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posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 02:50 PM
reply to post by capgrup

my husband was in the air force for 23 years. i served those 23 years right next to him, when i had to help prepare mobility bags, answer phone calls at 3 in the morning, and deal with the problems related to being a military family, most of which were alot worse than you ever saw (and you can take that to the bank!).

i will say what i want to say, when i want to say it. you got that? GOOD!

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 02:54 PM

Originally posted by Ismail
Marx clearly states that communism is INTENDED to be nothing more than a transitionary governement, which is put in place to offer to the people the single most important thing Marx ever talked about : education. He believed that when the people were sufficiantly educated and cultivated, as individuals and as a society, then the communist state would become obsolete, allowing the transition to what we call anarchy : a coalition of many seperate communities, naturally operating in harmony for the well being of the said "enlightened" and cultivated individuals.

Yet when people outright reject Communism, you view it as an attack against Marx... that's pretty retarded if you ask me. Just because Marx intend Communism as a transitional government, does not mean that the system is in some way credible, or has be exculpated of its obvious flaws. Marx was highly principled, and his ideas seemed to be a reality during his time, which was characteristic of a paradigm shift from country to nation-state, where the extension of the vote among other social institutions was of great excitement to the general populace of many nations. Unfortunately, that great experiment FAILED. Stalin's emulation of Communism wasn't a result of personality flaw or conflicted self interest. You can't argue that any other leader at any other time would have done it better.

The failure of Communism WAS a RESULT of a far reaching scientific test. It tested human nature; it tested basic economic principles on a massive scale. That's where people are justified in their absolute disgust and rejection for this system. It has been empirical proven to be insufficient. Any attempt to revive Communism is both irresponsible and a detriment to both scientific and societal progress.

Social enlightenment is a Capitalistic endeavor. Wealth isn't created out of the benevolence of any particular party, but out of the self interest of each and every individual component of market and society. A well regulated free market is the best direction; it's simply an extension of human nature. On the other hand, Communism and command economics attempt to adjust for human nature, assuming we are all machines and superior intellectual entities. That Utopian ideal is outdated and outmoded.

[edit on 5-11-2008 by cognoscente]

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 02:58 PM
reply to post by undo

Do you have a source saying it dropped from $250k? I haven't heard anything about that.

I understand that times are tough but that’s what redistributing the wealth it all about. It’s not the people who need the money who will be losing it all to taxes.

Sure, in some cases sacrifices will have to be made. But that’s the problem when you have a large amount of people living above their means to begin with.

Again, look a Canada. We still work hard, we still have an entrepreneurial spirit, we still make money, we are still well off (some of us, at least). We pay a lot in taxes but we still have BMWs and Rolexes and fancy homes and private schools and all the fun things you guys have. All living in a socialist state.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:01 PM
I knew based on the picking of the presidental canidates that this election would be the last one we would even had and I have to agree with the orginal poster. I did not read every responce but I have a good idea on how people feel about what just took place.

We have a failed congress, a failed country and the only way were going to get out of it is we are going to have to fight to the death seriously. A moment's outcome might amuse a audience but it changes nothing in the short or long term. When people start to see some of the things obama is going to start doing I believe that is the time when we will start to see a large uprising.

As such I have prepared for just this very event on my signature I have posted How to avoid the repo man and why I would take the time to post it here on ats I dont want to create a scene. The page on how to avoid the repo man on my blog will show us all what steps we can take to avoid some of the things headed our way before mr. obama and crew and I quote "redistribute the wealth".

Well mr obama and repo man and women get ready because there are some of us who have watched and waited for such times to come about sooner or later there will be such a backlash that the media will no longer be able to cover it up instead they are going to be using there microphone cords to strangle running people rioting in the streets over the loss of more then just there houses.

If you have wealth of anykind im not premoting mywebsite here I am giving you a out of what to do with your wealth before its too late.


Visit my link to fight the repo man.

Fight the power

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:02 PM
post removed because the user has no concept of manners

Click here for more information.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:06 PM
reply to post by centralscrutinizer

hahah i love seeing uneducated people on here who are atleast funny in their dumbfoundedness

you think bush won twice on his persona? hahaha try his bs, which completely failed and still is

thanks for the laugh of your rational thinking and ignorance

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:06 PM

Originally posted by rickyrrr

Almost true.

White americans chose mcCain 55% to 43%. Whether that is fair or not may be a valid point of discussion, but white americans did not give obama more support than they did McCain.

My source is the CNN exit polls.

Yes, race was an issue and yes, black americans voted overwhelmingly for obama. But white americans did not support Obama.


I never said white Americans gave more support to Obama. I said white Americans were balanced while blacks were not.



And this was not only in the general election, but it also happened in the primaries as well.

[edit on 5-11-2008 by RetinoidReceptor]

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:07 PM

I know exactly what you are talking about. I was raised in the military. I knew from a very early age living in the Fulda Gap what the deal was and what exactly it meant.

My point is this. It is not fun nor is it acceptable ever being called or ever calling someone else un-American or questioning their patriotism for having the temerity to ever question anything. No one; myself included ever said that you should not ask questions of your government but the man has not even taken the oath of office yet.

And you have my sincere thanks for your and your families service. Military families pay a higher price than anyone else ever knows.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:07 PM
reply to post by DazedDave

the laws require we live above our means. if we don't, we are in violation of the laws and we lose our property, our chidren, our pets, and so on. the standard of living and the laws to support it, are much higher than the income to pay for it. we are required by law to have car insurance. the prices are outrageous. we are required by law in many states, to maintain low emission cars, which are inspected every year for emissions and safety standards. people who are poor spend all year paying to fix their old car so it meets the standards for the next sticker year. this goes on and on.

you raise their utility bills, someone's not going to have utilities.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:08 PM
If you were in the military, regardless of your opinion, your doing your job whether you like the new leader appointed over you or not.

In this particular case, we have a nation thats been run into the ground.

The overwhelming ground swell of International approval as well as Americas hope within, is a shining light of change that is a stark contrast from the current commander and chief.

What comes from a persons mouth is an overflow of their hearts. The hatred that I see here in some posts does nothing but sow seeds of divide.

Lets walk together, rather then not walk at all. Your family is my family whether we know each other or not.

Jesus said, Love one another. Its the right way. This hatred is getting real old real fast.


[edit on 5-11-2008 by HIFIGUY]

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:09 PM
reply to post by undo

Cars are a luxury item to begin with.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:10 PM
double post

[edit on 5-11-2008 by DazedDave]

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:11 PM

Originally posted by mattguy404
reply to post by AHostileMe

From what I can tell, the Republicans were big on deregulation.

The deregulated market led to this meltdown, and it happened under the 8 year watch of Bush, so who exactly else can you blame.

It wasn't deregulation, because if the democrats hadn't pushed for low income morons who had no business getting mortgages, then there wouldn't have been the foreclosures that led to this mess. So it was a combination of the greed of some and the incompetence of others, and America just voted for incompetence.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:15 PM
i would rather a socialist country where all are equal than a country where a war vet and a gun tooting soccer mum run the country.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:15 PM

Originally posted by Gateway You are considered selfish by Socialist because you want to keep the fruits of your labor.

This is the paradox that socialist will not own up to; they call you selfish, meanwhile since they take the fruits of your labor at the threat of prison or worse at gun point, they don't SEE IT AS THEFT.

And that's what it is THEFT.

But the paradox of what the republicans won't own up to is the revolving door the small mom and pop shops are put on. Trickle down works if you want lower prices, but quality suffers because there is no competition.
There can be no competition when the big boys are given all the breaks while those who are starting from scratch are having to increase their prices to cover all the start up fees as well as keep up with all what the bigger boys are getting breaks on.

I MISS all the mom and pop shops around here. They were put out of business because of wal-mart (a company that has proven time and again to care more about $$ than people). While I don't feel they should have their earnings deducted from and/or requirements put into place of how they run their company, I do feel that smaller businesses should be given breaks as well to help them succeed so that I, the customer, can choose to go for the quality products and personal relationship with the store owner rather than having to settle for the cheap crap put out by a store whose cashier won't even smile at me.

I trust people when I can get to know them and see that they are worthy of being trusted. How can I trust that what I am bringing into my home around my children is made with their safety and health in mind when I can't even get the same cashier in the store?

What people are trying to get across to those who have been stubborn and unwilling to understand is that they are not trying to take from YOU, they are trying to help those LIKE you so that you can have the choice of going to someone you trust for services rather than being limited to getting raped on quality and eventually price (because when they run all the small businesses out, trust me, the big boys will raise the price of the *snip* they are selling you).

[edit on 5-11-2008 by justamomma]

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:16 PM
Nice, the majority of American's made their decision and didn't choose your guy... so it's a sign of the apocalypse!?!? Neither candidate was an ideal choice, but I whole heartedly believe we chose the lesser of two evils. I liked McCain in the previous election, but this time around... He seemed so out of it. What happened? Either way, we have a new president elect. We just have to hope he doesn't screw up and that he doesn't get assassinated or killed in an "accident". He has hinted that he might go after Bush for his bad decisions.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:17 PM
reply to post by HIFIGUY

it isn't about hatred. it's about telling us we are going to pay more for everything. he didnt' just say the rich people. he said utilities, as well. and he doesn't want to let us generate any type of leverage for energy, so we are trapped by whatever oil prices end up at. this was the problem over the last year. the oil prices skyrocketed and no one could afford to drive. truck drivers couldn't afford to deliver their products. the prices of everything went up because oil did. it's like the spice in DUNE. it's controlling the whole damn planet and it's impoverishing people to boot. it's not like we can just toss it aside and walk to work. this isn't japan, where you can ride your bike to your job. most people live more than 15 miles away from their jobs. it's just bad. it's just bad.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:18 PM
reply to post by DemonicAngelZero

will you read the commentary please! quit with the fake crap. this isn't about obama. it's about obama's plan.

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:19 PM

posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 03:24 PM

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