuse that trust. In sensitive areas lowly and higher ranks though, structured, are as equals. Superiors and their subordinates share all information to better decide whether to disseminate that information on up the chain of command, constantly. Though we are supposed to release everything we rarely do. And though we are supposed to keep information from those in our command , doing so is rarer still. Think about it, what would you do if you enjoyed such a position? Use it to the best of your abilities with openness towards those around you for a more extensive set of viewpoints other than your own, or keep it to yourself and conspire with others to use it for personal gain ( always fearful those whom you conspire with aren't like me and would humor you and/ or use you until I could expose your wrongdoing to others in appropriate positions?) Doubtful, the latter. Consider that while making theories based on available knowledge and wisdom- sometimes your not far off the truth of it. But to tell you some things would be to cause more damage to you or others such secrecy was meant to protect. Not empower to wicked ends, but to protect from harm or injury through the release of such information. Not that it isn't abused, so we all must remain vigilant to help one another.

But don't tell us we don't hold clearances above Top Secret. The Government does that enough for us, each time it denies such things exist. And it actually kinda stings a little when they do.

reply to post by Starance

---

I despise facism but to a large extent your analysis is correct. Too much corruption and people pulling different ways. I think the solution might be authoritarian socialism!

[edit on 23-11-2008 by EarthCitizen07]

The president is commander-in-chief which means he/she has access to anything they want. To think otherwise is naive, at best. The president signs all the executive orders, not some "secret" member in MAJIC or anywhere else. In fact it is widely speculated that ex-president Truman commissioned majic to study the ufo phenomenom and organise the entire cover-up.

Off course just because they have unlimited access in theory does not mean they excercise that right in public. "Off the record" is different than "on the record" as everyone who is anyone can attest to. You can do anything you want just don't go around talking about it.

In my sincere opinion and perhaps slightly off-topic but very important in this context, the *american corporation* has way too much power/influence. Basically it is they who run government because it is they who sponsor everything, including the elections. No sane person will bite the hand that feeds them and if they do you can bet on a covert assasination attempt at some point in the future. When people say "secret government" they are referencing the military-industrial complex.

[edit on 23-11-2008 by EarthCitizen07]

reply to post by NavalFC

---

Are you a disinfo agent?
Sounds like it.

K if I remember correctly without wandering thru bookmarks or googling the easily obtainable sources, the bush quote was said in an interview regarding the Iran/Contra affair, President Carter is the one who said he was denied information on UFO's, this was repeated recently on tv around the time the 6th man on the moon was in the news about coming out. In fact several presidents have been denied and stated so on record, and it seems some pretty smart people cleared up a bit of questions i had regarding security clearance I do have a couple more tho but thanks guys, great info in this thread

the gov contractors like JPL,TRW,etc have their own security clearances no doubt, with DOD and other agencies on the board how do they play into the intelligence communities and do they follow the same pattern or is that covered with specific NDAs(non-disclosure agreements), years ago i almost took a job at TRW Science and tech and the security checks took a month if i remember right and that was just the art department, it was pretty trippy for a young student so ive always been a bit curious

reply to post by kobalt7

---

I was listening to Coast2Coast 2 nights ago and Linda Molton Howe said that Jimmy Carter had made a comment , because he had seen a UFO with his own eyes, he said, if he got in office, he would disclose all the UFO material, but when he did become president and asked for it... the CIA or some group seemed to have disinformed him or spun something that it shocked him and made him change his mind about disclosing all the UFO information as he had planned. I don't know what he was shown, but whatever it was made him change his mind. I say it's possible that they spun what they told him at this meeting to sway his intended plan to disclose all this stuff to the public.

reply to post by EarthCitizen07

---

No. The President, as Commander in Chief does not have full access to whatever he wants. The Constitution separates Powers, therefore, the Executive Branch can't just go and look at neither the Legislature's nor the Judiciary's confidential materials simply because they want to. True, he may issue a specific Executive Order making it Law for him to do so, but, the Constitution grants the Legislative, not the Executive, Branch Authority to write Law, so, I don't see it flying very far. In fact, I believe one may refuse to acknowledge the validity of an Executive Order for just that reason, though, it's not been challenged insofar as I'm aware. Regardless, as Commander In Chief of the Military, the Constitutional Separation of Powers does not end there. He has no more power over the Military Courts and Tribunals than he does the Public or Private (Administrative) Courts-- Unless, under authority of the Executive Brach via a Cabinet Secretary (Ie.: DHHS Social Services based Admin Courts) which bypass the Constitution's Separation of Powers. Further, the same goes for Military Legislation of Law. He may only Enforce. At best, he's a glorified Cop, at worst, a glorified Secretary. I know personally he does not posess Naval Q Clearance as I was instructed in no uncertain terms that he does not (and which certain materials and subjects I am forbid to disclose even to Congress and the Courts- even the Military ones, who I am told will posess all they need to know and not more anyways should it ever be an issue) and I'd rationalize it's not the only one he does not posess. Areas 51 through 54 and other areas utilize a similiar Q clearance and the like so he can't access those areas or subjects either. If he thinks he can I openly declare more power to him, because, I know he can't and I'd openly invite him to tell me I'm wrong. Besides, as has been mentioned in this thread, other President's have had to ask. Whether they were granted access or not. They had to ask. Interesting for such an all powerful man that he has to ask, lobby, or appeal for such things. The head of an organized mob or crime syndicate would have just as much, if not better, luck. And ultimately, a man can only know as much as another man is willing to share with him, no matter how much they may be tortured or whatnot. Just look to prisoners of war for proof of that. Even CIA interrogaters confirm that an apathetic individual who is whole-heartedly convinced they will die either way may withhold vital data just out of spite as a final victory over the interogator, even if the interogator had no real intent on killing them. So, don't forget, educate yourself. The President is not as All Knowing as you or He may believe him to be. Even if he were, how would he organize all that data you suspect he has and still have enough time to parakeet all those ghost writers and handlers, travel, wine, dine, meet, greet, sign everything he does, all while still being debriefed and kept current and still finding time for friends, family, and all those meetings and hearings, and summits, etc. Get real, in the scheme of things, he's no Einstein. He's generally as clueless as the rest of us. No. He doesn't have blanket access or authority, save only as it serves the powers that be. He's a puppet in a play. Not the Director.

[edit on 8-1-2009 by PhyberDragon]

[edit on 8-1-2009 by PhyberDragon]

reply to post by PhyberDragon

---

I understand what you are saying and to a certain degree you are correct. The president is not a dictator as in other countries but still as "commander-and-chief" he/she would have the most access to any classified data *in theory*.

Basically:
Unconditional access=no
Conditional access=yes

The reason I emphasized in theory is because as you correctly stated normally presidents do not seek such information and if they do usually they are not allowed to disclose anything.

I think it is wise to assume that *in practice* high ranking cia and/or nsa officers would know much more about ufos and secret technology. Do you agree?

Thanks for the discussion!

[edit on 9-1-2009 by EarthCitizen07]

This is an interesting video but i believe there are far more than 25 people in the world that have CTS clearance (Nato Employees for one)

Will deffinately be doing some more research on this subject.

Good to see some rational thought on this thread.

How pray tell could any government function with a Chief Executive who doesn't have access to all the secrets.

Who is the man who is going to stand in the way of the President when he says I'm opening that door, or that file?