And I am okay with it. I would at this point, on this day of the 2008 Presidential Election, to remind everyone here that this is indeed a conspiracy website. While I respect and commend our many members for their participation regarding the decision of our government, I must respectfully disagree that the election is not fixed.

It is irrelevant as to whether or not Obama or McCain wins. They are both humans who have enjoyed the attention of various political and corporate interaction and as well enjoy a higher standard of living than the Average American. Good for them, and while I am aware that 'individual success' is a good indicator with regards to the efficacy of ones expression, I do not hold it to be true in this particular case.

There is a lot at stake here...the attention of arguably the strongest national superpower in the world.

My question to the membership is this:

Why do you think that the 'Powers That Be' would accept any percentage of chance regarding the leadership of this nation?

My follow up is this:

Why is it then relevant to place a vote for one of two individuals likley conditioned and prepped for the role of such a vaunted position?

Please keep this thread on topic. My questions are clear and I am indeed curious to hear response from the membership, but as 'civil duty' is a vehemently cherished concept in some regions, I feel the need to remind everyone to remain within the Terms and Conditions of this site when 'judging me' for neglecting my 'civil duty'.

Thank you.

I Abstain In 2008: The Second American Revolution

You're certainly not the only one to feel that way. It's my belief that any Republican or Democratic candidate is so tied and beholden to their respective political parties, which are in turn controlled by special interests and other elements, that it makes no difference which one really wins. You'll just get a different flavor of lies and BS. I thought about not voting. But I'll go out and vote for independent candidates despite the fact they have little or no chance of winning. If I had to travel further than a couple of blocks to vote... I'd probably just sit my butt at home and not bother.

Ya, neither did I. I never have. There has never, in my lifetime, been someone worthy to be in a position of authority over me who writes laws and directs the enforcement of them that I considered worth my vote of judgement or confidence.



No matter how great the person, they do not ever express any where that they really know anything. Eff em', I say. Like Bushy said about the Constitution - "It's just a piece of paper." (in reference to how I view university degrees and other frivolous documents - if that piece of paper means something then maybe educated people wouldn't act so...degenerativly.)



Bleh, and I am a hypocritic moron...I did serve in the military once upon a time.

I can't blame anyone for not voting if they don't like the presidential candidates, but you know there are other things to vote for.

What about all the local politicians and issues that directly effect you?

My .02

If you didn't vote, then don't complain. Ballots have a space where you can "write in" anyone you choose so you don't have to pick the lesser of the two evils.

MS,
I would ask then, given your stance, what do you put your energy towards regarding change?

As for me, I feed on the hope of the future. If I am hopeful then I am productive, if I am not hopeful, then I am not at all productive.

All reality is truly subjective, and so I "use my illusion" to increase my subjective experience. Which is why I am currently so manically optimistic. I don't live five years from now, so the optimism I have now fuels the productivity of today. The process of voting serves the purpose of being the physical manifestation of my desires, and the joy I will take from the outcome tonight will also further my motivation to being of more service to my fellow man and those around me, even if it is "all a sham".

I'm curious though, I know that you probably have an analog to this, what might that be? What rituals do you perform which inspire you to higher states of evolution?

As always, I appreciate your objectivity.

I am right there with you. I DID NOT VOTE EITHER! This is not about giving up my personal freedom this is about not playing the game. Sooooo many people do not realize what is really going on here. Voting has been pointless since ford. What we have to do is start at a local level in our own cities and towns that is where you can still make somewhat of a difference. The whole presidency thing is nothing but a fraud. and those that are playing along are being fooled beyond their wildest dreams. It's very sad. But it takes so much to get to the truth that it is no wonder so many are unaware.

I can't deny or disagree with both your questions, whoever wins the election the PTB will still be in control and the only difference this time is that there might be a president who can give a speech without listening to his earpiece for the next line. BUT.... I have to disagree with not voting, my reasons!! well i believe that its not just about who gets to be the next president/prime minister, its about the process. many people died in the fight to get everyone the vote, i believe the actual process of getting up and going out to vote is paying a debt and showing respect to people who decided that their government was wrong and done something about it. as for the actual vote, last election here i deliberately invalidated the ballot by crossing both boxes, i felt better because i paid my debt and didn't vote for any of them.

What's great about your decision is that it's " your decision". Hopefully someday everyone will recognize that it takes a country not a President to fix our problems. It takes responsibility, hard work and determination for an individual to make it in these times. It will take the people to take the time to evaluate themselves and become their own leader. You're right about the conditioning and preparation it takes to be president so why can't we do that too? Thanks for making your decision without someone telling you what to do.

reply to post by SuperSecretSquirrel

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Unless you live in my state where, despite the write in line, it's only counted in certain counties for local races :-(

Well, on the bright side MS you do save quite a bit of money on bumper stickers that way. No worries about having to scrape off "Somewhere in Texas a Villiage is Missing Their Idiot" for " Obama: Kenyan for 'Bad Idea'" when you can simply buy "Don't Blame Me, I Didn't Vote for Him" in bulk at a discount.

It's not just these times for allot of people, otherwise we wouldn't have "poor" people. You are right we have to work together with no factional bias - it's just different opinions until someone goes and starts an organization I think.

Yep, had I gone to the local votes I still couldn't vote for my right was Canceled. (now I know - didn't get a letter that was mailed to me when I was away from home and I didn't think to look into my eligibility or whatever :dn

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I will complain. Personally, I think the system is both flawed and constructed in such a fashion as to dissuade the avaerage voter to actually think about the issues.

Just listen to the speeches and debates. All based in idealogical expression without any attention to the specifing how policy will effect various regions; there is no real attention to the heart of any issue save to express in a manner that will appeal to the most voters.

I ask ATS this question:

If the entire campaign season is designed from both major parties merely to appeal to the desires of an average (and arguably ignorant to the issues) voter, then does it really make any difference what happens after the election?

My point is that the campaigns are designed to tell the people what they want to hear. Actions during office seem to be be a different story...

So, in summation, I will complain, because I don't think the issue is with which 'president' we get. The issue is how our political structure communicates with the population.

That cliche is now put to rest, in my opinion.

If 90% of the population abstains from voting, then you have allowed 10% of the population to make the decision for you. I vote because I don't want anyone making the decision for me. I don't think you can make a significant impact unless you get 100% to not vote.

Vote 3rd party!

What! Their are voters out there that shouldn't complain. Those who take no responsibility for their life. Those living off government and making babies they can't afford but yet they can vote.

No !" not voting " has nothing to do with complaining. If I decided not to vote but work my butt off and pay taxes and do all I can do to support my family and keep this economy going then I have a right to complain anytime I like. To many people have fought and died for this country to be denied a voice because they didn't vote.

reply to post by secretstash

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Yes, but on the national level, 0% of us are actually making the decision. The electorial college is making the decision for us. So even if you 100% voter abstention, a president would be chosen.

More proof of a 2 sides of the same coin system.

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Article on Zbigniew Brezinski
www.newswithviews.com...


"That is correct. Lifelong Marxist Zbigniew Brzezinski – David Rockefeller’s Prime Minister - controls both sides of the forthcoming charade through his sons. Again, you can relax. It really makes no difference who wins. "


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Never voted, never have and never will.. ANARCHY RULES.. Wiki "anarchy" for a better understanding of its ideals.


"Democracy is like two lambs and a wolf voting on whats for dinner." Ben Franklin



[edit on 4-11-2008 by TheRealDonPedros]

reply to post by Solarskye

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agree completely. Anyone who pays taxes has a right to voice their complaints. Although that in and of itself raises a serious issue with our nation having ignored the Constitution where taxation is concerned. "No taxation without representation." My so-called "representatives" do NOT represent me or my interests, yet I am still forced to pay taxes. *Please pay no attention to the conflicting nature of our government vs what the Founding Fathers laid the foundations for!*