Changing Of The Guard 'Constitutional crisis' looming over Obama's birth location Alan Keyes laws, page 7

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reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:10 PM by Jay-in-AR

reply to post by redhatty

By the same token though, she could not renounce it and neither could his father. I still feel that this is an issue that would be up to the Supreme Court to decide through judicial interpretation.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:14 PM by SourGrapes

reply to post by Jay-in-AR

Again, the electoral college would decide the President. We wouldn't have another campaign, or 'run-off' with the others who lost their party's ticket.

If anything, the big issue will end up being whether this BC thing is resolved before or after the General Election in December. Not to mention; the potential impact these cases could have on the impressions, and end decisions of the electorates.

Already, it seems that a few of California's Electorates are siding with Keyes in requesting to see Obama's original certificates. This could potentially have a huge impact in California's electorate votes, and whether the electorates side with the popular vote or vote someone else, or even don't vote on that particular ticket.

Edited for horrible grammar

[edit on 16-11-2008 by SourGrapes]

[edit on 16-11-2008 by SourGrapes]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:19 PM by Jay-in-AR

I understand that the electorate can flip the coin on their voters, so to say. But I don't see that happening if the candidate in question is found ineligible. I doubt that the electorate would have the ultimate decision in that case.

I mean, if between now and Dec. 15th Obama is found ineligible, there wouldn't even be a decision for the electorate to make in regards to who the president would be. It would go to McCain by default.

[edit on 16-11-2008 by Jay-in-AR]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:19 PM by Benevolent Heretic

The Lawsuit (pdf)

Originally posted by Jay-in-AR
And when it WAS made an issue, McCain willingly gave up his information and had a team of lawyers ready to make sure that the McCain campaign was compliant with all laws. Obama has failed to provide the documents asked for, for reasons I don't quite understand.

But McCain isn't a member of a group that has been oppressed for his entire life. I'm not saying it's right, but I CAN understand how a black man would be hesitant to buckle to the demands of a bunch of people who don't support him, didn't vote for him, wouldn't in a million years and are trying to sully his good name just for the sake of politics. There's a part of Obama that the public doesn't know about all right. He doesn't take any crap. And I can definitely see him standing strong on this for the principal of the matter.

He's not hiding it because he has to. He's keeping it private because he can.

That's what I think he's doing, but we shall see.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:22 PM by razorvocals

Does anyone seriously think this is possible? I know I probably sound like the debunkers now. But don't you think they would have went through his past with a fine tooth comb in all the time he has been running? You can't get a post office job without a background check!

ETA I'm not saying it's not possible just not probable at this time.

[edit on 16-11-2008 by razorvocals]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:23 PM by Jay-in-AR

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I understand your point entirely and we'll have to agree to disagree on that one. I tried really hard going into this discussion with a level head, but my conspiracy based thinking is getting the better of me.

That being said, I still don't see how Obama could be guilty of conspiracy to defraud anyone. I would just assume this is being used to someone's benefit in some way or another that we don't understand and may never.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:25 PM by Spinoza73

Unbelievable, this thread still going strong.

I would expect this BC thing is one of those formalities to check before elections. And I believe it has been.

American mother, so what's the issue? Get a life!

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:28 PM by southern_Guardian

everytime I see these BC threads all I see is yet another bitter anti-Obamanian who just cant deal with reality.

Up there above the "interview with reptillian" thread in a conspiracy website, lets just say the arguement is less so.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:28 PM by HIFIGUY

Originally posted by razorvocals
Does anyone seriously think this is possible?

No. Not going to happen.

Take it to the bank.

Peace

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:28 PM by Jay-in-AR

reply to post by Spinoza73

"Get a life!"

What is it to ya'? Am I, or anyone else, not free to discuss whatever they may find important? Some people seem to be able to see this for what it actually is. A pivotal point in American History. Not only for the fact that we have elected Obama to the position, but that there MAY need to be some constitutional clarification on what it actually means to be qualified to be President.

But that's right, we're just to "move along" huh? Hey, what is going on over at American Idol headquarters? I heard some crazy broad killed herself outside Paula Abdul's house? Could you enlighten us?

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:28 PM by poet1b

This is a very real question that needs to be answered.

The only reasonable explanation for Obama not presenting his birth certificate to a court is that there is some problem with it, and a good chance that he was born in Kenya, and therefore might not be eligible to become POTUS.

Here is another article on the issue, as there is a case filed in Hawaii as well.

www.rightsidenews.com...

Mr. Obama and his Chicago crew have been very crafty in creating a cloud of confusion over the "abstract" that he furnished to FactCheck.org as a purported original birth certificate, when obviously it was nothing of the sort. Many millions of people were confused even though the term "abstract" was clearly visible on the FactCheck.org site (and even though FactCheck.org seems to have missed that significance, as well).

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:32 PM by SourGrapes

Originally posted by Spinoza73
Unbelievable, this thread still going strong.

I would expect this BC thing is one of those formalities to check before elections. And I believe it has been.

American mother, so what's the issue? Get a life!

Not necessarily.

Again, found this here:

(Good site)
presidentelect.org...-19

[snip]
Q:Why is there no mandated legal requirement for candidates to prove they are qualified to be president prior to nominating procedures?

A: The Constitution lays out the qualifications for President but doesn't seem to actually require any one to check up on them before hand! Congress can challenge the electoral votes of any candidate, but that is only after election day. The courts would appear to be the best avenue to go before an election, but judges are going to be reluctant to intervene in all but the most extreme cases. The parties themselves are the best place to ensure their candidates qualify, as they won't want to waste the time and money on a candidate who may later be disqualified. But they may not have a very open process and they won't necessarily have the best interests of the people in mind. The media should take a look at this issue were it to arise but with even the press becoming more partisan and each outlet seemingly taking sides for and against candidates they might not be that trusted by the populace anymore.

So basically we almost have to count on the honesty of the politicians themselves. Scary, huh?

[/snip]

Edit to fix the url

[edit on 16-11-2008 by SourGrapes]

[edit on 16-11-2008 by SourGrapes]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:34 PM by HIFIGUY

Originally posted by SourGrapes

Again, found this here:

(Good site)
presidentelect.org...-19" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">President Election FAQs

It appears that what you found is non existent, which is what this entire thread is about.

Peace

[edit on 16-11-2008 by HIFIGUY]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:35 PM by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by Jay-in-AR
I tried really hard going into this discussion with a level head, but my conspiracy based thinking is getting the better of me.

You've been TOTALLY level-headed in this discussion. People like you and SourGrapes make debating fun again.

I have all but lost hope for ATS lately and you show me that there are still people here that can debate without kindergarten antics.

So, thanks to both of you.

I still don't see how Obama could be guilty of conspiracy to defraud anyone.

I don't either. He was a State Senator for 8 years and a US Senator for 4. He has traveled the world, so required a passport, and has been in the public eye for MANY years. He has HAD to show his birth certificate to officials throughout his life.

Keyes has shown possible damages in his suit (IMO), so it might go through. It all depends on the judge.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:36 PM by Jenna

reply to post by HIFIGUY

I believe this was what the link was supposed to lead to.

Well, darn.. If you click that link then click the box that says "Election FAQs" and then scroll down to the 5th question listed that is where the question and answer is. Don't know why it wouldn't link right..

[edit on 16-11-2008 by Jenna]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:37 PM by HIFIGUY

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I have all but lost hope for ATS lately and you show me that there are still people here that can debate without kindergarten antics. So, thanks to both of you.

When you debate garbage, its still about garbage.

He has an American Mother. End of story.

Peace

[edit on 16-11-2008 by HIFIGUY]

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:40 PM by LucidDreamer85

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Does anyone know where I can find out exactly who would be President if Obama turns out ineligible ?

I know some say Biden would be President ..
But is there any chance at all that this could keep Bush in ?
Especially if Civil war happened over all of this ...

I have been thinking that all of this could have been the grand plan the whole time ..to start the coming martial law civil unrest situation ..(that TPTB would love to have happen) Problem,reaction,solution .

All of this is just so odd ..why didnt he just lay this to rest when he was just running as President ?Why did he go over there and have it sealed >?
Why is it still like a hanging chad persay over him right as he is about to take office ...

It all just seems strange to me....sort of like it was after 911 ..strange events that made no sense until after the Patriot Act passed and most of our rights were stripped and it became clear then as to why certain things happened ...(Like the Anthrax letters made them pass laws to go through mail etc).
Etc etc ...

[edit on 16-11-2008 by Simplynoone]

This is horrible to say but maybe it is part of the whole grand plan. Maybe they knew he wasn't really a citizen and it will come out right after he is in office. I'm guessing they are better on the black population in American to revolt and riot and that will start the martial law.
I could def see this scenario playing out all thought I hope to god it doesn't.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:40 PM by Jay-in-AR

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

I appreciate the kind words.

The way I see it is that there IS an issue here and the larger the issue becomes, the more necessary it will become for Obama to answer it.
I truly hope that he can answer these questions and that all will go smooth from here on out because I think he is poised to become one of the greatest Presidents in American History, but until then it looks like there is work to be done.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:42 PM by Jay-in-AR

reply to post by HIFIGUY

I don't think its that cut and dry, but thanks for the put down. I find it somewhat amusing that you would sign off each time by wishing everyone peace after you have insulted the people you are wishing good will.

reply posted on 16-11-2008 @ 03:48 PM by SourGrapes

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

You've been TOTALLY level-headed in this discussion. People like you and SourGrapes make debating fun again. I have all but lost hope for ATS lately and you show me that there are still people here that can debate without kindergarten antics. So, thanks to both of you.

Thanks for the comment!

I find this very interesting. While I may argue for showing the documents in question, I do believe this has the potential of being a very bad event for us.

I really do hope that he renders the documents and satisfies the court's inquiry (at the very least, as I know that many with still questions it's authenticity). This will not have a good ending, for any of us, if his Presidential qualifications are found to be 'questionable' and/or something other than qualified.

The interesting parts to all of this, and possibly the 'silver-lining' to all of this debating and arguing, is the research that it forces (some of us) to do. I mean, I'm still somewhat confused about the whole electoral college and some of the process; and I even took U.S. Constitutional Law in college.