SCOTUS petitioned for writ certiorari in Obama citizenship case, Obama to respond by Dec 1, page 2
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 43 times


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 10:51 PM by 12m8keall2c
Straight from the Source of this Political News shows it as little mOar than Political Views... Opinions.

therightperspective.com...
If The Supreme Court Decides...?

At this point, Supreme Court Justice David Souter's Clerk informed Philip J. Berg, the lawyer who brought the case against Obama, that his petition for an injunction to stay the November 4th election was denied, but the Clerk also required the defendants to respond to the Writ of Certiorari (which requires the concurrence of four Justices) by December 1. At that time, Mr. Obama must present to the Court an authentic birth certificate, after which Mr. Berg will respond.

If Obama fails to do that, it is sure to inspire the skepticism of the Justices, who are unaccustomed to being defied. They will have to decide what to do about a president-elect who refuses to prove his natural-born citizenship.

"I can see a unanimous Court (en banc) decertifying the election if Obama refuses to produce his birth certificate," says Raymond S. Kraft, an attorney and writer. "They cannot do otherwise without abandoning all credibility as guardians of the Constitution. Even the most liberal justices, however loathe they may to do this, still consider themselves guardians of the Constitution. The Court is very jealous of its power - even over presidents, even over presidents-elect."
*bold emphasis mine

Read through the above carefully. At no point do the claims and or assertions being made amount to anything more then conjecture, political perspectives and or individual opinion(s).


In all honesty, I have no dog in the fight per se, nor any vested or veiled interest either way. I guess it's just the oft and ill-mannered representations that chap my backside. This particular thread/title seeming just that... as the SCOTUS hasn't officially requested or ruled on Any aspect of Berg's "case".

... not that they won't or can't, they just haven't at this time.

headline News though, if only it were... as "claimed".


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:05 PM by TheAgentNineteen
Originally posted by Simulacra
beforetime,

Take heed to the ATS motto: Deny Ignorance

Here, I'll even help you...

Obama's Birth Certificate Verified By State -
www.kitv.com...

Obama's Birth Certificate - www.dailykos.com...

Born in the U.S.A. - The truth about Obama's birth certificate. - www.newsweek.com...

However you can still try to create a 'otherness' within President elect-Obama, a tactic that failed horribly for the GOP.


Might you try to read and comprehend facts a little more closely? The story from KITV in Hawaii involves the fact that the Director of the State Department of Health, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, confirmed that she was "sitting on" the "Authentic" Birth Certificate of Obama. However, she NEVER stated what was in fact on the Certificate, or how it compared to the already released Web-Version of Obama's Birth Certificate. She also stated that it could not, nor would not be released unless Obama himself requested it to be. Yet, he ALREADY released his Birth Certificate on the Web, and if that is in fact an Authentic representation of his actual Birth Certificate, then arguably he already granted permission for its release.

As for "DailyKos" and "Newsweek", those are both extremely liberal groups which have been in Obama's back pocket since day one. They both make MSNBC look decent.

As of yet, Obama has still failed to release the Vaulted Copy of his Birth Certificate, which is the action upon which many questions are raised. No Defendant in their right mind would intentionally withhold exonerating evidence, even more so when the admission of such would lead to a dropping of all charges and allegations immediately.


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:06 PM by Illusionsaregrander
Originally posted by Simplynoone
Would McCain be president or would Bush get to stay in and we have another election ?



No, I think the most likely scenario IF Obama were deemed unfit to be President, (which is not going to happen btw, do people really, really think no one checked ahead of time knowing all the hype about this issue?) by birth is that the Vice President would become President. Thats what would happen if any other event caused his inability to fulfill the role of President. Why would this be any different?

Edit to add;

Why isnt McCain's birth in question?

www.nytimes.com...

Almost since those words were written in 1787 with scant explanation, their precise meaning has been the stuff of confusion, law school review articles, whisper campaigns and civics class debates over whether only those delivered on American soil can be truly natural born. To date, no American to take the presidential oath has had an official birthplace outside the 50 states.

“There are powerful arguments that Senator McCain or anyone else in this position is constitutionally qualified, but there is certainly no precedent,” said Sarah H. Duggin, an associate professor of law at Catholic University who has studied the issue extensively. “It is not a slam-dunk situation.”


[edit on 9-11-2008 by Illusionsaregrander]


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:30 PM by Jenna
Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
No, I think the most likely scenario IF Obama were deemed unfit to be President, (which is not going to happen btw, do people really, really think no one checked ahead of time knowing all the hype about this issue?) by birth is that the Vice President would become President. Thats what would happen if any other event caused his inability to fulfill the role of President. Why would this be any different?

Edit to add;

Why isnt McCain's birth in question?

www.nytimes.com...

Almost since those words were written in 1787 with scant explanation, their precise meaning has been the stuff of confusion, law school review articles, whisper campaigns and civics class debates over whether only those delivered on American soil can be truly natural born. To date, no American to take the presidential oath has had an official birthplace outside the 50 states.

“There are powerful arguments that Senator McCain or anyone else in this position is constitutionally qualified, but there is certainly no precedent,” said Sarah H. Duggin, an associate professor of law at Catholic University who has studied the issue extensively. “It is not a slam-dunk situation.”


[edit on 9-11-2008 by Illusionsaregrander]


McCain's eligibility was questioned, but since he was born on a military installation to US citizens most say he qualifies as a natural-born citizen. As it says in the article you linked.

As for who the presidency would go to if Obama is deemed ineligible, wouldn't his ineligibility make the election null and void? I would think that it would either go to McCain by default or a new election would have to be held with a different Democrat on the ticket. Not too sure though..


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:33 PM by beforetime
reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Mcains was...he gave it to them to see lol

he was born from a military family
www.coxwashington.com...
The presumptive Republican nominee was born on Aug. 29, 1936 — not within the 50 United States, but in the Panama Canal Zone, where his father, a Navy officer, was stationed.


en.wikipedia.org...
John McCain, who ran for the Republican party nomination in 2000 and was the Republican nominee in 2008, was born at the Coco Solo U.S. military base in the Panama Canal Zone to U.S. parents. Although the Panama Canal Zone was not considered to be part of the United States,[5] federal law states: "Any person born in the Canal Zone on or after February 26, 1904, and whether before or after the effective date of this chapter, whose father or mother or both at the time of the birth of such person was or is a citizen of the United States, is declared to be a citizen of the United States."[6]


Mcain is legal already proved..


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:35 PM by Buck Division
Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
The most likely scenario IF Obama were deemed unfit to be President, is that the Vice President would become President.


Precisely correct.

The constitution of the USA actually has a clause that describes exactly what would happen if Obama was found ineligible to execute the office of the President:


In Case of the Removal of the President from Office, or of his Death, Resignation, or Inability to discharge the Powers and Duties of the said Office the Same shall devolve on the Vice President, and the Congress may by Law provide for the Case of Removal, Death, Resignation or Inability, both of the President and Vice President, declaring what Officer shall then act as President, and such Officer shall act accordingly, until the Disability be removed, or a President shall be elected.


In the case of Obama (as unlikely as I think it may be) it seems that Congress must agree that the President is unable to discharge his duties. and can remove this disability if it so chooses to.

Now -- how likely do you think it will be that the Congress will find Obama unable? Especially since it is the Congress who is the one who defines what "natural born" means? And Congress is mainly populated by Democrats, of Obama's party?

#

Worst case senario, Congress will rewrite the law to make an exception for Obama, or a general exception explaining "natural born" requires the mother to be a US citizen, period. That is what I personally think "natural born" should mean anyway (rather than being born on US soil.)

Most people will regard this as a mean and meaningless attack on Obama, if it happens. And I don't think it will happen.

But if it does, then this thread has been a true revelation and truly prophetic, and all my time at ATS has been well spent!


reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:40 PM by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by beforetime



Yes, I knew that part. The legal question that has not been challenged is whether or not anyone born on foreign soil meets the requirements of a "natural born citizen."

He is unquestionably a citizen. However no President to date has been born on foreign soil and so the matter has never been settled with finality.

Most legal scholars agree that he should be ok, but, as the article states, it is not a sure bet. Or as they phrase it, a "slam dunk" case. Because "natural born" was not defined in the Constitution, it is not as open and shut as you seem to be making it sound.

I do think, personally, that it would be decided in his favor, but it just strikes me odd that so many are making such a big deal out of Obama when McCain is not a sure bet either.



reply posted on 9-11-2008 @ 11:48 PM by Simulacra
Originally posted by TheAgentNineteen
As of yet, Obama has still failed to release the Vaulted Copy of his Birth Certificate, which is the action upon which many questions are raised.


HONOLULU -- The state's Department of Health director on Friday released a statement verifying the legitimacy of Sen. Barack Obama birth certificate.
www.kitv.com...

What else is there to prove? How are you going to spin this to your bias intention?

You would think that the GOPs attempt to attach an 'otherness' or quasi-mccarthyism to Obama would stop with its horribly failed attempt this election season.

Ah well, luckily America is filled with people, just like yourself, that encourage ignorance and spread falsehood and doubt.
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