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Same-sex marriage ban wins; opponents sue to block measure

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posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 03:28 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 





For clarity - - when exactly did CA designate English only?


It was never accepted because it was deemed unconstitutional but it was voted on in 1986 that English be the 'official language' and it passed with flying colors. I believe there were many other states that voted on English as the official language the same year.

And it benefits everyone to have a common language. Communication is a very important tool in any society.

Jemison




posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by knows_but_doesnt
You wanted a fight, you got a fight, and we took it right home. You WILL NEVER EVER, EVER EVER, EVER win this fight, EVER.


Actually they didn't want a fight...they just want equal rights...

And you sound like you are trying to convince yourself...

Because I think most of the people in this country and on this forum know how wrong you are.

People will NEVER EVER, EVER, stop fighting for their rights.

THIS WILL NEVER GO AWAY. And they will "win" eventually.

But when they win, we ALL win. They are fighting for personal freedom. Today it is sexual orientation, yesterday it was race, tomorrow who knows what it will be.

But the point is, people will never stop fighting for their right to live and be them self. And you think they will lose forever?

People are becoming more enlightened everyday, the world will only become more and more accepting and rational.


Comments like this -

'Better to just accept issues than to deal with them' unfortunately is where the world has lost its way, in its inability to be honest with itself"

- remind me of something

The people who argue against us, they are not our enemies they are our brothers.

All the people who argue that homosexuality is a choice, well maybe for them, it COULD BE a choice...

I won't get into specifics but my point is this...

I argue for this cause, but I have nothing personally associated with it, I would argue for any PERSONAL FREEDOM.

BUT, for those who argue against this cause, it is possible they DO have some "personal" issue with it.

So keep that in mind, even in a debate like this where it seems so blatantly obvious, remember we are all on the same side.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 03:42 PM
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reply to post by DocMoreau
 



If same-sex marriages follow the path of straight-sex marriages, take heart in the fact the reunions won't be around long enough to injure very many young minds.
Straight-sex marriages seem to start to crumble shortly following the mother-in-law assessing who her daughter married.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 03:43 PM
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Originally posted by Jemison
reply to post by Annee
 





For clarity - - when exactly did CA designate English only?


It was never accepted because it was deemed unconstitutional but it was voted on in 1986 that English be the 'official language' and it passed with flying colors. I believe there were many other states that voted on English as the official language the same year.

And it benefits everyone to have a common language. Communication is a very important tool in any society.

Jemison


I am aware. Just in-case that is an issue.

www.connectforkids.org...

I actually support "Speak what's on the Money" - as in the best interest of individual or student.

I don't necessarily support at mandate.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 03:47 PM
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Full Equal Rights is also a tool in any society.

The constitution is in place to protect the minority in adverse of majority.

Religious reasons or not - - MAJORIY of descent against gay marriage is religious based.

The minority shall be protected.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:14 PM
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Look Folks - Like it or not, we live in a Democracy where the majority of the people who live here get to decide what is right and wrong, and THE MAJORITY HAS SPOKEN....now its time (with the passing of Prop 8 and its predecessor in 2000) to come together behind the new law and MOVE ON. Do you see the 48% of the voters across the Country who voted for McCain protesting in the streets like spoiled little children who didn't get their way because their "side" didn't win? Even in an extremely liberal state and even with all the bullying from gay activists this LAW still passed. What that means is that the MAJORITY of people who live in California think this is WRONG. Now YOU have to learn to live with it - if you don't like it, move to a state where this is a practice that is accepted BY THE MAJORITY. You don't deserve - nor should you receive - ANY special treatment because of your sexual preference.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by Annee

Religious reasons or not - - MAJORIY of descent against gay marriage is religious based.


Ummm....

Errr...

Am I misunderstanding you right? "Its religious whether its religious or not"?



TheRedneck



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:23 PM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 


Thank you for your reasoned intelligent analysis .It may suprise you to hear I agree with you nearly 100% . But unfortunately ,while you and I sip tea on the porch , innocent civilians in other countries are having their basic rights run in to the dirt . And the way things are going the US faces the same ignominious end unless enough people wake up .

There are no winners in war , but humans have a nasty tendency to hear what they want to hear and see what they want to see until their complacency and greed comes around and bites them in the ass .

Greed and self indulgence has been encouraged in the US for so long now. The fed has been throwing cheap money at you and you have grasped it with open arms , not thinking about the consequences of spending your country in to debt slavery .

Most will not admit the obvious ,so they will look now for someone to blame . Prop 8 is a psy op ,a carefully crafted one to. But if your gov is prepared to orchestrate 911 to start a war in iraq , what will they do next to 're unite ' your people ?

When the crap hits the fan ,there's always a fall guy , or in this case the fall gays .

Diplomacy is great , I will always favour diplomacy over war . But when the people reject peace and project the blame on to an enemy thats been painted for them ,they dont listen to reason or common sense. The US is bankrupt , it can never hope to repay its debts . So they will declare war on their creditors to unite the people behind a 'common cause' and voila !
You gityerself a fascist dictatorship Bubba .

Eventually there comes a point where the only language such people understand is a negotiator with a bigger stick .

When Ego is encouraged it is at the expense of common sense . When the people refuse to live simple humble lives close to the earth and mother nature they no longer live in harmony with themselves or anyone else . A large part of humanity is now a rabbit plague on the face of this planet . Hetrosexual reproduction is what drives it ! Normality becomes abnormal.

If you live beyond your means it will always come back to haunt you . Sustainability my friend has gone out the window and when the grim reaper see's mother crying out for help he attends . Thats the way it works in a balanced universe .

No ,if anything homosexuality has a welcome limiting effect on excessive reproduction. The catholic church does not forbid condoms because its a sin , they do so because they want a large ignorant exploitable mass of people to do their dirty work for them . Wage slaves many of whom will never get their social security back because G dubya already spent 18 billion of it on this damn fool war in Iraq.

I love your country , I spent many happy years there and made many good friends . REAL americans because they kept it real and refused to buy in to the greed machine . They are the ones who will get through this because they know how to get by instead of buying in to the lie.

I dread the thought of another major war because I know what sort of bio weapons may be deployed to control the population .Terrible things my friend , heart rendingly terrible . I have seen what happens when the heart of darkness is deployed . The more desperate and angry the populace is ,the better this weapon works and to witness it is to break down in to a flood of despairing tears .



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:24 PM
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posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:25 PM
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reply to post by Jezus
 


Well spoken my friend ,well spoken .



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:36 PM
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reply to post by Saf85
 


here here



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:41 PM
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calling homosexuals a minority is foolish.

do even know what that means? legaly big corparations would have to employ equal amounts of homosexuals as straits,

if a majority white is gay? hes a minority?

what about a black homosexual?

is he doubly a minority?!

no! a black, white asian person is not made a minority by there sexual preference,

legally thats ridiculus



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:41 PM
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The only reason this bill was even proposed was due to the success for GLBTs in Massachusetts. And my belief is that serious covert moneys (private and "public") were used to achieve this "win" through PR (propaganda). SAD!!!!



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:51 PM
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Has the "revision" thing been addressed yet? A lawsuit's been filed because the dramatic alteration of the constitution involving the elimination of the rights of a minority may be more than an amendment. Prop 8 may actually be a revision which requires 2/3 of the state legislature.


Nevertheless, there are good reasons for the California Supreme Court to rethink its jurisprudence in this area. Even if Proposition 8 does not "substantially alter the basic governmental framework," there is no question that it targets a historically vulnerable group and eliminates a very important right. Changing the Constitution -- the state's paramount law -- in such a momentous way arguably calls for deliberative rather than direct democracy. Indeed, as early as the nation's founding, our constitutional tradition has favored representative democracy over simple majority rule when it comes to deciding minority rights.


www.latimes.com...

Also, check

www.latimes.com...

Majority rule is very dangerous when it directly affects a group of minorities, let's hope this works.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 04:52 PM
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I never thought watching 'broke back mountain' would affect me the way it did . But a more brutally honest and realistic film you will not see .
It does not spare anybody . It shows hetro /homo relationships in all their beauty and tragedy . but in the end the message is as simple as it is clearly stated , love IS a force of nature . When it happens to you , there is no fighting it without destroying yourself.

I have lived and worked with people just like those two main characters . I have seen how brutal and cruel peoples homophobia can be . I have had psuedo hetro sexual cowboys hit on me after a few to many drinks ! They hate themselves for feeling that way and thay hated me even more for politely saying 'no thanks'. It was a good job I was well built and able to defend myself . Its tough being a desirable hunk of man meat ! Seriously , when they cant have you , you know what they do to get physical another way ? yep ,they pick a bar fight with you to prove their manhood ! How dumb is that ?

Denial and hate is not a force of nature , its a rejection of love .

Prop 8 is a rejection of the right of gay people to commit to a marriage because they want to express and commit to love instead of surfing for casual sex . You would think that would be encouraged wouldnt you ?

But when you have a lot of macho pigs in denial no amount of reasoning will get through.

Looking back I have been shocked to realise how many of my good male friends did in fact entertain the desire to sleep with me . Its funny ,because my radar was always scanning for babes so I did not notice at the time . I think a lot of men are BI as much as gay but thats where I do shake my head in despair cos a lot of gay men see BI's as traitors ! Where's the logic in that ?



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 05:10 PM
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posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 05:31 PM
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reply to post by mproject
 


Minority: the smaller in number of two groups constituting a whole ; specifically : a group having less than the number of votes necessary for control

The term is correct.

[edit on 11-11-2008 by rapinbatsisaltherage]



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 05:32 PM
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I wish someone could explain to me how gay people getting married is (as fundamentalist say) "An assault on marriage" Regardless, one can't use their personal religious beliefs to deny others equal rights. Separation of church and state and all that? If gay people want to commit themselves in marriage, I think it's great thing.

There was a time black people were denied equal rights. Don't people ever learn? Freedom and equality is for everyone.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by Annee

Religious reasons or not - - MAJORIY of descent against gay marriage is religious based.


Ummm....

Errr...

Am I misunderstanding you right? "Its religious whether its religious or not"?



TheRedneck


I believe what I implied is Majority. The majority reason against same sex marriage is religious based.



posted on Nov, 11 2008 @ 06:00 PM
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reply to post by Jezus
 


I doubt anyone could have put it even a hair better. Take a look there folks because for those of you that are misunderstanding the issue at hand as personal opinion/preference for yourself,maybe for your kids,etc. jezus lays it out better than we could have hoped.



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